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How the hell did we get on this irrelevant calculator tangent?
There are posters here who will try to hit me over the head with anything. You should have seen it coming, lol.
IMO, I would have sent the wrong message if I'd pandered to dd#1 being selfish this weekend. I'm kind of proud of myself. Too many times, in the past, I've gone out and bought dd#2 what she needed because dd#1 didn't want to share. Dd#1 needs to learn to share and care about others. Whether she likes it or not, she needs to realize this is not all about her. I fear for her if she doesn't learn that lesson before she leaves home.
It's actually ok. She huffed about needing the calculator, even though we all knew she didn't and slept until 1:00, claiming she might as well because she couldn't study but she got over it and I didn't have to buy a $200 calculator for dd#2.
You ever consider WHY she doesn't want to share? Maybe because she feels like DD2 already gets all the love, all the praise, all the admiration, and she doesn't. Maybe holding onto a calculator she didn't need was her way of holding on to something, because she feels like she doesn't have enough. It seems she's behaving so negatively because perhaps she'll take negative attention over no attention at all. And even though this may not be reality, it may be HER reality, because it is her perception.
You ever see a kid who has suffered through being hungry, not having enough food? Even when they have plenty, they shovel food in their mouths like someone is going to snatch it from them. They hide food. They don't want to "share." They have to be in place where they KNOW that they'll never go hungry again before they can let go of that behavior. To get to that place takes a lot of consistency and reassurance, or "pandering," if you will. Forcing them to share would be counterproductive. It may solve the immediate issue, but what it would really be doing is dismissing their fears, their experiences, their feelings, and to them, focusing more on the one you care about most, which would do what besides make them continue their behavior? Once they feel secure, THEN they can begin working on sharing. Maybe this is like your DD. When she feels secure, she'll be more than happy and willing to share with her sister. Why wouldn't you want to do whatever it takes to make that happen?
Wow, Anna. This is the best post I've read in a long a time. This needs to be repeated over and over...such wonderful words. Ivory, take note.
There are posters here who will try to hit me over the head with anything. You should have seen it coming, lol.
IMO, I would have sent the wrong message if I'd pandered to dd#1 being selfish this weekend. I'm kind of proud of myself. Too many times, in the past, I've gone out and bought dd#2 what she needed because dd#1 didn't want to share. Dd#1 needs to learn to share and care about others. Whether she likes it or not, she needs to realize this is not all about her. I fear for her if she doesn't learn that lesson before she leaves home.
It's actually ok. She huffed about needing the calculator, even though we all knew she didn't and slept until 1:00, claiming she might as well because she couldn't study but she got over it and I didn't have to buy a $200 calculator for dd#2.
Please forget about the calculator! Do you really see that as a major accomplishment? You won a power struggle. Is that what you want, or do you want to help your dd find a solution to her problems? You can't see that your own child is not happy? Doesn't that break your heart, or are you too busy patting yourself on the back over a calculator?
Only a professional can help here. You don't get it. So, so many people have shared thoughtful, helpful advice and opinions. You're still talking about a freaking calculator. Your child is in trouble. This really isn't the time for you to prove how tough you are, or to feel the need to prove you are right and she isn't.
I don't even know your dd and never will, but I feel so bad for her. I can't imagine why you seem so disconnected, but like I said, it's nothing that anybody on an internet forum can help with, especially when you just don't get it.
Wow--this thread makes me sad. I am seeing where my older daughter may have been heading. She seems to have a number of traits similar to the OP's oldest daughter. My daughter also tends to blame other people for her problems. However, she is getting better and better with time. Some of that only occurred because I changed. I remember when she was younger I tended to be too impatient and annoyed with her too often. I didn't understand the way she ticks and was afraid she would not be able to function in society. In many cases, the problems grew worse because of my tone of voice talking to her and my feelings of frustration.
Academic and psychological testing did help me understand her. I also had to learn to calm myself internally better. I could not let her tantrums bother me all the time. I was able to remain at peace much more frequently and explain the way the world operates to her. She started to get much better when I changed. I remember once back in second grade she had a massive meltdown over a homework assignment. She was hysterical, and I was amazed that I was as calm as a cucumber. We didn't have too many tantrums like that after that night. I seemed to cross some bridge where I wasn't taking her tantrum as some sign of my parenting failure. Instead I handled it like an intriguing problem that needed my help. My daughter needed to work through her fears (and maybe recover from some of my previous parenting), and I needed to be there to reassure her and try to help her.
