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Old 11-10-2014, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Finland
6,418 posts, read 7,227,317 times
Reputation: 10435

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHAIN5 View Post
She might not say it the way you or I would, but it may come out unexpectedly in more subtle or off the wall ways. You can also check out her pictures and ask her what's going on in them. If there are sad faces, she might explain what's up with that.

I actually ask my kids about their pictures for fun and have gotten a very good idea of what's going on in their heads at different times (sometimes I've had them dictate their stories and I write them on the back of the pictures). But I digress a bit.

Or here's a thought...She could also just be going through "terrible 4's" instead of "terrible 2's" . Both my older kids did; I honestly didn't know what to do initially when the 3rd went the "normal" route of "terrible 2's".
She hasn't progressed to drawing faces on her pictures yet (she has my artistic skills, or lack of ). Maybe I'll find some other way of getting her to explain things. I think I'll call her child health clinic nurse and make an appointment there, they might have some ideas.

The terrible twos was bad enough, this is so much worse!
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Old 11-10-2014, 09:52 AM
 
138 posts, read 172,511 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natsku View Post
She hasn't progressed to drawing faces on her pictures yet (she has my artistic skills, or lack of ). Maybe I'll find some other way of getting her to explain things. I think I'll call her child health clinic nurse and make an appointment there, they might have some ideas.

The terrible twos was bad enough, this is so much worse!
All the best with it. My youngest went through a phase where she would bite/hit the middle child for no apparent reason. Often randomly. Out of the blue.

This too shall pass.
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Old 11-10-2014, 10:15 AM
 
Location: USA
7,776 posts, read 12,410,130 times
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I suppose I am out of the loop. I would demonstrate to her exactly how it feels to be bitten. It worked wonders in changing my daughter's mind about being a biter.

Last edited by Rubi3; 11-10-2014 at 10:25 AM..
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Old 11-10-2014, 11:11 AM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
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1. Kids usually telegraph when they are going to bite, so... stop her before she can. Hold her away from you.

2. She's old enough to understand alternatives - when she wants to bite, hand her something she can bite - an apple, a bagel, a hard teething toy.

3. Teach her how to express her emotions. Read books about being angry. I like When Sophie Gets Angry, Very, Very Angry, but there are many books out there that can help. Another good book is A Volcano in My Tummy: Helping Children to Handle Anger

4. She can draw pictures of being angry even if she doesn't draw people and faces. Just using a black crayon or marker and scribbling over the whole paper may make her feel better.

5. How do you handle anger? Teach her what you do. Do you count to ten? Do you walk away? Do you breathe out your anger? All of these are good techniques and she can learn them even at 4.
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Old 11-10-2014, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Eastern PA
1,263 posts, read 4,928,130 times
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Something that might help immensely at her age is to have some "play therapy" with a psychologist. My oldest is on the autism spectrum and was having so much anxiety at age 4 (we were also having marital issues at that point, and my husband at the time had briefly moved out). The psychologist was a sweet woman who had all kinds of creative play things in her office and she would speak with him while they played together once a week. It really helped him express his feelings in an age-appropriate way and he was always anxious to go there. Like CHAIN5 mentioned above, they also did a lot of drawing together and sculpting with clay, and my son was able to express himself through that. It turned out through these sessions just how much he felt his dad did not love or care for him. He never ever mentioned that to me at home and would act out for those he felt comfortable with, either me or his grandparents. Once you can get to what is upsetting her and she can vent that, I would just bet you will see the biting/meltdowns stop.

He is 20 years old now and has very fond memories of the play sessions. I took him steadily at ages 4 and 5, and then once a month until he was 8 or 9 yrs old.

I think she would benefit from a morning routine that is as calm as possible no matter whether you are leaving early or late. My daughter is adamant about dresses year-round, so I just add underneath long johns, wooly or fleece tights, or leggings over wooly-fleece tights if it is really cold. I find that doing our morning routine in exactly the same order whenever possible eliminates much stress and then nothing gets forgotten (we are at school ages now).

