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She's 22. You and your wife screwed her over by not holding her accountable or setting expectations. Now you've got a 22-year-old, spoiled and helpless child on your hands.
I grew up in a fairly comfortable lifestyle. Private school, a big house and always enough spending money to go out with my friends. But my parents made me work really hard. I was cleaning out the kennels for my father's hunting dogs and helping maintain our rural property from the time I was 11. I was only allowed to do fun things after I'd finished my homework. We had no TV in the house for most of my childhood. My life centered around my academic career and growing into an independent, successful adult.
Yeah, my father bought me my first car - after I graduated college and needed something to get back and forth from work. And it was a pickup truck so that I could continue to work for him on my weekends.
OP, you and your ex-wife set the pattern for your daughter years ago. And now you want her to break out of it? Good luck with that.
I'd say cut her loose, but she has no skills and sounds dumb as a rock. So if you're actually going to correct your years of mistakes, I'd say make her presence in your household contingent on her getting a job and going to therapy - individual and with you (and her mother if possible).
My mother had to work in the cotton fields when she was growing up and she didn't want her daughter to have to work at anything. She did the housework and was in the kitchen a lot and she wanted me to entertain myself, which I did. If she was annoyed with me about something, then I would have a chore to do, such as wash the dishes or dust, but otherwise, nothing.
She didn't do me a favor for I would have been much better off to have had responsibilities while growing up. She didn't want me underfoot in the kitchen and I didn't learn how to cook until high school home economics and when I married I taught myself.
Mother was a hard worker. She was often doing laundry, ironing or cooking. She and my dad had cattle at a place outside town, and I was rarely out there, but once I saw her help my dad when he was branding calves. Mostly though, my brothers helped him, so they worked, but not me.
Fortunately, I didn't become a bum. Somehow I ended up a responsible adult and I'm surprised it was that way, but I still dislike housework. Some parents are misguided and don't always know what is best.
I didn't read all the posts, but did read many and couldn't keep from thinking how I could have had a similar attitude as the young woman, although I never had to work in a fast food place.
I've thought more about DonInKansas since I first posted than I've thought about most letters I read on C-D. And the more I think, the more I conclude that most people here are being really unfair to his daughter. Yes, she's lazy and entitled. But 1.) she didn't get that way overnight and 2.) she likely wouldn't have gotten that way with more constructive parenting while she was growing up. Good intentions aren't always enough.
We don't know Don's whole story. But we do know he's divorced, his ex has remarried and now has other kids (we don't know about him), and the daughter they had is now living with Don rather than her mother. Was she raised in an income bracket where it would actually be embarrassing for her to be seen by her peers working a fast-food job? That can be devastating, particularly for a young person who might already have low self-esteem.
Most of you would say she has to suck it up. But, seriously, look at her side of this. She was raised, at the very least, in an unstable home. It's within the realm of possibility she feels extreme rejection from whichever parent left the marriage first, as well as the mother for having additional children and sending her the message that she suddenly wasn't #1 anymore. Can you blame a kid for reacting negatively to that kind of emotional chaos? (And she was "a kid" very recently.)
I can hear many of you shrieking that she needs to grow up, life isn't a bowl of cherries. But seriously, 22 today isn't what 22 was when I, and many of you, were that age. Almost every 22-year-old I know is FAR MORE IMMATURE than I was at 22 and far less equipped to cope with the world. At 22 I was living in a large metropolis working for a living. I didn't talk to my parents more than once a week, let alone depend on them for money or a roof over my head. I used public transportation because I couldn't afford a car. How many 22-year-olds do you really know these days who live like that?? How many could cope with the responsibilities without any support or direction. I can't name a single one.
How many times do we hear about profession sports players in their early twenties making insanely immature decisions that put their multi-million dollar careers in jeopardy? They are people who have been coddled, but not taught the ways of the world. Is it totally their fault that they don't act properly when they're dropped into the lap of luxury and don't know how to act? And they are, at least, adored. Something tells me Don's daughter isn't ... or at least don't believe she is valued very highly. I suspect she gets a lot more negative than positive message about herself from more than one source. She's certainly taking it on the chin here!
So Don's daughter, while her laziness may be extreme, is not that much more dependent than a lot of her peers. I also think it's distinctly possible that her lack of initiative is due to something like poor self esteem (perhaps has felt emotionally rejected by her parents for years), lack of direction (caused by adults who didn't find out what she was good at and support her through establishing herself in any particular interest), or even actual clinical depression. Big signs of depression are a lack of initiative and direction, a bad attitude about everything, and general sadness. Has she ever been evaluated by a professional? Has Don ever flat-out asked her WHY she shows the lack of interest she shows in being self-supporting?
I can understand if he is afraid to employ some of the draconian measures so many of you recommend. She could end up homeless in a matter of weeks and that is DANGEROUS. She could get raped, killed, or commit suicide. She could get picked up by a pimp and turned into a drug addicted prostitute. That's the actual fate of MANY young women out on the streets. He doesn't want that on his conscience and who could blame him? That's his daughter we're talking about. Easy for us to say, "Give her three weeks to shape up and if she doesn't, put her out of the house."
I think if Don has any sense at all that he has failed his daughter in ways other than buying her things, he and her mother owe her some emotional support. I'd suggest first of all a mental health evaluation if she hasn't already had one. Second, I would suggest career counseling for the daughter that he participates in, in terms of setting up a plan for her to become employed at SOMETHING that would bring some genuine happiness to her life. What does she like? Music, animals, children, travel, computers, clothes, cars, etc., etc.? There are jobs in all those fields but no one gets a job today by responding to an ad. She needs job training, mentors, internships, etc. Career counseling would provide direction and a plan. She needs a life coach, not a spanking.
