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Old 11-01-2012, 09:26 AM
 
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Quote:
One of my Gay friends told me once that he grew up learning that girls can do anything they want to boys, and boys can't retaliate. He decided, early-on, "I am not playin' that game!"

He never played that game at all. When the self-appointed finder of dates for ugly girls for Senior Prom called and tried to pressure him into attending, and taking some poor girl, he told Little Miss Busybody, "NO!".

He's never been on a date, never kissed a girl... And when the manipulative Southern Belles in his family try to wheedle him into "settling down with some nice girl from a good family... for companionship, you know...", he makes them very sorry they tried to control him. He's developed a set of verbal weapons that hurt as much as a fist. "The last thing on Earth I want to do is become a meal ticket for some fat, ugly, neurotic little piece of dirt who needs to go off and kill her pathetic self. I do not need another stupid, manipulative female, trying to micromanage every breath I take. I had more than enough of that as a child."

Luckily, he's in a hyper-elite niche profession where there are very few women with whom he has to interact. I was looking through his CDs once, and there was not a single female recording artist. And no love songs. He's got a gym-toned body, and wears multi-thousand-Dollar suits...eight-hundred-Dollar Stefano Ricci shirts...three-hundred-Dollar ties... Waitresses hover and fawn over him at lunch, even though it should be obvious he's bristling from having them violate his personal space. They're ignoring everyone else at the table, practically begging him for... whatever... while he's red-faced and practically muttering death threats under his breath.

There were other factors, of course, but the prohibition against boys' defending themselves against girls is part of a whole system for the victimization of men in America. I think the fact that he got in trouble, over and over, for standing up to his aggressive sister and aggressive girls at school, was that extra something turning him into, not just a Homosexual, but a Woman Hater as well.

OP, that 'teacher' needs to be fired. Allowing battery against your Son, its effects compounded by her forbidding him to defend himself, may have had far deeper effects than anyone realizes. The things that happen to us as tots, though they end up shrouded by Infantile Amnesia, are the things which shape our psyches. As adults, we tend not to remember the very things which shaped our character (for better or for worse).

Sounds like the so-called 'teacher' has some man-hater tendencies of her own...

Good for you, for standing up for your kid!
I actually think boys shouldn't be prevented from defending themselves.

I also think the notion that not being allowed to hit a girl contributes to turning males into homosexuals (gay is the preferred term) is a bit grandiose. I'll have to run that by some of my gay friends. Haven't heard that theory before
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Michigan
12,711 posts, read 13,456,579 times
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Not hitting girls is fine as a rule, in fact not hitting anyone is fine as a rule, but there are exceptions to every rule, and self-defense is one. A busted lip seems excessive, but for a first try it can be chalked up to over-exuberance.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:52 AM
 
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If a girl hits like a boy then she deserves to be hit like a boy. Flat.Like.That. This whole girl are weaker than boys things. Smh. #FALSE
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Old 11-01-2012, 11:32 AM
 
Location: PNW, CPSouth, JacksonHole, Southampton
3,734 posts, read 5,745,367 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimbochick View Post
But he did defend himself, and was encouraged to do so by his parents, so your incoherent diatribe is moot (not to mention disturbing).



Your friend sounds like he has issues, none of which are related to the fact that he was born gay.

He did, eventually defend himself, but only after a protracted period during which he was being physically attacked by the girl, and forbidden to retaliate by the 'teacher'. Considering the way a four-year-old experiences time, the fact that he eventually defended himself would probably not nullify the trauma preceding his self-defense.

And perhaps you chose the wrong word to describe my 'diatribe', dear? Maybe 'incomprehensible' (for some people, at least), or possibly 'impenetrable', could have been substituted for 'incoherent'?

My associate's 'issues' stem from his having grown up in a social order where men were considered to be a class of slave creature. Men existed to give money to women (and/or to go off to war and come back with parts missing). They were supposed to be mute money machines, blankly allowing their wives and mothers to make fun of them, manipulate them, infantilize them, control them...'train' them. The 'not hitting girls' thing was only one part of early conditioning. The cumulative effect of his early perception/experience of that social order was to cause him to reject Manhood/The Male Role/Heterosexuality quite early in life.

My associate's early experiences, particularly his being forbidden to defend himself against female aggression, caused him to associate 'being a man' with being assigned to a designated victim class. And it caused him to see girls as bad people who are allowed to hurt you. He sees women, now, not as sources of love, but as potential tormentors. I'm sure the die was cast long before he got to First Grade.

