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Old 03-05-2021, 01:33 PM
 
1,247 posts, read 514,558 times
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OP, I feel very sad to read your post about your youngest brother, and I feel related to your mom. I had been suffering from my oldest son for a long, long time… And finally, he moved out on his own when he was close to 30 years old.

I'll try to make my story short, but it may still be long.

My son was almost like your mom’s youngest son. He always argued with most of everything my husband and I asked him to do. He sounded very entitled and always compared himself with his rich friends who got so many expensive materials from their parents, and he compared us with his rich friends’ parents who are doctors, dentist, surgeon, etc... Some of the friends were successful in studying and having a career, and others were not. I was thinking how did his friends’ parents give them so much? They (the friends) must have been good or listening to their parents in some way. Or maybe many of those parents were upset and disappointed in their children too, who knew? We are not poor, but not greatly rich. We worked hard and wanted to save for our children’s college or university fees.

My son was/is handsome, healthy and not stupid (I would say he was pretty smart A because he learned so many things from his A, or not A, friends), but he has not gotten a degree from the time he finished HS till now. He never held a job for more than two years. He went to university on and off, it was like just to show off that he was going to UNIVERSITY, and was being “busy”. When he was home, he always closed the door and played games and did whatever, my husband and I would not know. He always locked his door, did not let us to come in to talk to him. We were very upset and even angry because he was grown up and still living at home, doing nothing, always arguing with us when we taught him what we thought was right and he should do. But that was not what he wanted hear. He did lots of things to make us feel very sad and angry. We did not want to kick him out in a bad way. And we might or would feel guilty because I was thinking what parents would kick their children out when they don’t have a job and money to live on their own? In my heart and mind, I knew that that was not our fault that he did not have a job and could not take care of himself. He was grown up and capable to find a job and live on his own. But he was just too lazy and did not want to work hard. He even told us he did not want to grow up, he wanted to be a little child forever. It was very hard to hear because he was not little anymore.

One day I saw an article “Thirty-year-old man who's being evicted from his parents house”, and here’s the link: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...illennial.html I felt happy for his parents. I was thinking I should do that too. Somehow, I could not.

I’d been reading a lot of posts about parenting adult children on this forum and others. I learned that every family has problems/issues. Most parents have some children who are good to them, and some others are not. And some parents are good, and some parents are not good also. One time, I learned from this forum that this person said “Children are like fruits on trees. Some fruits ripen earlier than some others.” That means some children can become mature early; some others late. It was very helpful and encouraging to me to be patient.

I didn’t (still don’t) know what I did wrong? I’d always been treating, teaching my two sons the same (as I think and believe) but they turned out quite different. I just have to think people are different. They learn and perceive things and react differently. You cannot change others. You can only change yourself. I learned about a poem re children in this forum, which is very touching:

On Children by Kahlil Gibran

Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.
You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
Which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
But seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.
You are the bows from which your children
As living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite,
And He bends you with His might
That His arrows may go swift and far.
Let your bending in the archer's hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies,
So He loves also the bow that is stable.


Anyway, from the day my older son moved out, our house is much peaceful. Although I do miss him (I do have many good memories about him when he was little), but I feel very relieved. He never came back for many months already. I called, texted and sent him emails sometimes, would like to know how he was doing, but he never replied. I don’t feel sad much. I just think wherever he is, whatever he does, I wish him well. I have to think he’s an adult now, he has to be responsible for his life. If he is still my son, someday he will call me and/or come home. Someday, when or if he has a family and children of his own, he will understand better. I suffered and tolerated the bad things from him. I treasured the good things about him.

A friend of mine has two sons. The older one listened to her, loved her so much, did everything to make her happy from young. The younger one was opposite. Her heart was broken because of this younger one. But one day he changed. He got a job, kept it, worked hard, had a GF, then got married and had a child. It was like a miracle.

I don’t know what advice to give to your parents to kick that boy out. But for you, if you feel so troubled to live at home with your parents and have to see such a difficult situation everyday, you can move out on your own. You will have peace and can focus on your own life. You are an adult too. You should not live at home with your parents. This is Canada, not some country in Asia. You can move to wherever you want. You can make an example for your younger brother to see, and he might learn from you. You can help your parents by listening to them, when they need someone to vent, or by talking to them about nice things you can think of. My younger son did. And he’s been calling me and coming home to visit us every weekend. I feel very grateful to have such a good son.

