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I was just saying if I was in that position I would do what ever it takes for my child to succeed. I am guilty of overdoing things for my kids at times because I can but at night before they go to bed its still hug time even though two of them have graduated and are going off to college. I don't think anyone should have to sleep in their car either. Ideally couples should stay together and raise their kids, A lot less baggage that way but life doesn't always follow a plan.
I understood your point You are just saying you would do whatever it took to ensure your childrens future financial success - good for you.
After HS the only thing my parents paid for was my car and medical insurance. The rest was pretty much on my dime. It turned me into an self sufficient adult and made me aware of what it really costs to live in this country. My parents probably could have helped more but it was a question of my pride. I wanted to show them that I was a man and that I could handle life on my own.
Why do you folks think this is such a bad idea to teach your kids responsibility? Why is it better to let them feed off a trust/college fund? You never learn the value of a dollar until you're sitting in your apartment rolling pennies for gas (but that was when gas was only $1.25/gal...now I suppose you'd need to roll quarters for gas). I really did this. I was sitting there in my apt looking out the window at my truck that had probably 1 gal of gas in the tank trying to figure out how I could make it home for the weekend. I had about $20 in my checking acct, No credit cards, and I had a big jar of change sitting there on the counter. I just started rolling it and managed to get enough to fill up my tank so I could make it home and back.
I plan to help my kids out with college but for their own benifit I want them to try to cover as much of the expense as they can. It's a lesson they have to learn or they will be screwed when they actually graduate and get jobs. They will have no idea how to make it on their own. They'll still be on your payroll when they're 30 because they don't know how to manage their income and pay bills. They'll be too busy outfitting their homes with Plasma screen TV's and buying new cars every year to realize that mommy and daddy aren't supposed to be making their payments for them anymore.
At some point you've got to kick them out of the nest because it's sure time to fly.
Jeez. The first sentence and most of the paragraph explained my father completely.. except he was the custodial parent!
I think the ideal is hereditary. If your father was "kicked to the streets" when he was 18, he'll most likely tell you "I did it, so can you."
Sounds like my father-in-law. It's a shame because my husband's college experience would have been so much better if his dad supported him-even if not financially, he should have been there emotionally. And no, my husband's parents are not divorced-his dad is just selfish.
I do agree men and women are wired differently, LOL! Usually this is a good thing What bothers me is the way men seem to allow the new women in their lives to convince them that that prior obligation they felt to support their child attending college is no longer really necessary. So much seems to change when daddy gets a new wife
My boyfriend's dad remarried. He is about 52 years old and his new wife is 60. She has children too from her first marriage. Her kids are also in their 20's. What's interesting is his dad was a terrible parent and quite abusive due to his drinking problem. And he's never apologized to his kids or his exwife for his ****ty behaviour. Meanwhile with his current wife, he tries to come across as a great dad type and is nicer to his step kids than to his own children. And he's pissed that my boyfriend (his only son) refuses to visit him or call him up on the phone. I think that his new wife is a little puzzled but my boyfriend's younger sister has filled in some of the past history with her. But his being nice to his new family is all show and no substance and the rest of us wonder how long he can hold up the facade. Plus his new wife is very rich which is another reason for him to be on his best behaviour.
So I think that with second marriages and families, it's a chance at a fresh start to do things right. And the former family gets pushed aside.
In my family, in an unusual circumstance, right away my dad told my exdad that he didn't have to pay child support, that he would take care of us as if we were his own. So of course, my exdad didn't protest or offer to pay anything. I think my dad did this in part because he didn't want there to be any potential ugly family dramas later on. And it wasn't that my dad was rich either. In the beginning of the second marriage, money was in short supply but my dad's business finally did well. We always had access to our exdad, but we just all drifted apart over years. My exdad eventually remarried and when his second wife couldn't have children, he made a half hearted stab and getting reacquainted with us, but by then we weren't interested in bonding with him. He's dropped some hints over the years trying to tempt our affections with promises of putting us in his will, but we've decided that our love can't be bought. And he is not without family support, we have a lot of cousins that can take care of him and keep him company.
