Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I understand the point of this post but not all parents in the United States are able to save much money these days. The 1% are lucky and I'm sure there are others who make it work but life is just plain expensive these days if you have a mortgage and kids
We took our kids to Disney when they were 2 and 4, then again at 3 and 5. I admit that I had fun, I'd never been to Disney and aside from the crowds I enjoy. I asked my kids what their favorite part was and both said the pool. So keep that in mind with kids. Expensive things aren't necessarily needed...but probably wanted moreso by the parents.
There are some costs in life that are unavoidable when it comes to kids. My daughter is taking dance class where we had to pay a fee for that (involved buying ballet and tap shoes in addition to the cost of the class), hockey for both kids (lord knows what the final costs were there) soccer cleats for my son and daughter. I don't mind paying for things they enjoy but it does add up.
Private vs Public is a personal choice. I live in MA and we have some of the best schools in the country. Public still isn't good enough for some people though. One of the parents on my sons hockey team are very well to do. Both parents are Ivy League educated, they live in a 3mil dollar home and have a 2 mil dollar vacation home. They are moving because they are tired of the public schools where they live yet I know others who would kill to get into this town for the public schools. He's mostly irate over political issues but he's moved his Family away and sending his high school kids to boarding school. I listened to what he had to say but sometimes one mans trash is another mans treasure. I think the schools where he lives are fine but I guess he can do better
I try to remember that there will always be people that have more money than me. Just because they make certain choices doesn't mean that is the choice for my family. In the end of a child is smart and has a healthy upbringing i think they'll be ok wherever they go
When we were young (and middle aged) parents, we wanted and did all the same things that most parents seem to do. We wanted our kids to have all the best possible training and experiences. We wanted them to go to the “best” possible schools, and the best summer camps for learning etc. We spent a bloody fortune on educational/developmental toys and products, videos, private lessons and tutoring, summer camps. Music and piano lessons, language instruction, math camp, educational or experiential or memory building trips events and vacations, even private schools when the public schools did not seem to be doing a good job for some of our kids. The whole nine yards. Most of our friends did the same thing. We all scrimped on our personal spending, comfort etc so we could help our family develop great memories, experiences and education.
Our kids and our friends kids all seemed to do quite well for the most part. Good grades, scholarships for college . . . etc . . but:
1. Some of our kids and some of our friends kid's took the college thing to the full finish “successful” type career paths (PhDs and other doctor titles). Other of our kids and quite a few of our friend's kids took a different path and either did not finish college or went into subjects where all the great grades, test scores specialized teaching etc were really of little or no benefit to them (or in one case joined the military). One of our kids got accepted to an engineering superschool. He chose to major in music at a less competitive school and is becoming a music teacher instead. AP calculus is not going to help him one bit. Math camp - nope he did not really need that. Another attuned three plus years of engineering school on a scholarship and was miserable he hatted it and realized becoming an engineer would leave him miserable for his whole life. He quit college altogether and became a rowing coach. Now he is happy, but the private school with specialized focus in mathematics for gifted kids was pretty much a waste of our money.
2. Our kids and friends kids who went to private schools and had better and more tutoring etc, did not do better than the older kids who went to (often bad) public schools and had a lot less special training, tutoring camps etc. Our friends who had a lot of money and sent their kids to the top p[private schools for their education – their kids did not do substantially better than other kids (ours and our friend’s.) Some of their kids did really well, others less so. All the money spent on the best possible learning tools did not give them an edge, it just depended on the individual kid.
..
I guess I'm detecting something else in here. The idea that parents can steer their children's path to a desired "successful" result that they had predetermined. Is there a reason why you define success as "PhDs and other doctor titles?" Or why joining the military is somehow less successful? When my son was 17 he came to me to ask if I'd be disappointed in him if he chose the military over college. I told him "how can I be disappointed in him for choosing to serve his country? That if that's what he chose, when he turned 18 I'd drive him to the recruiting station and shake his hand and be very proud of him for making his own decision." (side note: he chose both and will commission as an officer upon graduation.)
Picking what we want is not the point of educational or other opportunities. The point of providing multiple opportunities and experiences is to expose them to a variety of things that will help them grow into their own person and chose the path that will make them successful in what they want out of life.
I don't begrudge a cent of the money we spent on our kids, and plenty of it was just to give them experiences that we wanted them to have. We never thought they would get scholarships when we were forking out for travel ball, or ice hockey, but they wanted to play, and we knew there were plenty of other things they could spend their time on that could lead to trouble. We lived in a state with excellent public schools. When one son wanted to attend a private high school instead, we said okay. Camps, lessons, travel, no problem.