Life contains good and bad together. Nobody can have all the good things or the bad things only.

I’ve learned something in life that nothing will last forever, things will always change, and everything shall pass.

Last edited by AnOrdinaryCitizen; 03-05-2021 at 02:14 PM..
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Old 03-05-2021, 02:43 PM
 
18,731 posts, read 16,697,677 times
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I think the parents could have already done many things to make it very uncomfortable for him to stay. Like removing his furniture and the door of his room, change the locks and require someone to let him in when he wants to come into the home, change the wifi password, etc. But they haven't done ANYTHING.

They're not serious. They are more worried about what their "culture" will think.
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Old 03-05-2021, 04:24 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
9,373 posts, read 5,591,277 times
Reputation: 24595
Quote:
Originally Posted by zentropa View Post
I think the parents could have already done many things to make it very uncomfortable for him to stay. Like removing his furniture and the door of his room, change the locks and require someone to let him in when he wants to come into the home, change the wifi password, etc. But they haven't done ANYTHING.
I suspect that until very recently they didn't want Slacker Son to move out, but rather to grow up (as their older three kids did). Now they are beginning to realize that that isn't going to happen absent an intervention of some sort, and might be more willing to start putting pressure on him by doing the sort of things you mention.
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Old 03-05-2021, 05:57 PM
 
2,093 posts, read 1,070,667 times
Reputation: 8341
I had a co-worker whose daughter was still living with them when she was 30. They paid for 2 college degrees (she decided she didn't like working in the profession her first degree trained her for, so they paid for a second) and after the second degree, she just did part-time temp work whenever she wanted spending money. They finally decided to inform her they were selling their house and moving to a 55 plus retirement community, which they did. This also prevented her from trying to move in with them again because of the age restrictions. Of course, it may not be a feasible solution for your parents but it sure worked for my co-worker and her husband.
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Old 03-05-2021, 06:47 PM
 
519 posts, read 128,649 times
Reputation: 904
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnOrdinaryCitizen View Post

My son was almost like your mom’s youngest son. He always argued with most of everything my husband and I asked him to do.

My son was/is handsome, healthy and not stupid (I would say he was pretty smart A because he learned so many things from his A, or not A, friends), but he has not gotten a degree from the time he finished HS till now. He never held a job for more than two years. He went to university on and off, it was like just to show off that he was going to UNIVERSITY, and was being “busy”. When he was home, he always closed the door and played games and did whatever, my husband and I would not know. He always locked his door, did not let us to come in to talk to him. We were very upset and even angry because he was grown up and still living at home, doing nothing, always arguing with us when we taught him what we thought was right and he should do. But that was not what he wanted hear. He did lots of things to make us feel very sad and angry. We did not want to kick him out in a bad way. And we might or would feel guilty because I was thinking what parents would kick their children out when they don’t have a job and money to live on their own? In my heart and mind, I knew that that was not our fault that he did not have a job and could not take care of himself. He was grown up and capable to find a job and live on his own. But he was just too lazy and did not want to work hard. He even told us he did not want to grow up, he wanted to be a little child forever. It was very hard to hear because he was not little anymore.

How did you son pull it together and finally decide to move out? It would be interesting to know as you said he was much like the OP's son.
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Old 03-05-2021, 10:24 PM
 
1,247 posts, read 514,558 times
Reputation: 3317
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shallow Hal View Post
How did you son pull it together and finally decide to move out? It would be interesting to know as you said he was much like the OP's son.
From what the OP wrote, I believe my son is quite older than his youngest brother, not his son. We (my husband and I) were quite fed up with him, but we learned we needed to control ourselves also. We learned to talk to him less because he said we "lecture" too much. We did not give him any money, gift, materials at all anymore. We still cooked for him and ate together, or he would come to eat when we finished. But after each meal he had to wash the dishes. We told him firmly that he had to shovel the snow and mow the lawn because he still lived with us and did not pay any money at all, he had to do something. He argued a lot, but we left him alone sometimes, and he did it after a while. So, that was okay. He said he hated to do all those things, and he said someday he would find an apartment and move out, and he would not have to do all those chores. I was thinking to myself that would be great.