I am hoping the OP can somehow find a place a calmness from where she can better help her daughter. I have seen foster parents practically move mountains to turn around teenage foster children with far greater problems. The best foster parent I ever met never raised her voice, was very together and loving, but still firm. No matter what her kids did, she seemed to be able to hold it together. She was amazing, and it was amazing to see how those kids changed. If you can see someone like that in action, they are an inspiration.
Wow--this thread makes me sad. I am seeing where my older daughter may have been heading. She seems to have a number of traits similar to the OP's oldest daughter. My daughter also tends to blame other people for her problems. However, she is getting better and better with time. Some of that only occurred because I changed. I remember when she was younger I tended to be too impatient and annoyed with her too often. I didn't understand the way she ticks and was afraid she would not be able to function in society. In many cases, the problems grew worse because of my tone of voice talking to her and my feelings of frustration.
Academic and psychological testing did help me understand her. I also had to learn to calm myself internally better. I could not let her tantrums bother me all the time. I was able to remain at peace much more frequently and explain the way the world operates to her. She started to get much better when I changed. I remember once back in second grade she had a massive meltdown over a homework assignment. She was hysterical, and I was amazed that I was as calm as a cucumber. We didn't have too many tantrums like that after that night. I seemed to cross some bridge where I wasn't taking her tantrum as some sign of my parenting failure. Instead I handled it like an intriguing problem that needed my help. My daughter needed to work through her fears (and maybe recover from some of my previous parenting), and I needed to be there to reassure her and try to help her.
I am hoping the OP can somehow find a place a calmness from where she can better help her daughter. I have seen foster parents practically move mountains to turn around teenage foster children with far greater problems. The best foster parent I ever met never raised her voice, was very together and loving, but still firm. No matter what her kids did, she seemed to be able to hold it together. She was amazing, and it was amazing to see how those kids changed. If you can see someone like that in action, they are an inspiration.
I think this great. Someone who had the courage to change themselves and look in the mirror in order to help their child. My hat is off to you, you're amazing.
Wow--this thread makes me sad. I am seeing where my older daughter may have been heading. She seems to have a number of traits similar to the OP's oldest daughter. My daughter also tends to blame other people for her problems. However, she is getting better and better with time. Some of that only occurred because I changed. I remember when she was younger I tended to be too impatient and annoyed with her too often. I didn't understand the way she ticks and was afraid she would not be able to function in society. In many cases, the problems grew worse because of my tone of voice talking to her and my feelings of frustration.
Academic and psychological testing did help me understand her. I also had to learn to calm myself internally better. I could not let her tantrums bother me all the time. I was able to remain at peace much more frequently and explain the way the world operates to her. She started to get much better when I changed. I remember once back in second grade she had a massive meltdown over a homework assignment. She was hysterical, and I was amazed that I was as calm as a cucumber. We didn't have too many tantrums like that after that night. I seemed to cross some bridge where I wasn't taking her tantrum as some sign of my parenting failure. Instead I handled it like an intriguing problem that needed my help. My daughter needed to work through her fears (and maybe recover from some of my previous parenting), and I needed to be there to reassure her and try to help her.
I am hoping the OP can somehow find a place a calmness from where she can better help her daughter. I have seen foster parents practically move mountains to turn around teenage foster children with far greater problems. The best foster parent I ever met never raised her voice, was very together and loving, but still firm. No matter what her kids did, she seemed to be able to hold it together. She was amazing, and it was amazing to see how those kids changed. If you can see someone like that in action, they are an inspiration.
Kudos to you for making the changes within yourself to help your daughter. I mentioned this back at the beginning of the thread, but I did something similar, and it has made a huge difference in my relationship with my almost 9 year old. I go to therapy on my own, he goes, I consult with the therapist about his treatment, and I've been to therapy with my husband.
Kids are born with certain personality traits, some good, some not; but as parents it is our job to take charge of the situation and do what needs to be done to help our kids grow up as well adjusted as possible. We can't change an innate trait, but we can change how we respond to it, and we can help them live with their not-so-good traits as well as they possibly can.
