Is it time for American parents to stop farming out their children to be raised by strangers at minimum wage? (wife, playing)
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“Whether that’s the women or the man doesn’t really matter. The point is having children is your responsibility as a couple...not daycare. Yes a nanny is 100% better than daycare, but I still don’t understand what the point of having kids is if you are putting the big bulk of the responsibilities onto someone else. “
School is school... so of course they are taking the responsibility to educate your kids unless you are homeschooling. Why would I have a problem with a parent working while the kids are in school? At this point I have to assume you are a troll. I was under the assumption this thread was about Daycare for young kids... not school.
I think it’s really weird that your brain goes directly to thinking that I’m a man. I’m a women. I see having children as not just something that you do. I see having children as a major life decision where both parents should sit down and go ok who is going to be the one that is with them during the day while the other partner goes to work to bring home the money.
Whether that’s the women or the man doesn’t really matter. The point is having children is your responsibility as a couple...not daycare. Yes a nanny is 100% better than daycare, but I still don’t understand what the point of having kids is if you are putting the big bulk of the responsibilities onto someone else.
You said both of you had careers that were fulfilling....again why have kids if actually parenting full time is not fulfilling?
And this whole argument of nowadays being too expensive to live on one income...yes thats totally true, but guess what ...there’s tons of couples that sat down with a plan and said our lives are not going to be glamorous with the super nice house and the new cars and keeping up with the Jones’s, but we are going to make sacrifices to take on the responsibility to raise our child 100%. If that isn’t fulfilling and doesn’t sound fun I truly believe people shouldn’t have kids because they will always remember that Mommy had to be fulfilled by her career and not me.
This isn’t rocket science people. Do I have children? Not yet, because I’ve worked hard at setting a plan and making sacrifices to be able to be a stay at home if we have kids. And guess what...if I decided that being a parent will not be fulfilling as my career then I’m not going to have kids because that’s not fair to the kids. Not only that...having kids is not just something you do. I believe everyone thinks that though and thats not right.
Having a child is a luxury. If you cant afford to raise them YOURSELF you shouldn’t have them. Especially if you believe that you wont be a good parent because its not fulfilling. So when I say women can not have it all...that applies to anyone that decides they want children. If this was taught in school more people would think twice about whether or not they want or should have kids.
And to the person who said that we all need to work...what do you think a stay at home mom is doing? I babysat my nieces everyday for three weeks while the parents went to work and it was in that moment that I said stay at home Moms work more than the moms that go to their jobs. I even laughed and said that the parents were going on vacation than what I had to deal with with those kids all day. I wish parents would admit that parenting is hard and that by getting a nanny to go to work is a way to stay sane and get away from parenting. Then I would respect it a lot more, but I also think Hello! This is your responsibility...no one forced you to have a kid.
I did ask if you were male. Kind of you to finally answer.
You are female, no kids. Got it.
You grudgingly now say that the couple should decide who will stay home with the kids, but you default to Mommy later in the post.
Fulfillment in a career and as a parent are not mutually exclusive. My sons are proud of what DH and I did (do, for DH; he is still working).
Yep, stay at home moms work: cooking, cleaning, laundry. Do you really think a SAHM does nothing but play with the kids all day?
DH and I came home to a hot meal and had the evenings and weekends with the kids because the nanny did all that work, too, though my work entailed some nights and weekends.
Having help with child care does not mean mom and dad are not parents full time.
If, instead of a nanny, we had had help from my mother, what would you say? Actually, my father provided after school transportation for a while when the boys were too old for the nanny but not yet old enough to drive.
My situation did get complicated. DS #1 was diagnosed with leukemia when he was 13. My career took a detour then. I was self employed with two wonderful partners, so I could handle the kid's many chemo trips and hospitalizations over three years, a somewhat lengthy trip from our home to Atlanta. DH could not handle watching the spinal taps and blood draws. He is too soft hearted. DS just turned 45, has his own family, and works in his dad's office.
I think it’s really weird that your brain goes directly to thinking that I’m a man. I’m a women. I see having children as not just something that you do. I see having children as a major life decision where both parents should sit down and go ok who is going to be the one that is with them during the day while the other partner goes to work to bring home the money.
Whether that’s the women or the man doesn’t really matter. The point is having children is your responsibility as a couple...not daycare. Yes a nanny is 100% better than daycare, but I still don’t understand what the point of having kids is if you are putting the big bulk of the responsibilities onto someone else.
You said both of you had careers that were fulfilling....again why have kids if actually parenting full time is not fulfilling?
And this whole argument of nowadays being too expensive to live on one income...yes thats totally true, but guess what ...there’s tons of couples that sat down with a plan and said our lives are not going to be glamorous with the super nice house and the new cars and keeping up with the Jones’s, but we are going to make sacrifices to take on the responsibility to raise our child 100%. If that isn’t fulfilling and doesn’t sound fun I truly believe people shouldn’t have kids because they will always remember that Mommy had to be fulfilled by her career and not me.
