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You can have a good balance. No child should be in boot camp 24/7. They need lots of play time where they aren't "hearing no constantly". Still, though, the training is important and is best done early. It just gets harder and more painful for everyone the longer you wait. It's all about the child forming good habits early, and having respect for boundaries, in a loving and stable environment. The "terrible twos" (and often "threes") may still be difficult, but they don't have to be a nightmare.
I never thought of it as "terrible twos" or my kids were just fun two year olds.
I also don't get into the theories of parenting -- for me it's just "choose your battles" and a rolling of eyes or pout wasn't a battle I chose. For me a two year old is just someone starting to form opinions, have a mind of his or her own -- so I like what two year olds do.
I simply cannot get mad at anything a two year old might do. They're just little babies with opinions, trying to be big people.
Ignoring many things also works. I have a vivid memory of my own childhood -- and what really got to my dad was what he would interpret as a "smirk". So half the fun was trying to smirk without it being obvious enough to get him mad. Or explaining that it was really just a sad smile we were making. In our minds we were actually winning those games because we'd smirk when his face was turned and he couldn't control our thoughts. I just don't want to play those games myself with my kids. If you never react to a pout or eye-rolling or smirk, it takes all the fun out of doing it.
Although, the families I know that are very good at attachment parenting, their children are the opposite of challenging. They always seem content. It kind of amazes me. I think this has more to do with the parents personality than anything else.
Well, not to cast any aspersions on your own experience, but in my experience parents who neglect the early training of their children exhaust themselves - especially if their families are large and the children are close together in age. It's very common for patience to run out and end in a parental temper tantrum, which is fairly traumatic for the child and sets a horrible example. Their children are so used to ignoring their parents that I've literally seen "attachment parenting" mothers with children on a leash! (And yet, ironically, it is the "training" parents who are accused of treating their child like a domestic pet.)
The young children might be content and happy, but they're not used to denying their own will or deferring to anyone. It's not the end of the world, but life will be harder for them, and their relationships will suffer.
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Originally Posted by pegotty
I guess my main point here is that there is no one good way of parenting. The personality of the children and the parents is a major factor. What works for one, won't work for another. I just hate to see these blanket statements that you "need to spank that child" especially on a message board. Young moms are so impressionable and so worried that they are doing something wrong. Without personally assessing the situation (which can't be done in this format) one could cause harm to the child if a parent follows through on one of those blanket statements.
You're right that giving parenting advice to strangers on the internet is pretty dangerous. I'm sure I've crossed the line more than once. I also agree that there is room for different approaches based on the personalities and temperaments, strengths and limitations, of both children and parents.
However, some principles are more widely applicable than others. Children need to experience the unconditional love of their parents. Children need time and space for creative and imaginative play (which TV and computers interfere with), for making free decisions, and for channeling their energy in wholesome ways. Etc. Those are some positives we probably agree on. Likewise, children need to be taught to obey their parents, to respect authority, to deny their own will, and to be generous with others - none of this comes naturally. Parents have a responsibility to train their children in virtue, to help them develop good habits over the course of their lives. While it's true that there is no single formula for doing these things, some approaches are better than others for the majority of children.
Last edited by WesternPilgrim; 12-05-2012 at 12:26 PM..
I never thought of it as "terrible twos" or my kids were just fun two year olds.
I also don't get into the theories of parenting -- for me it's just "choose your battles" and a rolling of eyes or pout wasn't a battle I chose. For me a two year old is just someone starting to form opinions, have a mind of his or her own -- so I like what two year olds do.
I simply cannot get mad at anything a two year old might do. They're just little babies with opinions, trying to be big people.
Ignoring many things also works. I have a vivid memory of my own childhood -- and what really got to my dad was what he would interpret as a "smirk". So half the fun was trying to smirk without it being obvious enough to get him mad. Or explaining that it was really just a sad smile we were making. In our minds we were actually winning those games because we'd smirk when his face was turned and he couldn't control our thoughts. I just don't want to play those games myself with my kids. If you never react to a pout or eye-rolling or smirk, it takes all the fun out of doing it.
I agree completely. Getting mad at a child for facial expressions is rather silly, in my opinion. As a parent, I try to choose my battles and ignore the small stuff- by not even acknowledging the fact a child is pouting/eye-rolling, the expression will lose its effectiveness quickly. In my experience, anyway. I try to save my reactions for the big stuff.
Likewise, children need to be taught to obey their parents, to respect authority, to deny their own will, and to be generous with others - none of this comes naturally. Parents have a responsibility to train their children in virtue, to help them develop good habits over the course of their lives.
Absolutely. I just think this is a process done better verbally than physically. But we can probably agree to disagree on that.
WP, I do know where you are coming from. You take a lot of flack around here for things you say, but I often agree with the reasoning behind your words. I think on sites like this it is easy to argue for the sake of winning rather than seeing past our own preconceived notions and helping someone where they are.
I have a child who doesn't eat much do to a severe texture sensitivity. I took him to the chiropractor a few days ago for whiplash (bumper cars at a birthday party, but that's another story) and she recommended I not feed him milk because that's "for baby cows." She recommended eating greens instead of milk to get calcium, because "after all, cows turn grass into calcium, so can we". She was aware of what a limited diet he has and and his difficulty with food. So of course this advice was completely useless to me. She was pushing an agenda instead of meeting me where I was and looking past her ideals to someplace that would be helpful for us.
Absolutely. I just think this is a process done better verbally than physically. But we can probably agree to disagree on that.
We certainly can.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pegotty
WP, I do know where you are coming from. You take a lot of flack around here for things you say, but I often agree with the reasoning behind your words.
Brave of you to say that around here!
Quote:
Originally Posted by pegotty
I think on sites like this it is easy to argue for the sake of winning rather than seeing past our own preconceived notions and helping someone where they are.
Very true. Sometimes, though, bad ideas are so hideously awful they need a good trouncing.
Though spanking is not one of my top issues, I know that it benefits children when done properly, and it's hard to sit idly by while good and loving parents are condemned as abusive. Being slightly cantankerous by temperament, occasionally I will play offense on this issue just because playing defense all the time gets tiresome. Still, I don't condemn those who choose not to spank. Decent parenting is possible without spanking, and I suspect there are parents with anger management issues who should avoid spanking altogether. I should probably keep this in mind more often.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pegotty
Sometimes we have to be okay with good enough.
Or, as they say, "don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good".
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