Actually, I've gotten some very good advice here today that I'm taking to heart. I've also gotten some bad advice I'm choosing to ignore. I knew I would when I posted this though. I'm just glad some people came through with ideas that might help. And a little support for adminstering some tough love. I do have to admit to pandering to dd#1 too much and contributing to the problem. I didn't pander to her this time. And the world did not end. That's one step in the right direction.
I'm glad you've found some useful advice. I agree with stopping the eggshell freeway. It's of no use.
Forget the calculator drama, sharing shouldn't lead your oldest into deep depression, she is using it as an excuse for failure to study and poor sleeping habits. Yes, you could've ran all over town trying to replace that calculator for the four sleeping hours to avoid a scream fest but why be that afraid of your child, your the mom, she's the kid, you made the right choice. A child that would care about that issue would have found something wrong with the replacement as well because she needed an excuse for avoiding her studies.
So, it's a non issue really.
Ignore the drama, don't try to avoid it with having the validating self worth talk. I'm sure you've done that, she can tell you walk on eggshells and she's working it. Be frank, I've tried avoiding your outbursts by changing my behavior. It doesn't work well for me or for you. If you really need to take me on then so be it, lets go for it.
Set your boundaries and stick to them. Say, you know I love you but I don't love your behavior and it's not going to stick around anymore.
No excuses, just show me the money. I.E. You want a good test score, study, take the test and get one. You want clothes, phones, computers, do what I do and kiss the bosses butt to get them, ie, I'm the boss.
Do your job as my child and learn how to survive in this world while I'm providing you with the shelter to fail.
I tell my kids that I'm giving you room, board and food for free so that you can concentrate on making your own dreams come true. You can learn how to survive in this world without me in a safe environment. But, it's not a luxury hotel, don't take advantage of your time, it ends when your an adult, don't waist it or you'll have no one to blame but yourself. If you stay here you're either in college or working and paying some rent.
I'm Korean though, so it may sound harsh to some on here but most Asian parents do not feel the need to instill self worth. You are born to take that journey yourself. You get the party when the accomplishment is on the table, not before that. We grew up being supportive of our sibs who did well and had dinner parties, whole family included, that you HAD to attend to congratulate your siblings on a job well done. And the key word is DONE.
Not the million attempts before hand. That just made the reward even sweeter. The victory greater.
I do this every week. Try it, it helps you stay focused as a mom.
Share some quotes of the day that relate, here are a few on self esteem:
"The tragedy is that so many people look for self-confidence and self-respect everywhere except within themselves, and so they fail in their search."
Dr Nathaniel Branden
"In my day, we didn't have self-esteem, we had self-respect, and no more of it than we had earned."
Jane Haddam
"It's surprising how many persons go through life without ever recognizing that their feelings toward other people are largely determined by their feelings toward themselves, and if you're not comfortable within yourself, you can't be comfortable with others."
Sidney J. Harris
"Every individual has a place to fill in the world, and is important, in some respect, whether he chooses to be so or not."
Nathaniel Hawthorne
I know it's scary but being a parent isn't all about gaining your daughters approval as a good mom, it's about raising a human being that will respect and contribute to society. If you get the other then great, if you don't, it's not a requirement.
Last edited by PoppySead; 06-11-2012 at 12:44 AM..
Being raised by asian parents myself, I know what you are talking about. There was encouragement, support, etc, but no adulation until an actual accomplishment was at hand. A real accomplishment. And I didn't feel any less loved because of this way of parenting.
Being raised by asian parents myself, I know what you are talking about. There was encouragement, support, etc, but no adulation until an actual accomplishment was at hand. A real accomplishment. And I didn't feel any less loved because of this way of parenting.
I don't think anyone disagrees that this style of parenting is appropriate for MOST kids. Where we differ is that this style of parenting is appropriate for ALL kids.
From what Ivory has shared in this thread (and many others), the issues her daughter has make it difficult, if not impossible, to deal with them without professional help. Her daughter is under the care of a therapist.
IMO, Ivory should be as well. It would benefit her to learn the most effective ways to deal with her daughters specific issues.
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but she got over it and I didn't have to buy a $200 calculator for dd#2.
