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There have been a few posters who adamantly refuse to discuss any ideas about rape prevention beyond keeping kids away from parties where people might be drinking, girls watching their glasses, etc. What I, and some others have been arguing is that can't be the end of rape discussions, kids also need detailed education about what rape is, what legal consent in sex is, that alcohol on either side never excuses this crime, and what the punishment will likely be.
Ah. I agree. There was such a vocal blame the victim decry, it was easy to get side tracked. You're going to get a desire to NOT educate children from those most inclined to CONTROL them. It is sad because those are the kids who wind up most at risk IMO.
Though there is a final verdict in the Steubenville case, the jury is still out on whether we, as parents, are ready to take on the challenge of dismantling rape culture, starting in our homes.
If you can bear to, check out the tweets linked in the article.
You have to wonder if this community reads any newspapers within driving distance of their town. The coach "took care" of the problem? That area of the US just got through several months of headlines from Princeton and another high school party rape just occurred.
The two young men got less than a year. That means it's an expungeable offense and at the most they might lose a year of college eligibility getting their paperwork straightened out, if they stay blem free.
But their coach and apparently some other adults are looking at some serious charges. This one isn't over yet.
If you can bear to, check out the tweets linked in the article.
Those tweets are HORRIBLE, yet unfortunately I'm not surprised. You would think there wouldn't be any protest over educating teens about rape/consent, in addition to risk factors -- yet there is.
This is what breeds the victim-blaming mentality because so many people believe the victim is partly responsible because it is their fault they got drunk.
A quick thank-you to the OP for starting this thread.
I consider myself an intelligent, informed parent. Mr. Flyer and I have talked to our 12 and 13 year old sons about sex, alcohol, drugs, bullying, manners, morals, etc.
But, I'll be honest...It never occured to me that we would need to define rape, and what is and isn't appropriate. I guess I just thought that it went without saying.
Kids have always needed guidance, but in today's world where they're bombarded with so many conflicting messages, it seems like they need guidance now more than ever!
::Sigh:: Sometimes I just don't like this world we live in.
I was told at 12 what sexual assault was, what rape was. It was made very clear. If I was ever to do any of those things, I would not have a home to come back to. My mother would tell them to keep me in jail. A powerful message got across to me. I love my family. Why risk that for some silly girl who won't give a guy a kiss?
Earlier today my brother (8) and some friends held a girl down and he kissed her. We made sure to strike some fear into the guy. (His father is a misogynist and it's clear where he gets his ideas of masculinity.) I was raised by my mom, my dad wasn't there. The teacher made him apologize. When he got home it was made clear to him. The way it was made clear to me. I think he gets it now. (my mom was raped when she was 16, something I found out recently so I understand why she does it the way she does.)((mom divorced their dad but he sees them often enough.))
We explained what sexual assault was. Just make sure you talk to your kids. And make it clear.
I've thought more on this...It's the peer pressure thing that scares me the most.
Since my sons don't have sisters, I'm going to use their female cousin in a scenario. I'm going to ask them how they would feel if she were a victim. I know that they wouldn't partake, nor would they stand by and watch. They would defend her or at least call for help.
I think we have to make this hit home. Every girl is someone's sister, cousin or daughter.
I have two sons, ages 11 and 14, and you bet we've had conversations about all of this.
They play video games, they watch TV, and they are surrounded by uncouth kids in both the middle school and yes, also the elementary school. I've been shocked by things my 5th grader has come home and told me, that he has heard in and around school. I have to correct them constantly on the casual comments that come from their gaming associations, someone is forever "owning," "pwning," or indeed "raping" someone else in those online multiplayer games. Interestingly, since this particular case came to public attention and we had several very serious talks about it, not only about the concept of consent, but about how it is equally unacceptable to be a bystander or indeed not act to prevent something like this...those casual rape comments have dwindled in their vocabulary. It has become a little more real for both of them.
My sons are not only drilled on aspects of ethical behavior, they also both have martial arts training. This isn't my way of saying that they are high-speed ninjas who know how to throw down, this is relevent because this particular activity not only teaches the defense of self and others, but when it is appropriate to use the skills and the self discipline to hold yourself to what is right and to stand up for what is right. In my opinion it's one of the healthiest activities you can involve your kids in, from about age 6 onwards.