After HS the only thing my parents paid for was my car and medical insurance. The rest was pretty much on my dime. It turned me into an self sufficient adult and made me aware of what it really costs to live in this country. My parents probably could have helped more but it was a question of my pride. I wanted to show them that I was a man and that I could handle life on my own.
Why do you folks think this is such a bad idea to teach your kids responsibility? Why is it better to let them feed off a trust/college fund? You never learn the value of a dollar until you're sitting in your apartment rolling pennies for gas (but that was when gas was only $1.25/gal...now I suppose you'd need to roll quarters for gas). I really did this. I was sitting there in my apt looking out the window at my truck that had probably 1 gal of gas in the tank trying to figure out how I could make it home for the weekend. I had about $20 in my checking acct, No credit cards, and I had a big jar of change sitting there on the counter. I just started rolling it and managed to get enough to fill up my tank so I could make it home and back.
I plan to help my kids out with college but for their own benifit I want them to try to cover as much of the expense as they can. It's a lesson they have to learn or they will be screwed when they actually graduate and get jobs. They will have no idea how to make it on their own. They'll still be on your payroll when they're 30 because they don't know how to manage their income and pay bills. They'll be too busy outfitting their homes with Plasma screen TV's and buying new cars every year to realize that mommy and daddy aren't supposed to be making their payments for them anymore.
At some point you've got to kick them out of the nest because it's sure time to fly.
WHOA, who said it is "such a bad idea to teach kids responsibility"? Certainly not me. And, as far as I'm concerned it's time some of these so-called "dads" took some responsiblity themselves.
You are getting off track, I already stated it is not good parenting to give your child every single material thing they desire - this is not what my thread is about. My thread is about the fact that an 18 year old still needs some support in today's world if he is going to go to college - yet once a kid turns 18 many dads drop all financial support because the law allows them to. I am trying to figure out how a man sleeps at night knowing he did this to his child and allowing his ex to find a way to help the kid all on her own.
WHOA, who said it is "such a bad idea to teach kids responsibility"? Certainly not me. And, as far as I'm concerned it's time some of these so-called "dads" took some responsiblity themselves.
You are getting off track, I already stated it is not good parenting to give your child every single material thing they desire - this is not what my thread is about. My thread is about the fact that an 18 year old still needs some support in today's world if he is going to go to college - yet once a kid turns 18 many dads drop all financial support because the law allows them to. I am trying to figure out how a man sleeps at night knowing he did this to his child and allowing his ex to find a way to help the kid all on her own.
Just a thought here and this is based on watching my boyfriend interact with his parents about money matters...
In your situation, does your son have a good relationship with his dad overall? And did your son try to talk to his dad directly about needing funds for college or whatever? I can see how it would be much easier to say no to a request from an ex wife, but more difficult to say no to his son. Or that the son needs to learn how to make a better presentation to his dad for the funds. And if that dad does have the comfortable financial situation to write the check, then maybe the son needs to appear more a responsible young adult that has exhausted all other options for sources for funding, he needs to explain to his dad that his desire for a college degree is sincere and that he will have good grades and not be a party animal, and that any help he gets he won't be taking for granted. Your son may even have to offer to treat this money as more of a personal loan and offer to repay the money back over time with nominal below market interest. Maybe his dad is only feeling like an ATM machine and less as a real parent with a solid bond to his child.
And if that money is a struggle for the ex dad to come up with, that fact should be addressed and acknowledged too. And then your son should ask for his father's advice in how to come up with the money for college. And also to again promise that his college degree will be worth something and that college is not about spring break and other good times. And he should tell his dad that he applied for various scholarships but didn't have any luck.
But the best person that can plead his case would be your son and not you imo. And I think that if your ex is more involved in the problem solving process and not just presented with his share of the bills, his attitude might be better and more supportive.