This isn’t rocket science people. Do I have children? Not yet, because I’ve worked hard at setting a plan and making sacrifices to be able to be a stay at home if we have kids. And guess what...if I decided that being a parent will not be fulfilling as my career then I’m not going to have kids because that’s not fair to the kids. Not only that...having kids is not just something you do. I believe everyone thinks that though and thats not right.
Having a child is a luxury. If you cant afford to raise them YOURSELF you shouldn’t have them. Especially if you believe that you wont be a good parent because its not fulfilling. So when I say women can not have it all...that applies to anyone that decides they want children. If this was taught in school more people would think twice about whether or not they want or should have kids.
And to the person who said that we all need to work...what do you think a stay at home mom is doing? I babysat my nieces everyday for three weeks while the parents went to work and it was in that moment that I said stay at home Moms work more than the moms that go to their jobs. I even laughed and said that the parents were going on vacation than what I had to deal with with those kids all day. I wish parents would admit that parenting is hard and that by getting a nanny to go to work is a way to stay sane and get away from parenting. Then I would respect it a lot more, but I also think Hello! This is your responsibility...no one forced you to have a kid.
Probably no point in arguing with you, since you (like the OP, interestingly...) clearly know everything already. But here goes: a lot of working moms, I'd venture to say at least a small majority, did not set out to return to work when their children are still young, but "The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry." Of the women I know who did so out of necessity, their returning to work was not the result of poor planning, expensive tastes, or personal fulfillment; the reasons were generally:
1. Divorce or abandonment
2. Needing health insurance
3. Death or disablement of the wage-earning spouse
4. Wage-earning spouse was laid off and could not find a job with similar income and health insurance
The reality is, the socioeconomic levels that require the most planning and sacrificing to survive on one income are also the most vulnerable to unplannable circumstances that require the safety net of a second income.
FWIW, babysitting for 3 weeks doesn't even come close to the reality of parenting. Try doing that with the added pressure of being at home for years, barely making ends meet, and the youngest child still being a few years off from starting school when you can return to work. And then face the reality of cobbling together affordable childcare for 16 weeks out of the year, while you're still trying to get re-established in the workforce.
Probably no point in arguing with you, since you (like the OP, interestingly...) clearly know everything already. But here goes: a lot of working moms, I'd venture to say at least a small majority, did not set out to return to work when their children are still young, but "The best laid plans of mice and men often go awry." Of the women I know who did so out of necessity, their returning to work was not the result of poor planning, expensive tastes, or personal fulfillment; the reasons were generally:
1. Divorce or abandonment
2. Needing health insurance
3. Death or disablement of the wage-earning spouse
4. Wage-earning spouse was laid off and could not find a job with similar income and health insurance
The reality is, the socioeconomic levels that require the most planning and sacrificing to survive on one income are also the most vulnerable to unplannable circumstances that require the safety net of a second income.
FWIW, babysitting for 3 weeks doesn't even come close to the reality of parenting. Try doing that with the added pressure of being at home for years, barely making ends meet, and the youngest child still being a few years off from starting school when you can return to work. And then face the reality of cobbling together affordable childcare for 16 weeks out of the year, while you're still trying to get re-established in the workforce.
I think it’s really weird that your brain goes directly to thinking that I’m a man. I’m a women. I see having children as not just something that you do. I see having children as a major life decision where both parents should sit down and go ok who is going to be the one that is with them during the day while the other partner goes to work to bring home the money.
This isn’t rocket science people. Do I have children? Not yet.
For Christ's sake women is plural. You are a woman. Why do people not know the difference?
Second, we're all better parents before we have children. The kind of parent you are now as a childless person is not the kind of parent you will be when you have children.
So basically... why even have kids if your not going to parent? So you can, in your own words, “feel capable to do things like men and feel important” You’re admitting that you rather feel more important being a career women than actually doing the parenting so why even have kids? You can’t have both... just like the lie of women can have it all. I honestly believe if you can’t be a SAHM you shouldn’t be a parent, because what’s the point? Your outsourcing parenting. Sure you’re a Mom, but you didn’t raise your kids... somebody else did. Are your kids just an accessory you needed to check off your list? All I hear is me me me. The me me me people should not be having kids. Your kid is a human being that shouldn’t have to exist being parented by other people. Why is this such a hard concept to grasp? This is common sense.
You are making an awfully big jump from working moms to neglectful moms. I don’t think the latter are the norm. Many women parent conscientiously and work. Many women take years away from careers to parent at home. Many women stay home and homeschool. It is not as if there is only one way to parent.
In the old days of my childhood when most mons stayed home, although my mom worked, there were neglectful, uninvolved parents. There always have been—whether or not they worked outside the home.