I think Joan Crawford's masterpiece film, Harriet Craig, pretty-much served as a template for a certain kind of woman in the Twentieth Century. I mean, there was Harriet, basically providing a training course for young homemakers. The scene on the train, where Harriet explains to her Niece, how she has 'trained her Husband for marriage' is so telling. Mrs. Craig even ended up with 'it all': a 'Tasteful Colonial' mansion with a spiral staircase, all to herself... pesky little husband banished... and no need to work (here, Hollywood spells out to men that no matter how horrible the soon-to-be-ex-wife is, she should get the house - even if it's part of your own family's heritage - and enough money to live in luxury 'til the end of her days). Another Crawford masterpiece, Queen Bee, is an equally effective how-to flick masquerading as a cautionary tale. Films like these deeply affected the expectations and strategies of middle class American women of my Associate's parents' generation.

Whether such Hollywood-borne conditioning was an early stage of the Frankfurt School's agenda is debatable. Plenty of Communists certainly were writing for Hollywood in those days. But it is only slightly out of step with the current demonization and victimization of American males. And I will add that girls are still being conditioned by Mass-market Pop Culture, to be teasing temptress parasites.
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Old 11-01-2012, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Brentwood, Tennessee
49,932 posts, read 59,761,388 times
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Oh, Gloria, we can always count on you to derail a thread with your sweeping generalizations and melodramatic pop culture references.

Your associate may have grown up in that social order, but not "all men." It may have been limited to his street, his school, his neighborhood, his town. Certainly NOT all men.

OP, djacques is right.
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Old 11-01-2012, 12:25 PM
 
32,516 posts, read 37,091,970 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandviewGloria View Post
But it is only slightly out of step with the current demonization and victimization of American males.
I thought Hollywood was busy turning American men into gay communists.

I actually know people who make their living sitting in the writer's room. I'll have to ask if they're demonizing and victimizing this week. I'll also make a note to ask if they were allowed to hit girls (or boys) if they got pushed off the teeter-totter when they were four.
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Old 11-01-2012, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Moscow
2,223 posts, read 3,865,135 times
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I have taught my daughters the following:
1. Always try to avoid a fight.
2. Tell an adult if it turns into something you can't handle.
3. If someone tries to hit you, take them down.
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Old 11-01-2012, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Geneva, IL
12,980 posts, read 14,536,888 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandviewGloria View Post
And perhaps you chose the wrong word to describe my 'diatribe', dear? Maybe 'incomprehensible' (for some people, at least), or possibly 'impenetrable', could have been substituted for 'incoherent'?
No dear, I meant incoherent:

in·co·her·ent/ˌinkōˈhi(ə)rənt/



Adjective:
  • (of spoken or written language) Expressed in an incomprehensible or confusing way; unclear
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Old 11-01-2012, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Michigan
12,711 posts, read 13,456,579 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattie View Post
What? Besides the absurdity of thinking not being able to hit girls can cause homosexuality, how does this story even relate to a couple of 4 yr olds?

The OP has given no information on what steps the school has taken to discipline either child. Hopefully just the fact that the little boy fought back is enough to end the attacks. But, you've made the jump to accusing the teacher of being a man-hater who will forever scar this child's psyche?
IDK, I think it's far-fetched to suppose the double-standard causes homosexuality, but I can certainly see how it could turn homosexual boys and heterosexual boys into homosexual misogynists and heterosexual misogynists.
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Old 11-01-2012, 02:34 PM
 
13,979 posts, read 25,891,965 times
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Originally Posted by djacques View Post
IDK, I think it's far-fetched to suppose the double-standard causes homosexuality, but I can certainly see how it could turn homosexual boys and heterosexual boys into homosexual misogynists and heterosexual misogynists.
Based on nursery school experiences? Perhaps, if every other female in their lives abused them, but I doubt one little bully of a four year old could do it.

My own sons were told never to hit a girl. Fortunately, only once was that policy tested, when a little girl threw a rock that hit my son in the head, necessitating stitches. He was praised not just on his emergency room bravery, but also because he did not retaliate against the little girl.

As I said before, I don't blame the OP's son, he was repeatedly attacked. But, changing the accepted mores that boys don't hit girls would cause many problems as the children age.
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