I don't think parents who cannot afford the extras are cheating their kids, as long as they give of their time. That's how I grew up, in a large family. We had some extras, but nothing close to what my kids had. But I also don't think parents that can afford to let their children dabble in many areas are doing them a disservice either.
When we were young (and middle aged) parents, we wanted and did all the same things that most parents seem to do. We wanted our kids to have all the best possible training and experiences. We wanted them to go to the “best” possible schools, and the best summer camps for learning etc. We spent a bloody fortune on educational/developmental toys and products, videos, private lessons and tutoring, summer camps. Music and piano lessons, language instruction, math camp, educational or experiential or memory building trips events and vacations, even private schools when the public schools did not seem to be doing a good job for some of our kids. The whole nine yards. Most of our friends did the same thing. We all scrimped on our personal spending, comfort etc so we could help our family develop great memories, experiences and education.
Our kids and our friends kids all seemed to do quite well for the most part. Good grades, scholarships for college . . . etc . . but:
1. Some of our kids and some of our friends kid's took the college thing to the full finish “successful” type career paths (PhDs and other doctor titles). Other of our kids and quite a few of our friend's kids took a different path and either did not finish college or went into subjects where all the great grades, test scores specialized teaching etc were really of little or no benefit to them (or in one case joined the military). One of our kids got accepted to an engineering superschool. He chose to major in music at a less competitive school and is becoming a music teacher instead. AP calculus is not going to help him one bit. Math camp - nope he did not really need that. Another attuned three plus years of engineering school on a scholarship and was miserable he hatted it and realized becoming an engineer would leave him miserable for his whole life. He quit college altogether and became a rowing coach. Now he is happy, but the private school with specialized focus in mathematics for gifted kids was pretty much a waste of our money.
2. Our kids and friends kids who went to private schools and had better and more tutoring etc, did not do better than the older kids who went to (often bad) public schools and had a lot less special training, tutoring camps etc. Our friends who had a lot of money and sent their kids to the top p[private schools for their education – their kids did not do substantially better than other kids (ours and our friend’s.) Some of their kids did really well, others less so. All the money spent on the best possible learning tools did not give them an edge, it just depended on the individual kid.
3. All those neat camping trips and ski trips, and other memory building things we spent so much money on? The kids do not remember them well, if at all. What they remember more? That time we all woke up and put on some loud music and danced the entire morning while we were getting ready for school/work; the songs we used to sing in the car on their way to school; the dead cat we found under the house; the day we walked to church (7 miles) because our car was broken and it was a nice day. Some of the costly trips - not one of the five of them can even remember that we went. Other trips they remember a few things they saw or did, or at least remember that we went on the trip, but very few of the costly endeavors to create great memories actually did create great memories. Their great memories came form other things and they remember surprisingly little, especially before about 10 - 12 years old. .
4. You must be very careful about ever showing disappointment in your kids accomplishments or choices. If you just spend $20,000 on Hockey costs and training and travel etc and your kids is doing really well and you are thinking scholarship city then he tells you that he hates hockey and wants to play the tuba instead. Do not express disappointment. Just accept that he likes tuba and not hockey despite what you want, o what you thought was best for him or what your spent. Nothing will mess up a kid more and faster and longer than a parent even inadvertently expressing any form of disappointment in their kids.
Not saying that you should do nothing to improve your kid's education, just that you should cool it a bit. You do not need to do all the things, spend all of your money on this stuff. It really does not help them all that much, not enough to make a difference in the long run.
The bottom line is if your kids are meant to do well in something, they will do well in it. All the camps, toys, videos, tutors trips and other costly BS do not change anything in the long run. Don’t buy the trendy pricy building set or electronics set. Get some empty cardboard boxes and a roll of duct tape and built a fort, or take apart a flashlight together and figure out how it works. You do not need baby Mozart, math camp, hooked on learning, my little engineer playset etc. Forget that crap and spend more of your money on yourself. (Unfortunately this will trigger a large number of parents who spent all the money and did all the things like we did and will feel a desperate need to defend and justify their life choices. However it does not change who your kids are going to be. dont make the same mistakes our generation has.)
