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Old 10-18-2010, 10:30 AM
 
3,484 posts, read 2,860,318 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Interesting quote w/o attribution. It's not mine, BTW, but I will respond. The quote does not say the vaccine only lasts for twelve years; it says at least 12 years. The link I posted says studies have shown it protects for at least 23 years:

For how long is hepatitis B vaccine protective?

Studies indicate that immunologic memory remains intact for at least 23 years and confers protection against clinical illness and chronic HBV infection, even though anti-HBs levels might become low or decline below detectable levels.

If at some point in time, a booster is needed, that is far better than trying to get the whole series after the person becomes high risk for Hep B disease.
My reply got eaten but I was about to post the same stat as Katiana. The point is that serious reactions are extremely rare and vaccine protection has been shown to last for least two decades and probably far longer. Non vaccination is not without risks either.

Hepatitis B Vaccine Questions and Answers

Quote:
On average, an unvaccinated baby born in the United States has 5 out of 100 chances of developing HBV infection sometime during his or her lifetime.
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Old 10-18-2010, 10:36 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 6,158,735 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Interesting quote w/o attribution. It's not mine, BTW, but I will respond. The quote does not say the vaccine only lasts for twelve years; it says at least 12 years. The link I posted says studies have shown it protects for at least 23 years:

For how long is hepatitis B vaccine protective?

Studies indicate that immunologic memory remains intact for at least 23 years and confers protection against clinical illness and chronic HBV infection, even though anti-HBs levels might become low or decline below detectable levels.


If at some point in time, a booster is needed, that is far better than trying to get the whole series after the person becomes high risk for Hep B disease.
According to the CDC boosters are only recommended for hemodialysis patients and immunocompromised persons. They are not reccomneded for anyone else.

Also according to the CDC the reason for vaccinating every baby within 12 hours of birth is this:
Quote:
Infants born to HBV-infected mothers require Hepatitis B vaccine and Hepatitis B immune globulin (HBIG) within 12 hours of birth to protect them from infection. However, because errors or delays in documenting, testing, and reporting maternal HBsAg status can and do occur, administering the first dose of Hepatitis B vaccine soon after birth to all infants acts as a safety net, reducing the risk for perinatal infection when maternal HBsAg status is either unknown or incorrectly documented at delivery. Also, initiating the Hepatitis B vaccine series at birth has been shown to increase a child's likelihood of completing the vaccine series on schedule.
source: CDC DVH - HBV FAQs for Health Professionals

Pregnant women are tested for Hep B through routine prenatal care. I know that I am Hep B negative, therefore I see no reason to vaccinate within those 12 hours after birth. It's not my concern that the hospital might not know my status due to miscommunication with my doctor or midwife or poor record keeping. I know my status and that's what matters.

The CDC says that immunity lasts for at least 20 years in healthy individuals. It also sounds like more studies need are being done because they don't really know how long immunity lasts.

If the vaccine is good for 20 years (or even 23) then a person's immunity might wane just when they need it the most.
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Old 10-18-2010, 10:40 AM
 
3,484 posts, read 2,860,318 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
According to the CDC boosters are only recommended for hemodialysis patients and immunocompromised persons. They are not reccomneded for anyone else.

Also according to the CDC the reason for vaccinating every baby within 12 hours of birth is this: source: CDC DVH - HBV FAQs for Health Professionals

All pregnant women are tested for Hep B through routine prenatal care. I know that I am Hep B negative, therefore I see no reason to vaccinate within those 12 hours after birth. It's not my concern that the hospital might not know my status due to miscommunication with my doctor or midwife or poor record keeping. because I do my status. That's what matters.

The CDC says that immunity lasts for at least 20 years in healthy individuals. It also sounds like more studies need are being done because they don'
t really know how long immunity lasts.

