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Old 11-08-2021, 04:04 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
30,486 posts, read 16,198,344 times
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Since you stipulated she had to get a useful degree, why not ask her what she plans on doing with the field she's chosen.


Going to college should be to obtain a goal other than not having a job for for yrs.
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Old 11-08-2021, 04:55 PM
 
17,349 posts, read 16,485,995 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
I think the OP said, she completed Calc 1, but couldn't face Calc 2, which is what motivated her to switch majors. Maybe I misunderstood.
The daughter started off as an Accounting major. Accounting majors usually have to take Business Calculus which is not a substitute for Calc 1 (science/engineering/some Econ majors).

It sounds as though the daughter suffered through Business Calc but decided that Accounting was not for her. She does not now want to take the Calc series required for science/engineering majors so she has decided to stay in the business field that she started out with but instead of Accounting she'll major in Econ.

The only thing that she might possibly want to check is that her concentration of Econ does not require Calc 1 because some programs do.

Honestly, she sounds like she has her act together so it probably is not even a worry. Likely she's talked to her course advisor, as well as, professors in her business school. It doesn't hurt to double check the degree requirements/graduation plan of courses and their prerequisites. Like I said, she is probably good to go but it doesn't hurt to double check.
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Old 11-08-2021, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Australia
3,602 posts, read 2,304,420 times
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Daughter studied geography, economics and business studies as part of her degree. Is now an investment fund manager and very highly paid. But works incredibly hard, as you do.

Other daughter started off studying engineering, dropped out with one semester to go. Eventually finished a degree with major in marketing. Has a very worthwhile position in communications working on the Covid response at the moment. Is able to work three days a week with reasonable pay for her efforts.

One is not more worthwhile than the other. Just different paths.
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Old 11-08-2021, 05:34 PM
 
Location: Bloomington IN
8,590 posts, read 12,334,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weather088 View Post
I can’t think of any job that somebody can pursue with an economics degree besides economist. But that requires a PhD AND extensive math, which she doesn’t want to do
A quick google search will show all types of jobs available to those with a degree in economics including financial analysts, banking, etc.

I think it's a bigger waste of money to force your daughter to pursue a degree in a "parent-approved" area she dislikes. I can almost guarantee she won't be working in any of those fields within 5 years of graduation if you force her into something she doesn't like. You will have then paid for a "useless" degree.

Of course, I'm one of those old fashioned parents that think a college degree in and of itself is a worthwhile pursuit. It's the way one learns to think, the reading, the writing and the research which is of value in my antiquated opinion. I was fine when our daughter began her college career as an English and Spanish major. She moved to another area when she discovered she loved programming. It's helped in her career that she has excellent writing skills. I was just as fine when our son pursued a degree in computer science with a history minor. He learned about research and also improved his writing and communication skills. He needs both in his work.

Being married to an English major that successfully ran his own consulting firm for decades may influence my Psychology major brain though. The old English major and Psychology major that paid for their own educations with student loans and work did well enough that our children graduated debt free from college.

Last edited by rrah; 11-08-2021 at 05:45 PM..
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Old 11-08-2021, 06:39 PM
 
10,609 posts, read 5,639,469 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weather088 View Post
She originally chose accounting. She is currently almost finished with her 3rd semester and decided change her major to a Bachelor of Arts in Economics because she thought calculus was “too hard” and she didn’t want to have to take “calculus 2”...
Sorry, but something doesn't smell right.

If she took introductory accounting her first year, she'd be in intermediate accounting in her 3rd semester. Intermediate accounting is generally the "wash out" class to persuade would-be accounting majors that it isn't the right major for them. Intermediate accounting typically is the hardest accounting class of the major. It is all downhill from there.

I wonder if the daughter mis-communicated somehow - perhaps she doesn't want to be in Intermediate Accounting because of its rigor, not Calc 2.

I checked with a friend who is a retired Professor of Accounting regarding a calculus requirement. He has a BA in economics/BS in accounting/MS in accounting/MBA/MS in Taxation/PhD, has his CPA license, and was on the faculty of the graduate school of business at the University of Southern California (USC Marshall) prior to retirement. His professional focus has always been on corporate taxation.

He never took any calculus as an undergrad, and never needed to have taken it in any grad work or as a Professor/department chair. Some schools have calculus requirement, but not all by any means.


The real issue, IMHO, likely is not Calculus or Linear Programming (linear optimization techniques) or the like.

The real question is, "Is the daughter analytical by nature?" Not everyone is. That doesn't mean non-analytical people are dumb. It doesn't mean non-analytical people don't have a place in the world.

A good friend of ours doesn't have an analytical bone in her body. But she has a heart of gold and the world is a better place because she is in it (she's a special ed teacher, dealing with autistic kids in early elementary school). An absolute heart of gold. But even simple analytical thought such as "if A then B, if B then C, therefore if A then C" completely escapes her. All discussions involving any type of analysis, to her, are immediately replaced with emotions and feelings. To her, the important question is "how would "A feel? How would B feel? How would C feel?" and the like.

But she has an absolute heart of gold and perhaps the kindest and most empathetic person I know.

***
BTW, every credible econ major needs at least a year of calc under their belt. Finance majors typically need more math than that.
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Old 11-08-2021, 07:43 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
19,480 posts, read 25,132,491 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrah View Post
A quick google search will show all types of jobs available to those with a degree in economics including financial analysts, banking, etc.

I think it's a bigger waste of money to force your daughter to pursue a degree in a "parent-approved" area she dislikes. I can almost guarantee she won't be working in any of those fields within 5 years of graduation if you force her into something she doesn't like. You will have then paid for a "useless" degree.