What I find disturbing about these discussions with my kids, while I will never dispute the necessity, is that I don't want them to lose sight of what a wonderful place our world and our society CAN be, and usually IS. When you get up to your eyeballs in stories of horror, it's all too easy to say that the world we live in is a terrible place. Well, 99% of the people I've encountered in life are, to the best of my knowledge, decent folks. I know a lot of wonderful people who spend their lives doing good. They're out there. Nothing wrong with caution, common sense, and preparedness, but we need to not become so jaded and cynical that we lose sight of the joy of living. It is hard for teens to keep their spirits up...I try very hard to walk a balance, to teach them realistic life skills without convincing them that they're living in Gotham City or something.
But, I'll be honest...It never occured to me that we would need to define rape, and what is and isn't appropriate. I guess I just thought that it went without saying.
Kids have always needed guidance, but in today's world where they're bombarded with so many conflicting messages, it seems like they need guidance now more than ever!
::Sigh:: Sometimes I just don't like this world we live in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork
What I find disturbing about these discussions with my kids, while I will never dispute the necessity, is that I don't want them to lose sight of what a wonderful place our world and our society CAN be, and usually IS. When you get up to your eyeballs in stories of horror, it's all too easy to say that the world we live in is a terrible place. Well, 99% of the people I've encountered in life are, to the best of my knowledge, decent folks. I know a lot of wonderful people who spend their lives doing good. They're out there. Nothing wrong with caution, common sense, and preparedness, but we need to not become so jaded and cynical that we lose sight of the joy of living. It is hard for teens to keep their spirits up...I try very hard to walk a balance, to teach them realistic life skills without convincing them that they're living in Gotham City or something.
If that makes sense.
My opinion is there is no more need now for these conversations than previous generations, they are conversations our parents should have had with us, but most didn't for a variety of reasons. We are more informed parents now, and that's a good thing.
I have two sons, ages 11 and 14, and you bet we've had conversations about all of this.
They play video games, they watch TV, and they are surrounded by uncouth kids in both the middle school and yes, also the elementary school. I've been shocked by things my 5th grader has come home and told me, that he has heard in and around school. I have to correct them constantly on the casual comments that come from their gaming associations, someone is forever "owning," "pwning," or indeed "raping" someone else in those online multiplayer games. Interestingly, since this particular case came to public attention and we had several very serious talks about it, not only about the concept of consent, but about how it is equally unacceptable to be a bystander or indeed not act to prevent something like this...those casual rape comments have dwindled in their vocabulary. It has become a little more real for both of them.
My sons are not only drilled on aspects of ethical behavior, they also both have martial arts training. This isn't my way of saying that they are high-speed ninjas who know how to throw down, this is relevent because this particular activity not only teaches the defense of self and others, but when it is appropriate to use the skills and the self discipline to hold yourself to what is right and to stand up for what is right. In my opinion it's one of the healthiest activities you can involve your kids in, from about age 6 onwards.
What I find disturbing about these discussions with my kids, while I will never dispute the necessity, is that I don't want them to lose sight of what a wonderful place our world and our society CAN be, and usually IS. When you get up to your eyeballs in stories of horror, it's all too easy to say that the world we live in is a terrible place. Well, 99% of the people I've encountered in life are, to the best of my knowledge, decent folks. I know a lot of wonderful people who spend their lives doing good. They're out there. Nothing wrong with caution, common sense, and preparedness, but we need to not become so jaded and cynical that we lose sight of the joy of living. It is hard for teens to keep their spirits up...I try very hard to walk a balance, to teach them realistic life skills without convincing them that they're living in Gotham City or something.
If that makes sense.
Martial arts are great for the body and mind, I wish it was more common for girls to become involved, I know some do, but it's not usually a parents first thought for a girl, and all kids should be taught basic self defense. Girls are so socialized to be nice, polite, and pretty, it can be hard for them to stand up for themselves when they need to, the bad guys often count on this. Things are much better now, but I still think that a lot of girls are afraid being strong in body and mind will make them unattractive, but the best men love strong women, and respect their strength.
I like to look for, and share any positive stories I read about people helping each other, or doing the right thing. These can help kids learn proper behavior, and see that while they need to be careful of the bad people and deeds, there is also a lot of good in the world. I also get a lot out of reading positive stories, it's easy to get caught up in the negative news we see every day, and start thinking the world is just a horrible place full of horrible people. I think most people are good, but the bad ones get most of the press.
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