Our society has changed. It is healthier to accept, and do one’s best to be a good parent, if that is one’s choice, in the circumstances one finds oneself in. There are many people who choose not to parent at all.
You are simply wrong about why women work, by the way. Most women work because of family need. Some working women have high powered careers, but most do not.
My mother taught school when I was growing up. I went back into the work fir e when my kids were school age. My grands have always had two working parents. All of us love our offspring and have worked hard at parenting. You have some mistaken ideas.
I think it’s really weird that your brain goes directly to thinking that I’m a man. I’m a women. I see having children as not just something that you do. I see having children as a major life decision where both parents should sit down and go ok who is going to be the one that is with them during the day while the other partner goes to work to bring home the money.
Whether that’s the women or the man doesn’t really matter. The point is having children is your responsibility as a couple...not daycare. Yes a nanny is 100% better than daycare, but I still don’t understand what the point of having kids is if you are putting the big bulk of the responsibilities onto someone else.
You said both of you had careers that were fulfilling....again why have kids if actually parenting full time is not fulfilling?
And this whole argument of nowadays being too expensive to live on one income...yes thats totally true, but guess what ...there’s tons of couples that sat down with a plan and said our lives are not going to be glamorous with the super nice house and the new cars and keeping up with the Jones’s, but we are going to make sacrifices to take on the responsibility to raise our child 100%. If that isn’t fulfilling and doesn’t sound fun I truly believe people shouldn’t have kids because they will always remember that Mommy had to be fulfilled by her career and not me.
This isn’t rocket science people. Do I have children? Not yet, because I’ve worked hard at setting a plan and making sacrifices to be able to be a stay at home if we have kids. And guess what...if I decided that being a parent will not be fulfilling as my career then I’m not going to have kids because that’s not fair to the kids. Not only that...having kids is not just something you do. I believe everyone thinks that though and thats not right.
Having a child is a luxury. If you cant afford to raise them YOURSELF you shouldn’t have them. Especially if you believe that you wont be a good parent because its not fulfilling. So when I say women can not have it all...that applies to anyone that decides they want children. If this was taught in school more people would think twice about whether or not they want or should have kids.
And to the person who said that we all need to work...what do you think a stay at home mom is doing? I babysat my nieces everyday for three weeks while the parents went to work and it was in that moment that I said stay at home Moms work more than the moms that go to their jobs. I even laughed and said that the parents were going on vacation than what I had to deal with with those kids all day. I wish parents would admit that parenting is hard and that by getting a nanny to go to work is a way to stay sane and get away from parenting. Then I would respect it a lot more, but I also think Hello! This is your responsibility...no one forced you to have a kid.
Every parent was the best parent before they had kids. You have no idea what it is or takes to be a parent until a baby that is minutes old is placed in your arms. Babysitting your nieces for 3 weeks doesn't count.
Parenting is hard and a lot of work especially when they are young and then as they get older and into middle and high school it's still hard just in different ways.
I worked from home from when my kids were both born until the oldest was in 4th grade. It was the first time I had worked in an office in 11 + years. I loved it. I'm back to WFH because of COVID and I can't wait to get back into an office a couple of days a week. It doesn't make me a bad mom. I'm still very involved in my kid's lives.
You are making an awfully big jump from working moms to neglectful moms. I don’t think the latter are the norm. Many women parent conscientiously and work. Many women take years away from careers to parent at home. Many women stay home and homeschool. It is not as if there is only one way to parent.
In the old days of my childhood when most mons stayed home, although my mom worked, there were neglectful, uninvolved parents. There always have been—whether or not they worked outside the home.
Our society has changed. It is healthier to accept, and do one’s best to be a good parent, if that is one’s choice, in the circumstances one finds oneself in. There are many people who choose not to parent at all.
You are simply wrong about why women work, by the way. Most women work because of family need. Some working women have high powered careers, but most do not.
My mother taught school when I was growing up. I went back into the work fir e when my kids were school age. My grands have always had two working parents. All of us love our offspring and have worked hard at parenting. You have some mistaken ideas.
Honestly, I think the modern nuclear family, with the expectation that 100% of the child rearing be done by the parents, is what has made parenting so difficult and lonely. Throughout history, mothers had a built-in network of extended family, tribe, and village to help raise their children. For better or for worse, paid child care has become a substitute for that, because of that primal need.
We also have this notion that mothers must be martyrs for the cause, and constantly put aside their own needs and happiness, long after children need constant physical care. I see this with moms I know who want to go back to work, even if it’s very part time, just to have a little something meaningful outside of the house... but their husband and children are against because that means Mom won’t be home ‘round the clock to do every little thing for them. They all have lives outside of the house, but for some reason Mom is considered selfish for wanting/needing a little of the same for her self.
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