If the vaccine is good for 20 years (or even 23) then a person's immunity might wane just when they need it the most.
If you don't vaccine within those hours after birth then when do you vaccinate? There's no evidence that you'll reduce extremely rare vaccine reactions if you delay. If the vaccine is good for at least twenty years then that DOES protect people when they need it most. An adult will more than likely shrug off Hep b. A baby or child will face the need for a liver transplant.

An adult can get a booster shot later on.
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Old 10-18-2010, 10:53 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 6,158,735 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleanora1 View Post
If you don't vaccine within those hours after birth then when do you vaccinate? There's no evidence that you'll reduce extremely rare vaccine reactions if you delay. If the vaccine is good for at least twenty years then that DOES protect people when they need it most. An adult will more than likely shrug off Hep b. A baby or child will face the need for a liver transplant.
I would at least wait until their immune system was more fully developed. I see no reason to give the shot within 12 hours of birth unless the mother is Hep B positive.

Quote:
An adult can get a booster shot later on.
One of the arguments for giving the first does in the hospital is because if people don't do it then, they never will. What 20 year old is going to go to their doctor and ask for a Hep B booster?
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Old 10-18-2010, 11:05 AM
 
3,484 posts, read 2,860,318 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
I would at least wait until their immune system was more fully developed. I see no reason to give the shot within 12 hours of birth unless the mother is Hep B positive.
Cite? Why go against standard health care practice? What constitutes a more fully developed immune system? Millions of doses have been given to infants that young with no evidence that serious reactions are normal or even common.

Quote:
One of the arguments for giving the first does in the hospital is because if people don't do it then, they never will. What 20 year old is going to go to their doctor and ask for a Hep B booster?
Then when exactly do you vaccinate? The argument becomes don't vaccinate when they're young because they're too young. Don't vaccinate when they're babies because they're not at risk even though they are. Don't vaccinate when they're older because they don't really need it since they're not shooting up drugs or having sex.

What parents of a twelve year old are going to go to a doctor and ask for a Hep b vaccine dosage?

Vaccination at a very early age makes sense. Babies and children are undeniably at risk from Hep b in a way that adults are not. The Hep b vaccine has only been existence for about twenty years. The vaccine has helped reduce the rates of Hep b in the US and reduced the risks babies and children face from it. There's no evidence that it wears off.
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Old 10-18-2010, 11:10 AM
 
Location: In a house
13,250 posts, read 42,630,918 times
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If you're waiting til their immune system is more fully developed, then you're waiting til the worst of the risk is over. The reason to get the baby immunized early, is because that is exactly when he is at the highest risk NOT of infection...but of infection causing the most serious problems.

Lower risk of getting infected at all when they're newborns, absolutely.
MUCH more serious risk of that infection killing your kid, also absolutely.

The younger they are, the more at risk of infection killing them. The older they are, the higher risk of exposure BUT the lower risk of the infection causing serious harm.
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Old 10-18-2010, 11:26 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 6,158,735 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleanora1 View Post
Cite? Why go against standard health care practice? What constitutes a more fully developed immune system? Millions of doses have been given to infants that young with no evidence that serious reactions are normal or even common.
It's well known that a baby's immune system doesn't fully kick in until they are at least 6 months old. I see nothing wrong with waiting at least until they are 6 months old.

Quote:
Then when exactly do you vaccinate? The argument becomes don't vaccinate when they're young because they're too young. Don't vaccinate when they're babies because they're not at risk even though they are. Don't vaccinate when they're older because they don't really need it since they're not shooting up drugs or having sex.
Personally for my children I would say just prior to puberty.

Quote:
What parents of a twelve year old are going to go to a doctor and ask for a Hep b vaccine dosage?
Parents who have made a conscious decision to wait until their child is older to get the vaccine.

Quote:
Vaccination at a very early age makes sense. Babies and children are undeniably at risk from Hep b in a way that adults are not. The Hep b vaccine has only been existence for about twenty years. The vaccine has helped reduce the rates of Hep b in the US and reduced the risks babies and children face from it. There's no evidence that it wears off.
There is no evidence that it doesn't wear off. It is thought to last 20-23 years in healthy individuals.