I learned that sometimes strangers treat each other better than family members and respect each other more because they are not so close to each other and don't talk to or lecture each other so much, and they don't know each other's faults and ugly dirty things. Thus, they don't criticize each other as much, and therefore they don't get mad and argue or fight with each other so much. Lots of times, people, old and young, want to be left a lone, to have privacy and respect. Of course, adult children are adults, they want privacy and respect, they should move out and live on their own and be responsible for their life. But many adult children take a long time to become mature and responsible.

So, we tried very hard to learn to leave him alone. I believe maturity comes with age also, more or less, or sooner or later. He did work off and one, so he had money too. And one day he told us he was going to move out at the end of the month. We said okay, but did not promise him anything because we learned that when we offered or promised him this and that, he would fall back. The day he was moving out, we helped him to move his things. We were just doing things calmly.

And the rest as you know in my last post.
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Old 03-06-2021, 12:11 AM
 
1,636 posts, read 572,317 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CraigCreek View Post
Gimme a break, Mr. Millennial. The twenty year old "child" (!) in question needs to understand some REAL "truths regarding life and existence". Allowing himself to be coddled while doing nothing productive for himself, his family, or society but instead eating his parents' food, living in their house, smoking weed, playing video games and using foul language towards his no doubt long-suffering mother does not make him "pretty astute regarding this existence". Instead, it vividly shows him to be nothing more than a barnacle, or perhaps a parasite would be more accurate, not only dependent on others for his existence but sucking the life out of those others while doing so.
Nope. Reread the post - its a moral obligation for the child to stay with the parent for as long as seen fit. What exactly is the definition of "productive" here? It seems quite subjective, considering how expendable people are in this modern day society. The behavior here isn't parasitic, because the child did not ask to be whisked into this hellish planet, riddled w/ charades of expectations, and stacked with loads of horrors, atrocities, and other such traits of the meat-grinder. Then, the end of life comes, rendering the whole thing pointless.

Parenthood is 100% a mental illness, if you really think about it. Especially the way it is portrayed in Western, Industrialized capitalist societies. Even having pets (i.e. dog, cat, etc) is loads and loads of work. With the incentives I see from many of these "prospective" parents, they are better off simply just getting dolls,Tamagotchis, or even Digimon and Pokemon.
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Old 03-06-2021, 01:39 AM
 
Location: NJ
15,876 posts, read 24,658,489 times
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The OP hasn't been here since Tuesday, we're all talking to ourselves. I guess we'll never get replies to our questions.

My one question is why did s/he want to use force...
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Old 03-06-2021, 02:45 AM
 
2,863 posts, read 993,103 times
Reputation: 3982
Quote:
Originally Posted by CatTX View Post
I had a co-worker whose daughter was still living with them when she was 30. They paid for 2 college degrees (she decided she didn't like working in the profession her first degree trained her for, so they paid for a second) and after the second degree, she just did part-time temp work whenever she wanted spending money. They finally decided to inform her they were selling their house and moving to a 55 plus retirement community, which they did. This also prevented her from trying to move in with them again because of the age restrictions. Of course, it may not be a feasible solution for your parents but it sure worked for my co-worker and her husband.
Lol is the daughter living an apartment ?
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Old 03-06-2021, 07:21 AM
 
519 posts, read 128,649 times
Reputation: 904
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnOrdinaryCitizen View Post

I believe maturity comes with age also, more or less, or sooner or later. He did work off and one, so he had money too. And one day he told us he was going to move out at the end of the month. We said okay, but did not promise him anything because we learned that when we offered or promised him this and that, he would fall back. The day he was moving out, we helped him to move his things. We were just doing things calmly.

And the rest as you know in my last post.
Glad that everything worked out for you and your family. It sounds like you made it through to the other side relatively unscathed. Thanks for the helpful post, especially from someone who has "walked the walk."
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