Last edited by karen_s; 11-10-2014 at 12:25 PM.. Reason: Spelling
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Old 11-10-2014, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Finland
6,418 posts, read 7,227,317 times
Reputation: 10435
I hold her away if I see the warning signal, then she kicks me instead. I really think if I would offer her something else to bite instead she would just knock it away and and continue to attack, the anger just takes over. Actually reminds me a lot of how I used to be, I would have terrible rages as a child, maybe its an inherited trait that is just coming out now.

I shall look up those books, she loves books and likes to discuss their plots with me so books about being angry might really help, thanks for the suggestions. And see if I can teach her some techniques, walking away is how I deal with anger so maybe I can demonstrate that to her.
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Old 11-10-2014, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Finland
6,418 posts, read 7,227,317 times
Reputation: 10435
Quote:
Originally Posted by karen_s View Post
Something that might help immensely at her age is to have some "play therapy" with a psychologist. My oldest is on the autism spectrum and was have so much anxiety at age 4 (we were also having marital issues at that point, and my husband at the time had briefly moved out). The psychologist was a sweet woman who had all kinds of creative play things in her office and she would speak with him while they played together once a week. It really helped him express his feelings in an age-appropriate way and he was always anxious to go there. Like CHAIN5 mentioned above, they also did a lot of drawing together and sculpting with clay, and my son was able to express himself through that. It turned out through these sessions just how much he felt his dad did not love or care for him. He never ever mentioned that to me at home and would act out for those he felt comfortable with, either me or his grandparents. Once you can get to what is upsetting her and she can vent that, I would just bet you will see the biting/meltdowns stop.

He is 20 years old now and has very fond memories of the play sessions. I took him steadily at ages 4 and 5, and then once a month until he was 8 or 9 yrs old.

I think she would benefit from a morning routine that is as calm as possible no matter whether you are leaving early or late. My daughter is adamant about dresses year-round, so I just add underneath long johns, wooly or fleece tights, or leggings over wooly-fleece tights if it is really cold. I find that doing our morning routine in exactly the same order whenever possible eliminates much stress and then nothing gets forgotten (we are at school ages now).
I'll ask about her nurse about play therapy, sounds like a good idea.
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Old 11-10-2014, 12:26 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,836,530 times
Reputation: 17473
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natsku View Post
I hold her away if I see the warning signal, then she kicks me instead. I really think if I would offer her something else to bite instead she would just knock it away and and continue to attack, the anger just takes over. Actually reminds me a lot of how I used to be, I would have terrible rages as a child, maybe its an inherited trait that is just coming out now.

I shall look up those books, she loves books and likes to discuss their plots with me so books about being angry might really help, thanks for the suggestions. And see if I can teach her some techniques, walking away is how I deal with anger so maybe I can demonstrate that to her.
If she likes dolls or stuffed animals or puppets, you can also role play what to do. Don't limit yourself though to the technique you use. She might find another idea more helpful to her.

The Self-Calming Plan

1. Acknowledge and name the feeling (just knowing someone is empathetic helps)
2. Set limits (its okay to be angry but hitting the cat is not okay)
3. Offer self-calming choices (limit two for young children)

Six Categories

Audio/Verbal
listen to calming music, sing a song, talk to someone sympathetic ear), listen to water, use your words

Visual
look at/read a book, look outside, go to your happy place, watch an aquarium

Creative
draw a picture (mad picture), make something (craft or cook), write a letter (journal), write/draw on paper and throw it away

Self-nurturing
get a hug, get a snack (hungry? – low blood sugar; careful, don't just offer food as substitute), take a warm bath

Physical
(these ideas can be better than a time-out) run, shake (hands or all over, like a wet puppy), relax muscles (melt like a snowman), breathe (pretend to be a balloon and then blow bubbles), hug yourself, hug a
critter, playdough, float like a feather, massage

Humor
watch a funny video (funniest animals), make silly faces, read a funny book, find humor in a situation

Teach breathing (do this as a game when you are calm already)

Ballooning

When you balloon, you breathe in (deeply) and as you breath in you start with your arms at your sides and raise them up parallel to your shoulders and up over your head. Then you blow it all out, make it exaggerated like a balloon spewing out all the air. The kids really like it and it really lowers tension.