Regarding remembering the vacations? This was discussed somewhere else the other day and I piped up with the fact that out out of all the vacations my parents and I took, my dad always made sure there was a pool. We went to Williamsburg I enjoyed that, but the best part was the pool. On our way to visit relatives in another state it was a two day trip, there was a pool each hotel. I don’t know if my father felt having a pool was the height of luxury or what and he’s not here to ask, but I can remember very fondly my father and I in pools, swimming and roughhousing and him teaching me to swim and dive. He actually taught me how to dive when we were in Bar Harbor Maine, which is a trip we did a camper which was like packing the family in a bathroom for a week. But when we stayed in a camp ground it had a pool!
I’m sure my mother would’ve liked for me to remember the history that she was so desperately trying to teach us because she felt vacation should be educational, and I do, and some of the food. But mainly the pools…
One thing I do see parents doing is forcing kids into activities they clearly don’t enjoy when they express an interest for another activity that is less preferable to the parent. For example, I have a lot of friends who are super into sports, but their kids aren’t particularly sporty. If your kid is artsy, likes to cook, etc., why are you forcing her to do volleyball or soccer just because you like to coach it or personally like that better?
Yes, this is my pet peeve that I see parents do.
My son is 31 now. When he was a child, I let him explore activities and find out which ones he really enjoyed. I got a lot of flak from some parents for not "making" him do team sports. He hated team sports. He's a marathon runner and avid mountaineer who has climbed some of the first ascents of different routes on several peaks. He just doesn't like playing with balls. Instead of soccer stuff I bought him crampons and ice axes when he was in high school. Now he's own his third or fourth sets of both, he uses them so often. What he DID settle on as a kid was chess, and music. He's a USCF Life Master-level player, and making a living teaching both of those things.
I guess if you have kids who aren't motivated to do anything except sit inside and play video games, maybe they need a little push to find other interests. But most kids will find them on their own. Your job is to support their choices.
But, do you? Or do we trust that they can find what interests them?
I really appreciate your post, OP. I'm in the thick of it with 3 kiddos and that feeling of "never good enough" and "doing it all wrong" all of the time. We have not pushed our kids to take music lessons, try sports, etc. because we have neither the time nor money to give myself that PITA. So it does feel as though we are 'failing' them, especially when we are surrounded by more affluent families with stay-at-home PTA warrior types that cater to the kids 100%.
It has been abundantly clear to me, even before birth, that my kids are their own people. It doesn't matter what I want/say/do to a large extent. I see my job more like "Don't break it and then stand out of the way."
It's reassuring to hear from those who have BTDT that we're not ruining everything.
Rest assured, you're not.
But:
First do no harm.
Second, provide security and show abundant love.
No parent ever read to me.
I never was tutored.
Never had a private lesson in anything.
I ate out TWICE before HS graduation.
We took ONE vacation... to Cape Cod from LI.
I did not participate in organized sports but played endlessly in the street.
How'd I do?
At 11 years old I read at or above 12th grade level .
Then skipped a grade and thrived under pressure.
Took 5 yrs of math in HS.
Appled MYSELF to and started Queens College, with a Regent's Scholarship of $600/yr at 16 and graduated at 20.
Started work @IBM at the dawn of the Information Age.
I am now retired very comfortably and happily in PBC, Fl.
I adored my parents, may they rest in peace.
There are many paths (without expensivive tolls) to happiness.
I understand the point of this post but not all parents in the United States are able to save much money these days. The 1% are lucky and I'm sure there are others who make it work but life is just plain expensive these days if you have a mortgage and kids
I did not necessarily mean save the moeny as in invest it someplace, but save moeny as in do not spend it on basically wasteful keeping up with the joneses parenting. I suggested spending it on yourself. But saving it can be a good idea too.
The point is our society drives us to spend way too much on our kids trying to give them advantages over other kids or at least keep up when the expenditures really do not make enough difference, if any to be worthwhile. We now over focus on our kids. We measure our success as humans on the societal "success" of our kids (how well they do in school, sports and the arts, how much they make as young adult or prestigious jobs, etc. What we need to learn to accept is that our kids are going to follow their own path and do as well as they do regardless of our attempts to interfere by spending gobs of money on them.
In a way, I think it's hard to determine what the kids will remember and what they will not. So all of the experiences are good to have just do not overdo it. Pictures will help a lot with remembering these times too. As far as placing them in multiple sports or extracurricular activities is good to bc in a way it opens their minds to the possibilities and or the possibility of finding a thing they are passionate about that they would not have known existed otherwise. Again I think there is a balance between it all. We like to expose them to things and then tell us what they want more experience in and then make arrangements to do so.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Solly says — Be nice!