Of course, I'm one of those old fashioned parents that think a college degree in and of itself is a worthwhile pursuit. It's the way one learns to think, the reading, the writing and the research which is of value in my antiquated opinion. I was fine when our daughter began her college career as an English and Spanish major. She moved to another area when she discovered she loved programming. It's helped in her career that she has excellent writing skills. I was just as fine when our son pursued a degree in computer science with a history minor. He learned about research and also improved his writing and communication skills. He needs both in his work.

Being married to an English major that successfully ran his own consulting firm for decades may influence my Psychology major brain though. The old English major and Psychology major that paid for their own educations with student loans and work did well enough that our children graduated debt free from college.

I remember one of my classmates in high school graduated a year early and started college at age 16 (due to parental pressure). She had been in many of my classes and while she was definitely well above average in intelligence she wasn't, in my opinion, super smart. Her father was a successful attorney and wanted her to follow in his footsteps, since he loved it and it was such a lucrative career. After finishing her undergrad degree in record time, her father insisted that she go to law school. He paid all of her college expenses and didn't "allow" her to have a real college life. No part-time jobs, no extra-curriculum activities, no sports, no vacations and no dating or parties so she could concentrate on studying so that she would have a lucrative career as an attorney, just like him.

She stopped by our high school when we were seniors. She was envious of all the fun things that the seniors were doing, going to prom, parties, high school sports, checking out colleges, senior class play, etc. All those things that she wasn't able to do. The next time that I saw her was at our HS 10 year reunion. She had graduated law school several years earlier and had started her law career.

In fact, I recall that she was already teaching at a law school. Apparently, the absolute youngest professor that the school had ever employed. And, she had won several awards for various law related activities. You would think that she would be happy and proud of her accomplishments. But, she absolutely hated being an attorney and absolutely hated her parents for pushing her to become a lawyer. She was very jealous of the rest of us having jobs and careers that we loved.

Although, we lost touch, I was told that a few years later she cut all ties with her parents. quit her career as a law professor, and left the law profession completely. And, she was extremely happy doing something like being a yoga instructor.

OP, I can picture your daughter following a similar pattern if you insist on micro-managing her college experience and forcing her into a specific profession, just because you think that it would be lucrative.
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Old 11-08-2021, 09:13 PM
 
19,767 posts, read 18,055,300 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weather088 View Post
We had an agreement with our daughter that in order for us to pay for her college, she needs to pick a major that is in high demand, such as engineering, comp sci, chemistry, finance, accounting, education. She originally chose accounting. She is currently almost finished with her 3rd semester and decided change her major to a Bachelor of Arts in Economics because she thought calculus was “too hard” and she didn’t want to have to take “calculus 2”. Basically, she chose a pretty useless degree while going to school on my dime. My husband and I are paying for her full tuition and I remind her constantly that she is very privileged to be able to afford to go to school debt free. Now, we are having second thoughts about paying her way. It’s pathetic to pay tens of thousands of dollars for somebody to pursue “economics”. I think the real reason is that she is too lazy to do calculus and wants to take the easy way out. Somebody who wants to take the easy way out shouldn’t be in college in the first place.
I'd be very interested to see her econ. degree and accounting degree plans. Are you sure the math reqs. are higher for accounting than econ.? Most econ. degrees require two calculus courses as well.

If she's worried about calculus II computer science, engineering and chemistry are out. Many finance tracks are math heavy as well.

FWIW I'm an economist and agree for most students an econ. BS, unless used as a lever into law school, MBA or other grad school is a bad choice for most.

ETA - I cut out before I was done. Adding the the last bit above. Top finishers in econ. can do all sorts of things across finance, bankings etc.

Last edited by EDS_; 11-08-2021 at 09:56 PM..
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Old 11-08-2021, 09:21 PM
 
19,767 posts, read 18,055,300 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by springfieldva View Post
You can't browbeat a non math person into being "mathy". She is way better off switching to a major that she has the ability to master and be good at.

Are you expecting your daughter to support you when you're old or something? I only ask because I have 2 college kids and I can't imagine putting this kind of expectation on them regarding their major.

I've known people who majored in Econ, they all went on to get decent jobs. I guess I just don't understand your angst.

My issue is the logic of it all. If the kiddo is going into econ. because she thinks it'll be easy she's crazy. If the mom thinks econ. will be easy she's crazy too.
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Old 11-08-2021, 09:24 PM
 
166 posts, read 156,544 times
Reputation: 206
Quote:
Originally Posted by Weather088 View Post
We had an agreement with our daughter that in order for us to pay for her college, she needs to pick a major that is in high demand, such as engineering, comp sci, chemistry, finance, accounting, education. She originally chose accounting. She is currently almost finished with her 3rd semester and decided change her major to a Bachelor of Arts in Economics because she thought calculus was “too hard” and she didn’t want to have to take “calculus 2”. Basically, she chose a pretty useless degree while going to school on my dime. My husband and I are paying for her full tuition and I remind her constantly that she is very privileged to be able to afford to go to school debt free. Now, we are having second thoughts about paying her way. It’s pathetic to pay tens of thousands of dollars for somebody to pursue “economics”. I think the real reason is that she is too lazy to do calculus and wants to take the easy way out. Somebody who wants to take the easy way out shouldn’t be in college in the first place.
Wow, is this a real post?
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Old 11-08-2021, 09:26 PM
 
166 posts, read 156,544 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
OP, I have to plead for the student's case. First of all, nearly all the acceptable majors you chose are very math-heavy. This simply would not work for some students (me, for example), and not because they're "lazy". Some people's minds just cannot get around math.
Bingo
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