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"Nothing more"? That's uncharacteristically dismissive of you.
Maybe because it's been mentioned numerous times? Not to mention the insistence of calling it a leash, and comparing it to a dog leash It's just a tool. One of many tools parents use. Or don't. But for some reason this particular tool brings out more judgement and calling parents lazy than just about any other. I can't come up with any other reason that makes sense. And to be honest I just don't get the judgement for something that really is nothing more than personal preference. Why the need to call others lazy and compare their parenting to pet ownership?
Frankly, I didn't use a pacifier with either of my kids. I suppose I could insist on calling it a "plug", claim the moral high ground that *I* could soothe my babies without them while teaching them to self soothe so they weren't dependent on the "plug". But why would I do that? It's a tool in the arsenal of parenting. Kids learn to self soothe eventually, some more readily than others. It doesn't make me a better, more attentive parent or another person less so.
I don't think anyone is advocating a harness in lieu of teaching them. The fact is, the while they are in the process of learning, there are times when it isn't practical or safe work on that particular lesson. Sometimes those times can be avoided but sometimes they just can't. Life isn't put on hold just because your toddler hasn't learned yet. A harness used occasionally won't keep them from learning anything. A lot of it is simply a matter of outgrowing the behavior.
I actually disagree with this. When you have little kids, life IS teaching them. Gotta get to the mall but your preschooler keeps unbuckling their seat belt? Choice. Let the kid ride in the car without the belt or pull over and risk forgoing the mall. Kids learn by what we DO not by what we say. If we claim that THEY have to be responsible for walking safely with Mom except we are going to have this device by which they can actually wander at will without self control, we have told them that we don't really mean that we expect them to exert self control. If we don't expect them to exert self control EVERY time, they won't know when we mean them to really exert self control.
I do kind of think there is a trend in parenting to care to much about what the kids want. It stems partly from not understanding the capacity of little kids. And what we don't expect of them when they are small comes back to haunt us when they are older. There was a post on my Facebook feed recently about wanting to teach life skills like cooking and laundry in schools. I was like, why wouldn't parents teach them at home? Because it is too hard when the are unwilling. UNWILLING?? Grown up people know how to cook. You are learning to be a grown up, so what day do you want to cook this week and what would you like to make? You don't want to? Ok. Your day is Tuesday, and if you want to eat, figure out what you are going to make. Let me know my Monday so I can go to the store. (For the record, I don't want my kids in life skills class at the expense of science, literacy and math... history, geography, politics, current events...)
There is a psychologist parenting educator who talks about kids not growing OUT of behaviors but growing into them. Sure, maybe they won't run out into the street anymore. But they won't have gotten the message that they are responsible for themselves.
The weirdest thing is that it is SO MUCH EASIER this way in the long run than alternatives I have seen. The answer to almost every request your kids make can be YES. Show me you can handle it, and you can do it! Want to go to the park? YES! Understand we don't throw rocks and manhandle other kids. Off to the park. They push another child. Ok, I see you are not ready for the park. Let's go home now. That's ok, I know you will be able to do it next time. Most kids will learn this in one outing. If I want park, I cannot push other kids. But they also learn that Mom means what she says and will back it up with action. (Or Dad. Not trying to be sexist here!) Want park? This is how you behave. Can't behave? No park. Want to go to a restaurant? Yes! But you must use your table manners. (Go somewhere cheap to start.) They start blowing straw wrappers? Ok, I guess you are not ready for restaurants. Food goes away and the kids are taken home. Waste of food, yes. Waste of money? Hells no. I just paid $10 bucks for an education.
I guess what got me thinking about this is that we just got home from vacation. We were at a water park, and my kids saw what they figured was an 8 year old on a leash. They were horrified. I have never, ever, ever commented on leashes. Just did not come up. But they could not understand why the parents would not teach them to be safe at a water park. Since I am not a useless, heartless person, I did explain that we really have no idea what the circumstance is of this family. It could be that this child is learning disabled and unable to learn how to be safe at a water park and that this may be the only way he can play safely.
I guess my point is that there is nothing objectionable about the leash device itself. The thinking that I disagree with is the mechanizing of control rather than expecting self control and thinking that somehow the kids are going to learn self control through osmosis.
Maybe because it's been mentioned numerous times? Not to mention the insistence of calling it a leash, and comparing it to a dog leash
Regarding the recent vacation experience I mention in another post, that is what horrified my daughter. He is a person, not a dog!
Quote:
It's just a tool. One of many tools parents use. Or don't. But for some reason this particular tool brings out more judgement and calling parents lazy than just about any other. I can't come up with any other reason that makes sense.
Ha! I have enlightened! Just kidding. Hopefully haven't pissed you off.
When you have little kids, life IS teaching them. Gotta get to the mall but your preschooler keeps unbuckling their seat belt?
Except that's actually not what most (any? I don't feel like rereading the entire thread) are saying. At all. Not everyday things. Not all the time.
"Sorry, no visits to grandparents across the country because junior's impulse control isn't 100% yet."
"Sorry can't attend a family funeral because my spouse is deployed and junor still struggles with wandering and I have my hands full"
"Sorry, I know our families have planned this trip to Disney for a year or more. I thought we'd be good to go based on my previous child but this one's different. We'll have to forego the deposits and airline tickets. It was planned because older cousins were involved and it was an opportunity for the family to bond but..."
Life happens. Not always how we intend. Sometimes you go with the flow. It's not the end of the world.