Babies are not at risk from contracting Hep B unless their mother has it or another close family member who has regular contact with the baby has it. I can see how children could be at risk for contracting it (very low risk) by stepping on a needle or broken glass on a playground or rough play that leads to blood with another child or adult that has Hep B or through sexual abuse from a perpetrator who is Hep B positive. I do think that it's extreme to say that the only way to protect against hep B is to vaccinate within 12 hours of birth.
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Old 10-18-2010, 11:27 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 6,158,735 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonChick View Post
If you're waiting til their immune system is more fully developed, then you're waiting til the worst of the risk is over. The reason to get the baby immunized early, is because that is exactly when he is at the highest risk NOT of infection...but of infection causing the most serious problems.

Lower risk of getting infected at all when they're newborns, absolutely.
MUCH more serious risk of that infection killing your kid, also absolutely.

The younger they are, the more at risk of infection killing them. The older they are, the higher risk of exposure BUT the lower risk of the infection causing serious harm.
How is an infant (under the age of 6 months) at risk of contracting Hep B if their mother doesn't have it and no one close to the baby has it?
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Old 10-18-2010, 01:01 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
36,969 posts, read 40,910,095 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
most of the cdc's images of damadged or dying children are for vaxed kids, yet they use these images to push for more vaccines. Discusting to say the least
Do you have proof of this contention?

Photos like these? Hint: these people were not vaccinated. Vaccines: VPD-VAC/Polio/Photos
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Old 10-18-2010, 02:14 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
36,969 posts, read 40,910,095 times
Reputation: 44897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
Causes of Hepatitis B- How is Hep B Transmitted & Risk Factors (http://www.hepatitisinfo.org/couldihavehep3_1.html - broken link)



1. I don't have Hep B so my child was not at risk of catching it from me at birth.
2. My newborn baby is not having unprotected sex.
3. My newborn baby is not sharing dirty needles with drug users.
4. My newborn baby is not going to the barbershop.
5. No one in my household has Hep B and even if they did my newborn baby is not sharing toothbrushes or razors with them.

Wouldn't it make more sense to vaccinate adolescents against Hep B, rather then all newborn babies? The Hep B vaccine is not 100% safe. In 1996, 872 serious adverse reactions to the Hep B vaccine were reported to VAERS, 48 of those serious reactions were deaths. In weighing the risk of the disease for a newborn against the risk of the vaccine for a newborn it makes sense to wait until they are older, more at risk and their immune system is fully mature. The only reasons I can see for vaccinating at birth is if the mother tests positive for Hep B and possibly if other members of the household have Hep B.
The difficulty is that your child may come into contact with another child who is hepatitis B positive. Hepatitis B is spread through the fecal oral route, and small children do not have perfect hygiene. They also often get minor injuries like skinned knees which can bleed. School, day care, church nursery, the playground --- any contact with other children is a potential source of infection, and the source is frequently never identified for many cases in children.

Here are some of the VAERS reported cases you are referring to: Vaccines: VPD-VAC/Polio/Photos . Of these 18 deaths, 12 were attributed to SIDS, based on autopsy reports. Three deaths were due to infections and one each due to accidental suffocation, intracerebral hemorrhage, and congenital heart disease. None were directly attributable to the vaccine. And the SIDS Back to Sleep campaign did not start until 1994. There is no evidence of fatalities in infants due to hepatitis B vaccine. And SIDS in the US decreased 50% after Back to Sleep was instituted.

There is no reason to delay vaccination because of concerns about the "maturity" of an infant's immune system. If the infant's immune system was not "mature" enough, it would be unable to respond to the vaccine. If you wait until a time when perceived risk is higher, then infections are going to happen because you miscalculated the window of risk and waited too long.
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