I can hear many of you shrieking that she needs to grow up, life isn't a bowl of cherries. But seriously, 22 today isn't what 22 was when I, and many of you, were that age. Almost every 22-year-old I know is FAR MORE IMMATURE than I was at 22 and far less equipped to cope with the world. At 22 I was living in a large metropolis working for a living. I didn't talk to my parents more than once a week, let alone depend on them for money or a roof over my head. I used public transportation because I couldn't afford a car. How many 22-year-olds do you really know these days who live like that?? How many could cope with the responsibilities without any support or direction. I can't name a single one.
Me. I'm 22. I have a 60k+/year job, so I can afford my own car. I live in a shared apartment simply because I want to save money.
Seriously, age has little to do with it. stop generalizing my generation. some of us are adults.
Me. I'm 22. I have a 60k+/year job, so I can afford my own car. I live in a shared apartment simply because I want to save money.
Seriously, age has little to do with it. stop generalizing my generation. some of us are adults.
A good number of 22 year olds are still in school (5th year, changed majors, part-time, etc.) and another good number do not earn 60K+. You may not be an outlier and should learn humility. Your "some of us are adults" comment kind of shows that you need some humility and that maybe you aren't an adult after all...
A good number of 22 year olds are still in school (5th year, changed majors, part-time, etc.) and another good number do not earn 60K+. You may not be an outlier and should learn humility. Your "some of us are adults" comment kind of shows that you need some humility and that maybe you aren't an adult after all...
being in school for 5 years for a 4 year degree isn't much of an excuse (I double majored in 4 years and had a part time job). It's actually pretty sad.
besides the fact that humility and adulthood have very little to do with each other, the comment I was responding to says
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jukesgrrl
Almost every 22-year-old I know is FAR MORE IMMATURE than I was at 22 and far less equipped to cope with the world.
if you are going to call me immature and ill equipped to deal with the world because I'm 22, I'm going to call you out on it. No, you are not better than me. you couldn't even afford a car at 22. I wonder how much you had in savings at 22...probably nothing. yup, really mature 22 year old you were.
I know it's hard for young people to find jobs today but it amazes me how so many feel they are above menial jobs. I know I am going to sound old but back in my day just sitting around not doing anything was unheard of, as well as feeling they "deserve" whatever job they want. I know it's not all young people but damn it sure seems today's youth are the laziest and most entitled.
Around Seattle it's popular for people with deadbeat kids to buy them a house in Kansas and make them live there. If that doesn't straighten them out and kindle some sense of ambition, at least they have a house to live in even if it's in Kansas.
I doubt that has a good effect on the locals if they see other young people whose parents have sent them there as punishment.
being in school for 5 years for a 4 year degree isn't much of an excuse (I double majored in 4 years and had a part time job). It's actually pretty sad.
No what is sad is saying that "I did it, anyone else that cannot isn't much of an excuse, it's actually pretty sad." You act like everyone is in the same boat as you, they aren't. Even if they have better GPAs than you do, they may have not have been able to take a pre-req needed for their major or were blocked out. I nearly had that my senior semester with the Capstone class I needed to take. There was only two professors that semester compared to three so the school needed to hire another to cover for this. I eventually was in one of the added classes but had I not, it could have turned into another semester just to cover that one class.
Quote:
besides the fact that humility and adulthood have very little to do with each other, the comment I was responding to says
if you are going to call me immature and ill equipped to deal with the world because I'm 22, I'm going to call you out on it. No, you are not better than me. you couldn't even afford a car at 22. I wonder how much you had in savings at 22...probably nothing. yup, really mature 22 year old you were.
Actually, by you doing this shows you are in fact immature at 22, let alone ANY AGE. Trust me, I am 28 and while you do make more than me, I don't criticize others who may not have had the perfect storm to make me a success like you did. There's far too many things you leave out that you just don't know about those who spent five years at school or ended up changing majors. Maybe just maybe, they saw the change in job prospects and went into a similar but more profitable major that now wanted different classes for pre-requecs...
OP, you are setting her up for failure for the rest of her life. She has learned absolutely zero life skills. Time to enforce expectations with a written contract, and follow through with consequences if she violates he terms. No more second chances, she needs to grow up fast & you need to let go.
No what is sad is saying that "I did it, anyone else that cannot isn't much of an excuse, it's actually pretty sad." You act like everyone is in the same boat as you, they aren't. Even if they have better GPAs than you do, they may have not have been able to take a pre-req needed for their major or were blocked out. I nearly had that my senior semester with the Capstone class I needed to take. There was only two professors that semester compared to three so the school needed to hire another to cover for this. I eventually was in one of the added classes but had I not, it could have turned into another semester just to cover that one class.
taking 5 years to complete a 4 year degree is sad. It's a complete sign of laziness.
I also had an issue with a capstone class. College advisers exist for a reason. If you can't get into a class like that (you should be stalking it and signing up the moment you can....), you bug them until they open a spot up for you. It's not unheard of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkpunk
Actually, by you doing this shows you are in fact immature at 22, let alone ANY AGE. Trust me, I am 28 and while you do make more than me, I don't criticize others who may not have had the perfect storm to make me a success like you did. There's far too many things you leave out that you just don't know about those who spent five years at school or ended up changing majors. Maybe just maybe, they saw the change in job prospects and went into a similar but more profitable major that now wanted different classes for pre-requecs...
not perfect storm. It's amazing how people like you don't want to credit others with success. I got my job through a combination of hard work and making smart decisions.
I also changed majors into something more profitable, but pre reqs are typically the same no matter what. It's the reason why people suggest going to a community college for the first 2 years.
enough with the excuses. you and OP daughter might have a lot in common.
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Some parents are misguided and don't always know what is best.