Draining

When you drain, you put both hands out in front of you, you twist (and twist, and twist and twist) your hands around like you were turning off water and you *********r face all up, then you blow the air out
through your lips (I know... there will be a little spit!) but the kids really like that one and you can feel the stress and tension leaving your own body! (automatic stress relief!)

RDI

Relaxing together -taking deep breaths together. Practice that with her as a regulatory pattern . Take her away from that scene first. Then hold her hands say "You are not calm. Let's become calm. Breathe
in........." "Breathe out...." Breathe in a very exagerrated manner. She may not be able to really do the heavy breathing but will try. This will take her mind off whatever was bothering her first. After a few minutes, tell her "You are calm now! Wow! We both are calm and that feels so much better" and return to what you were doing.
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Old 11-10-2014, 12:40 PM
 
Location: Finland
6,418 posts, read 7,227,317 times
Reputation: 10435
Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
If she likes dolls or stuffed animals or puppets, you can also role play what to do. Don't limit yourself though to the technique you use. She might find another idea more helpful to her.

The Self-Calming Plan

1. Acknowledge and name the feeling (just knowing someone is empathetic helps)
2. Set limits (its okay to be angry but hitting the cat is not okay)
3. Offer self-calming choices (limit two for young children)

Six Categories

Audio/Verbal
listen to calming music, sing a song, talk to someone sympathetic ear), listen to water, use your words

Visual
look at/read a book, look outside, go to your happy place, watch an aquarium

Creative
draw a picture (mad picture), make something (craft or cook), write a letter (journal), write/draw on paper and throw it away

Self-nurturing
get a hug, get a snack (hungry? – low blood sugar; careful, don't just offer food as substitute), take a warm bath

Physical
(these ideas can be better than a time-out) run, shake (hands or all over, like a wet puppy), relax muscles (melt like a snowman), breathe (pretend to be a balloon and then blow bubbles), hug yourself, hug a
critter, playdough, float like a feather, massage

Humor
watch a funny video (funniest animals), make silly faces, read a funny book, find humor in a situation

Teach breathing (do this as a game when you are calm already)

Ballooning

When you balloon, you breathe in (deeply) and as you breath in you start with your arms at your sides and raise them up parallel to your shoulders and up over your head. Then you blow it all out, make it exaggerated like a balloon spewing out all the air. The kids really like it and it really lowers tension.

Draining

When you drain, you put both hands out in front of you, you twist (and twist, and twist and twist) your hands around like you were turning off water and you *********r face all up, then you blow the air out
through your lips (I know... there will be a little spit!) but the kids really like that one and you can feel the stress and tension leaving your own body! (automatic stress relief!)

RDI

Relaxing together -taking deep breaths together. Practice that with her as a regulatory pattern . Take her away from that scene first. Then hold her hands say "You are not calm. Let's become calm. Breathe
in........." "Breathe out...." Breathe in a very exagerrated manner. She may not be able to really do the heavy breathing but will try. This will take her mind off whatever was bothering her first. After a few minutes, tell her "You are calm now! Wow! We both are calm and that feels so much better" and return to what you were doing.
Thanks, those are some really good ideas. Calming music has worked really well before with non-violent tantrums, don't know why I didn't think to try that again. Humour works well too (I can sometimes distract her before she gets violent by pulling a silly face).
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Old 11-10-2014, 12:41 PM
 
16,715 posts, read 19,355,889 times
Reputation: 41482
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natsku View Post
I know a lot of toddlers go through biting phases but I thought it was generally with younger toddlers (she's nearly 4). Its been going on for a couple of weeks, since the last time she had visitation with her dad, and she's only biting me, not other children. It really bloody hurts though and I don't know how to deal with it.

I spoke with her daycare teacher and she said that she's noticed that her temper has gotten worse - she gets really angry when I pick her up from daycare, shouting and hitting, and now biting as well, same whenever she doesn't get her way at home.
Have you talked to your ex about it? It's too bad you two can't get along just for your child's sake. It's just not fair to that poor baby having to deal with your adult emotions along with her own.

And as far as the biting, well, I bite back. It stopped after about three times.

Last edited by convextech; 11-10-2014 at 12:53 PM..
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