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Old 02-22-2010, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,387 posts, read 31,909,221 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
I think this is going to become more and more of an issue for future generations. The middle class isn't able to prepare for retirement like in the past. Few companies have pensions. Parents are mortgaging the houses, raiding the 401Ks to put children through school. In the end, there will be a lot of parents who aren't able to take care of themselves financially---especially as cost of living continues to increase with no real pareparation for retirement.

I have a friend who is supporting her father with her brothers and sisters. He was very successful consultant---self employed their entire lives. He provided well for them with a very nice standard of living through childhood. He sent them to private schools and paid for their college educations too.

He lost almost everything, not due to irresponsibility, and the children rallied around to support him. Granted, the investment he made in taking care of them produced very successful children who could easily afford to help him. Three of them were very wealthy and they split the financial costs of supporting their father. The one who wasn't financially successful does her share by committing to live in the same city as the father so she could physically support him---with rides to the doctor's office, etc.----whenever he needed. THAT'S FAMILY! Family pulls together and does what needs to be done.
And many people, like me, lost their pensions when companies went bankrupt. I was notified last summer that the pension fund for my old company is now an unsecured debt in the bankruptcy. I'm likely to never see a penny. Sadly, in this economy, a 20 year pension can disappear overnight so even if you do plan you can end up out in the cold.

I will have to make hard choices to put my girls though school. I would hope they would not leave me out in the coldjust so they can live more comfortably. I'll die and not be a burden to them anymore soon enough.
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Old 02-22-2010, 04:37 PM
 
2,654 posts, read 4,865,645 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
And many people, like me, lost their pensions when companies went bankrupt. I was notified last summer that the pension fund for my old company is now an unsecured debt in the bankruptcy. I'm likely to never see a penny. Sadly, in this economy, a 20 year pension can disappear overnight so even if you do plan you can end up out in the cold.

I will have to make hard choices to put my girls though school. I would hope they would not leave me out in the coldjust so they can live more comfortably. I'll die and not be a burden to them anymore soon enough.
I'm sorry for your situation. If it is a true Guarnteed benefit pension, it may be covered by the PBGC which will pay out a protion of your benefit. I don't claim to understand the whole thing, buts its like the FDIC for pensions. You may want to check it out.
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Old 02-22-2010, 05:58 PM
 
831 posts, read 1,399,417 times
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My mom and 1 of my aunts do a lot for my grandma. She is a retired school cook. Her house is paid for. She pays her bills. But if she needs something like a new fridge or furniture my mom and aunt split the bill for it. My mom takes her out to eat and to the store every Friday and pays for it. My aunt takes her to get her hair done and pays the co pays on her meds. I have another aunt that doesn't help at all. In a few years they plan on selling her house and she will move in with my aunt. She lives right next door to my grandma now. My mom will still help take care of her. I couldn't see it any other way. My grandma has always been very good to all of us so why wouldn't we take care of her?

My sister and I will take care of our parents when the get older without a second thought. But then again we have good parents that love us and have always helped us when we have needed it. They are saving up money for their golden years too.

Now on the other hand my mother in law is a bum. Married a man 10 yrs ago who has never had a job. Lost her home and now rents a dump. She used to borrow 1 of our cars alot and would call to ask us for gas money or money for food. When my husband finally had enough he just stopped answering the phone when she would call. She then started calling and asking his sister for help.
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:43 PM
 
43,012 posts, read 96,063,761 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
And many people, like me, lost their pensions when companies went bankrupt. I was notified last summer that the pension fund for my old company is now an unsecured debt in the bankruptcy. I'm likely to never see a penny. Sadly, in this economy, a 20 year pension can disappear overnight so even if you do plan you can end up out in the cold.

I will have to make hard choices to put my girls though school. I would hope they would not leave me out in the coldjust so they can live more comfortably. I'll die and not be a burden to them anymore soon enough.
We are in a similar situation. My husband worked at the company for over 20 years and lost his pension too.

The owner raided the pension fund. The employees won in federal court, but they never saw a penny.
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Old 02-22-2010, 07:50 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,387 posts, read 31,909,221 times
Reputation: 14633
Quote:
Originally Posted by OC Investor2 View Post
I'm sorry for your situation. If it is a true Guarnteed benefit pension, it may be covered by the PBGC which will pay out a protion of your benefit. I don't claim to understand the whole thing, buts its like the FDIC for pensions. You may want to check it out.
It was just a normal pension fund. Now it's an unsecured debt against the company. It's up the court if the company has to pay anything. If the government ends up taking over our pensions, I'd get about 40% of what was promised but my social security benefit (if that even exists when I get to retirement age) will be reduced by that amount so it's, effectively, lost.

Right now I'm waiting for them to either liquidate the assets of the company or restructure and see what happens. Unfortunately, it sounds like they have no plan to carry over the debt of the old company into the new restructured company which leaves me and my fellow ex employees out in the cold. I feel like a fool for having counted on that pension. It wasn't enough to fully fund my retirement but added to social security and what I'd saved, I'd have done ok. I figured what I saved the next 15 years would be a safety net in case social security wasn't there for me. I never figured I'd lose my pension.
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Old 02-22-2010, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,387 posts, read 31,909,221 times
Reputation: 14633
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
We are in a similar situation. My husband worked at the company for over 20 years and lost his pension too.