With my boyfriend, I find that he is very uncomfortable talking to his dad in an open and honest way. He is more comfortable with his mom, but basically, he hates to seem needy or weak in the money department. On the other hand, my boyfriend is very frugal and is working very hard on his budding career but he doesn't like to tell those details to his mom, so I usually fill her in. And she always tells me that she's there for her son, he just has to talk to her. The dad is more of a lost cause. His sisters get more out of the parents, but that's because they all live near each other and talk and kvetch daily. My boyfriend just doesn't kvetch at all. (We're not Jewish, but that word just seems to fit well in describing this situation.)
Just a thought here and this is based on watching my boyfriend interact with his parents about money matters...
In your situation, does your son have a good relationship with his dad overall? And did your son try to talk to his dad directly about needing funds for college or whatever? I can see how it would be much easier to say no to a request from an ex wife, but more difficult to say no to his son. Or that the son needs to learn how to make a better presentation to his dad for the funds. And if that dad does have the comfortable financial situation to write the check, then maybe the son needs to appear more a responsible young adult that has exhausted all other options for sources for funding, he needs to explain to his dad that his desire for a college degree is sincere and that he will have good grades and not be a party animal, and that any help he gets he won't be taking for granted. Your son may even have to offer to treat this money as more of a personal loan and offer to repay the money back over time with nominal below market interest. Maybe his dad is only feeling like an ATM machine and less as a real parent with a solid bond to his child.
And if that money is a struggle for the ex dad to come up with, that fact should be addressed and acknowledged too. And then your son should ask for his father's advice in how to come up with the money for college. And also to again promise that his college degree will be worth something and that college is not about spring break and other good times. And he should tell his dad that he applied for various scholarships but didn't have any luck.
But the best person that can plead his case would be your son and not you imo. And I think that if your ex is more involved in the problem solving process and not just presented with his share of the bills, his attitude might be better and more supportive.
With my boyfriend, I find that he is very uncomfortable talking to his dad in an open and honest way. He is more comfortable with his mom, but basically, he hates to seem needy or weak in the money department. On the other hand, my boyfriend is very frugal and is working very hard on his budding career but he doesn't like to tell those details to his mom, so I usually fill her in. And she always tells me that she's there for her son, he just has to talk to her. The dad is more of a lost cause. His sisters get more out of the parents, but that's because they all live near each other and talk and kvetch daily. My boyfriend just doesn't kvetch at all. (We're not Jewish, but that word just seems to fit well in describing this situation.)
miu, I appreciate your thoughtful post I think you are right that the child should talk directly to the dad about getting help for college (or whatever the child might need). It IS better for the child to plead his case than his mother. Sorry to hear your boyfriend is not comfortable with his own dad.
In my own situation I was very blessed as a young person to have a fantastic step-father. He quietly stepped up to the plate and helped pay my tuition when my father's checks kept bouncing. Our arrangement had been that I would work to pay for a third, my mom would pay for a third and my dad would pay for a third. At the time in the 1970's the only jobs I could get would just pay for my third of all costs. Anyway, he had his own children to support (all of whom finished college) but still helped me and my sisters without once saying a bad word about my father.
Luckily for the kids I know with dad's like my father they all have awesome step-fathers. There are many wonderful, responsible dads out there. I just don't understand the ones that walk away from all financial responsibility once a child turns 18. If nothing else you would think that all famous male pride would kick in and they would pay up just so they wouldn't look bad when the step-dad picks up the dad's slack!
After HS the only thing my parents paid for was my car and medical insurance. The rest was pretty much on my dime. It turned me into an self sufficient adult and made me aware of what it really costs to live in this country. My parents probably could have helped more but it was a question of my pride. I wanted to show them that I was a man and that I could handle life on my own.