I guess what got me thinking about this is that we just got home from vacation. We were at a water park, and my kids saw what they figured was an 8 year old on a leash. They were horrified. I have never, ever, ever commented on leashes. Just did not come up. But they could not understand why the parents would not teach them to be safe at a water park. Since I am not a useless, heartless person, I did explain that we really have no idea what the circumstance is of this family. It could be that this child is learning disabled and unable to learn how to be safe at a water park and that this may be the only way he can play safely.
Your explanation to your children was thoughtful and correct. And no one knows the circumstances of a stranger who is using a harness on a small child. You don't know what that parent is up against, and you don't know that child's abilities. It is just wrong to assume that the harness is being used because the parent is too lazy or ignorant to teach the child to behave properly.
Quote:
The thinking that I disagree with is the mechanizing of control rather than expecting self control and thinking that somehow the kids are going to learn self control through osmosis.
You can not know that the parent is thinking any such thing.
Regarding the recent vacation experience I mention in another post, that is what horrified my daughter. He is a person, not a dog!
Ha! I have enlightened! Just kidding. Hopefully haven't pissed you off.
Not pissed. Confounded. I don't get the vitriol for parents who find something that works for their situation. Particularly when we don't know what that situation actually is. Much easier to point with disdain I guess. Just line em up against a wall with the bottle feeders, the pacifier users, the daycare users etc. One more battle in the mommy wars.
I honestly think a lot of the disdain for leashes surfaces because they actually are NOT an efficient, fully effective child-restraint device.
Users here readily admit that they aren't REALLY teaching the child while using the leash. The consensus from posts here shows that they basically keep the kids from dying/getting kidnapped while "allowing them to burn off energy."
That means the kid on a leash isn't getting the education that a dog on a leash is often getting (sorry if it offends "harness users" but it really is the most logical comparison) when an owner is teaching them to heel, etc. It's more like that dog that is pulling its owner along the path. I have never seen a parent use a leash while actually training a child. It's always JUST a tether.
Which leads to the other reason leashes don't receive the same public approval as strollers: As a tether, they don't fully keep kids under control and out of the way of other people in crowded places, where they are MOST likely to be used.
Much like a retractable dog leash, they are not often used to keep the child as close as possible to the parent and leave a trip/tangle hazard for other adults trying to get through the busy place. Strollers aren't that much better but they usually are kept closer to the body (arm's length) than a leash.
Best wishes to ANY parent trying to wrangle multiple toddlers through an airport. There is no perfect solution, except patience for all parties.
The assertion that using a harness is in place of teaching them to stay close is just complete nonsense. If it were true, we'd have a bunch of 8, 10, 12 year olds that don't know how to stay near their parents because they never learned. Obviously, they are taught, and they learn. Is it necessary to teach them at the airport when I'm juggling 2 preschoolers and bags by myself? No.
It seems that most people who wouldn't use a harness have no problem with a stroller. A stroller is even more constraining than a "leash" but somehow doesn't "look" as bad. A stroller is not always practical, as has already been pointed out, and the main reason that people here seem to not like the harness is because it looks like a dog leash.
Pardon me for being more concerned with actual safety and practicality than appearances. Not one single post here has given an actual good reason for not using a harness.
Not pissed. Confounded. I don't get the vitriol for parents who find something that works for their situation. Particularly when we don't know what that situation actually is. Much easier to point with disdain I guess. Just line em up against a wall with the bottle feeders, the pacifier users, the daycare users etc. One more battle in the mommy wars.
I am sorry that you thought that my posts contained vitriol or disdain. I had an actual point which had very little to do with harnesses.
I am sorry that you thought that my posts contained vitriol or disdain. I had an actual point which had very little to do with harnesses.
I wasn't addressing you in particular, but rather the overall tone of posters who clearly have disdain for those who utilize harnesses/leashes/tethers. I don't understand why it's an issue to argue about. If it's not the method you choose (generic "you") , then why say anything more than that? Why insist that someone else must be lazy or inept. Or a pushover. Can we not have a discussion without damning the opposition?
(And I did get your point but I just don't thinks it's really applicable to the situations we're discussing - which for the most part IS harnesses and their usage. Which is generally for a very limited time and very specific circumstances. I don't recall anyone indicating they planned on walking their toddler in the park every day in the hopes that somehow self control magically appeared.)
Last edited by maciesmom; 07-16-2016 at 02:25 PM..
Except that's actually not what most (any? I don't feel like rereading the entire thread) are saying. At all. Not everyday things. Not all the time.
If not all the time, then when? If you have a 1 year old walker, then by all means do what you need to do. A one year old actually probably can' exercise self control. If that means using a harness (I did not know that calling it a leash was offensive.) then by all means, do that. But at the time that they are capable, if they are not expected to ALL THE TIME, then they won't know when they are.
Quote:
"Sorry, no visits to grandparents across the country because junior's impulse control isn't 100% yet."
"Sorry can't attend a family funeral because my spouse is deployed and junor still struggles with wandering and I have my hands full"
"Sorry, I know our families have planned this trip to Disney for a year or more. I thought we'd be good to go based on my previous child but this one's different. We'll have to forego the deposits and airline tickets. It was planned because older cousins were involved and it was an opportunity for the family to bond but..."
Life happens. Not always how we intend. Sometimes you go with the flow. It's not the end of the world.
Ha ha. You have not met me. I never go with the flow. But I don't actually espouse the whole each child is different motto that people use as an excuse to not figure out their kids. Of course each person is different. But most of us operate in similar ways when it comes to behavior. We do what gets us what we want. We don't do what doesn't.
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