The owner raided the pension fund. The employees won in federal court, but they never saw a penny.

Unfortunately, many of us have discovered that pensions can be lost. I know a woman who had her retirement 100% funded and lost it overnight when the company went bankrupt. She lost both her 401K and her pension because she had most of her 401K in company stock. When it went under, she lost it all. She's in her 50's and starting over. I am too, I guess but I didn't lose all of my 401K. I lost pretty much the average for the market so I'm not starting back at zero.

I think we're going to see a come back of multi generation households. I think my next house will have in law quarters for me to move into when the kids take over the house. It's about the only way my kids will get any kind of inheritance from me.
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Old 06-18-2010, 04:03 PM
 
3 posts, read 5,874 times
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I'm going through a similar situation. Bio dad had nothing to do with me growing up. Now I'm grown and successful and he shows up on my doorstep asking to stay a night or two so he can see his Drs well 4 months and major surgery later he's still at my house. I'm resentful that he even thinks this is okay or that he's taking no initiative to leave without me asking him to. See I have a guest suite so he has 1100 square feet with full kitchen, laundry, bath, den and bedroom. He turns the air so cold you could hang meat but he thinks its ok because he thinks I can afford it. WTH...
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Old 06-18-2010, 05:16 PM
 
4,043 posts, read 6,503,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mchelle View Post
Adult child? Is that the correct terminology? I'm not really sure how to properly phrase that

Anyway, I would like to think that adult children would help their parents when they can - financially, medically, etc.

But what happens when a person begins to routinely ask their children (even teenagers in high school) to borrow money? To disregard their own financial security to help the parent? To do favors that greatly inconvenience them? What if the parent doesn't get another job or look elsewhere for financial help because s/he is simply lazy and doesn't feel like it? What if the parent has the ability to work more but not the motivation?

Does the situation change if the children are living under the parents' roof or if they live separately?

What about if it's a single parent who has been a single parent for most of the childrens' lives?

Should the children just accept it - after all, the parent did raise them since they were babies. The parent certainly gave up a lot to make ends meet, made plenty of his/her own sacrifices to give what s/he could to the children. Family helps family sort of thing.

Or should the children stand up to the parent and assert that they will not be taken advantage of anymore - that the parent needs to go get a second job or look for help elsewhere if s/he is struggling that terribly?

I would love to hear your viewpoints on this
Here's another one to add to your collection: I think this particular question is one of those rare ones that really don't lend themselves to generalizations of any sort. It's a case by case thing. I would have to have lived as a fly on the walls of the family in question and witnessed all sorts of events and nuances involving children and parents - to give a verdict.

Some parents/grandparents would deserve virtually any sacrifice on the part of their children, no matter how big. Others would deserve virtually nothing. Yet most are somewhere in between.
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Old 06-18-2010, 06:42 PM
 
47,531 posts, read 62,744,929 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DubbleT View Post
I would not be disappointed for this country go back to seeing multi-generation families living together as the norm. In-law suites in every home!
To me it makes sense from an economical standpoint, and I think it would cut down on the sense of isolation and disconnection a lot of people have.
I would. The cheap labor types would love this - we'd be like a third world country with many families living under one roof. No one would need much money of course, they'd become very content with third world wages. All the kids just grow up, never leave home and like in third world countries, it would be common to see 15 adults and 25 children at least in one crowded home.

Men who move their wives or girlfriends into mama's house never leave mama. The big overgrown boys tend to "play around" drink too much. Sisters and sister-in-laws all sharing one kitchen end up in a pecking order, the alpha female takes over and the others become essentially servants. In American culture, it's one woman to a kitchen. Every man is the king of his household.
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Old 06-18-2010, 06:48 PM
 
47,531 posts, read 62,744,929 times
Reputation: 22311
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandee01 View Post
I'm going through a similar situation. Bio dad had nothing to do with me growing up. Now I'm grown and successful and he shows up on my doorstep asking to stay a night or two so he can see his Drs well 4 months and major surgery later he's still at my house. I'm resentful that he even thinks this is okay or that he's taking no initiative to leave without me asking him to. See I have a guest suite so he has 1100 square feet with full kitchen, laundry, bath, den and bedroom. He turns the air so cold you could hang meat but he thinks its ok because he thinks I can afford it. WTH...
I had a friend that was raised by a stepfather with his mother. Bio-dad left when he was 18 months old and never contributed a dime, never paid a visit, never sent a card. He lived in the vicinity but it was apparently too much effort to put down the beer can and do anything for his young son.

This guy had a good enough life. Everything worked out okay for him, when he was 18, he graduated and got a job and suddenly dear old dad shows up at the door. This guy hadn't seen this man in over 16 years and the father acted like they were the best father and son team ever and then started hitting him up for money. He said he was actually enough of a sucker and gave him some but he got over it fast and sent him packing.

The only thing you really owe your parents is to turn out successful enough and be self-supporting somewhere after age 18 and before age 24. That should give them enough time to save up some money for themselves.
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