Why do you folks think this is such a bad idea to teach your kids responsibility? Why is it better to let them feed off a trust/college fund? You never learn the value of a dollar until you're sitting in your apartment rolling pennies for gas (but that was when gas was only $1.25/gal...now I suppose you'd need to roll quarters for gas). I really did this. I was sitting there in my apt looking out the window at my truck that had probably 1 gal of gas in the tank trying to figure out how I could make it home for the weekend. I had about $20 in my checking acct, No credit cards, and I had a big jar of change sitting there on the counter. I just started rolling it and managed to get enough to fill up my tank so I could make it home and back.
I plan to help my kids out with college but for their own benifit I want them to try to cover as much of the expense as they can. It's a lesson they have to learn or they will be screwed when they actually graduate and get jobs. They will have no idea how to make it on their own. They'll still be on your payroll when they're 30 because they don't know how to manage their income and pay bills. They'll be too busy outfitting their homes with Plasma screen TV's and buying new cars every year to realize that mommy and daddy aren't supposed to be making their payments for them anymore.
At some point you've got to kick them out of the nest because it's sure time to fly.
I'll have to agree with drjones about how to approach this...I have not read all the responses but distinctly remember someone saying that he/she will let their 18 yr old and older get married, bring the wife to live with them if he wants, and be happy about it. I totally disagree with that...as parents we should try to teach our kids to be self sufficient adults, not be loafing off the parents well into adulthood. I have seen that happen time and time again and it is a thing of dependence on behalf of both parent & child...very sad. It's not about "kicking out" or anything vindictive like that, but more of a proud stage in your life as a parent that you have helped shape this young adult and now he/she is ready to make something of him/herself.
Your stepdad sounds like mine! When he married my mom, he took on the whole package and not just a piece of it. I can only imagine what his white family thought when he announced that he was marrying a Chinese divorcee with three daughters. But his mom treated us just like the rest of our cousins.
One thing my stepdad did that I still remember. I was in high school and had a perfectly good 3-speed bicycle. However, all of my friends were getting 10-speed bikes and I wanted one too. So my dad make a deal with me, if I did my research, I could have any bike I wanted. So I researched away and ended up selecting a wonderful hand built Motobecane Grand Record racing bike that cost $275 back in 1972. My mother nearly had a heart attack when I announced what bike I wanted, but my dad told my mom that we had a deal...
I think that your ex would enjoy helping his son become a man. But he just doesn't know it yet. And hopefully, everything will come together. And I think that it will also be good for your son to be more focused on what he wants out of his college years. I know that if I had to do it over, I would have put off going to college for at least a year. It's just that all of my friends were applying to college, so it was the thing to do for all good graduating high school students. Had I put off college for a few years, I would have had a better sense of what to major in.
I'll have to agree with drjones about how to approach this...I have not read all the responses but distinctly remember someone saying that he/she will let their 18 yr old and older get married, bring the wife to live with them if he wants, and be happy about it. I totally disagree with that...as parents we should try to teach our kids to be self sufficient adults, not be loafing off the parents well into adulthood. I have seen that happen time and time again and it is a thing of dependence on behalf of both parent & child...very sad. It's not about "kicking out" or anything vindictive like that, but more of a proud stage in your life as a parent that you have helped shape this young adult and now he/she is ready to make something of him/herself.
I think that every family and culture has a different approach on how to send their children off into the world. So some factors would be how the parents and grandparents got their introduction to adult life and how well their faired. Other factors would be stories of what friends and co-workers have gone through too. There is that fine balance between no support at all and too much support creating an underachiever.
Then my mother used to tell me that succeeding family generations alternated between the strict and easy treatment of their children. So she'd say that my grandfather spoiled her, so now she was being tough on us. And how we'd be easy on our own children as a consequence. lol!
I think what messes things up is that college got so darn expensive. When I went to Brown, tuition was something like only $6k a year plus housing and food! And look how much a decent new car costs these days! And there is no way I would ever buy a $30k car. Anyway, there are many articles and some books written about the disappearing middle class and how the current generation will never have as many amenities as the previous ones.
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You are just saying you would do whatever it took to ensure your childrens future financial success - good for you.
