Philadelphia's black population grows while Pittsburgh's black population shrinks (Allentown: homes, living)

[escilade18]

Originally Posted by couldntthinkofaclevername

Really, if you're going to compare Pittsburgh to anywhere it should probably be Baltimore given the way both cities have characteristics of the three major areas they are a part of or are straddling.

Well I'll be, we actually agree on something. I will argue that culturally, Appalachia ends somewhere between I68 and I70 and is not seen much within the Pittsburgh region (although I would be a fool to claim that we don't have the mountains haha.) We are not completely mid-atlantic the was Baltimore, Washington, or Philly are but I would argue that we share more characteristics with Baltimore and Philly than we do with Charleston WV or Chattanooga TN

[couldntthinkofaclevername]

Originally Posted by escilade18

Well I'll be, we actually agree on something. I will argue that culturally, Appalachia ends somewhere between I68 and I70 and is not seen much within the Pittsburgh region (although I would be a fool to claim that we don't have the mountains haha.) We are not completely mid-atlantic the was Baltimore, Washington, or Philly are but I would argue that we share more characteristics with Baltimore and Philly than we do with Charleston WV or Chattanooga TN

That's why I put the borders where I did. I think people try to just easily lump areas in with each other due to being a part of this or that "region" without taking anything into account. Your city definitely has similarities to Mid-Atlantic cities, as well as similarities to Rust Belt cities and to parts of Appalachia.

That makes your city unique, the same way Baltimore is. In my lifetime, I have heard people rave to me about Baltimore, and having been there twice myself, I can say that it indeed is a very unique city. If Baltimore had a Philadelphia to contend with within its own state the way Pittsburgh does in PA and New York cities do with NYC, people wouldn't know about it as much and it would always seem to be overshadowed simply because people only think about what state a city is in. The same thing happens to cities in New York state. Both PA and New York happen to have multiple distinct cities though, and in the "Fox News" thread I just replied to, I pointed out what I consider the "capital cities" of each area of PA to be.

[simetime]

Originally Posted by couldntthinkofaclevername

That's why I put the borders where I did. I think people try to just easily lump areas in with each other due to being a part of this or that "region" without taking anything into account. Your city definitely has similarities to Mid-Atlantic cities, as well as similarities to Rust Belt cities and to parts of Appalachia.

That makes your city unique, the same way Baltimore is. In my lifetime, I have heard people rave to me about Baltimore, and having been there twice myself, I can say that it indeed is a very unique city. If Baltimore had a Philadelphia to contend with within its own state the way Pittsburgh does in PA and New York cities do with NYC, people wouldn't know about it as much and it would always seem to be overshadowed simply because people only think about what state a city is in. The same thing happens to cities in New York state. Both PA and New York happen to have multiple distinct cities though, and in the "Fox News" thread I just replied to, I pointed out what I consider the "capital cities" of each area of PA to be.

It is funny that you should mention this, because I remember hearing from one of the old timers saying that the jazz travelers look at Pittsburgh as being the gateway to the East Coast and the begining of the the midwest.
A politician (I forgot who) said that "Pa has Pittsburgh and Philadelphia and everything in between in lower Alabama" You know what after attending State college and traveling back and forth I kind of agree with him

[pman]

Originally Posted by couldntthinkofaclevername

Not really. I know that technically it is but it doesn't fit the characteristics of the Mid-Atlantic and it's not connected to the rest of the Mid-Atlantic the way Philadelphia is. It's more Appalachian/Midwest/Northeast, if that makes any sense.

not really. it's more appalachian/midwest than philly but more midatlantic than colombus or cleveland. on the whole, I don't find it overly midwestern at all...it has an eastern feel. it's main travel pairs are ny, philly, dc and cleveland. you mention rust belt, but philly and baltimore have plenty in common with rust belt cities. weatherwise it gets less sun but has cold but not new england cold winters, hot humid midatlantic summers.

Originally Posted by couldntthinkofaclevername

That's why I don't think you can judge Pittsburgh based on Philadelphia or any other Mid-Atlantic city given the way they're basically isolated from the Mid-Atlantic cities in a lot of ways....Really, if you're going to compare Pittsburgh to anywhere it should probably be Baltimore given the way both cities have characteristics of the three major areas they are a part of or are straddling

who is judging? each city should be judged on its own merits. baltimore is also midatlantic. my, aren't we off topic

[ElijahAstin]

Baltimore is definitely Mid-Atlantic, but I don't think Pittsburgh cleanly fits into that distinction the same way Washington, Philadelphia and New York do. Cleveland is a much closer peer city to Pittsburgh than any of those.

I consider Pittsburgh to be in a cultural transition zone--neither wholly Midwestern nor Northeastern, with a touch of Appalachia thrown in. I think "Gateway to the Midwest" (or "Northeast" if the Midwestern label offends you for whatever odd reason) is the most appropriate designation for the 'Burgh.

[pman]

Actually they are all cultural transition zones

[couldntthinkofaclevername]

Originally Posted by pman

not really. it's more appalachian/midwest than philly but more midatlantic than colombus or cleveland. on the whole, I don't find it overly midwestern at all...it has an eastern feel. it's main travel pairs are ny, philly, dc and cleveland. you mention rust belt, but philly and baltimore have plenty in common with rust belt cities. weatherwise it gets less sun but has cold but not new england cold winters, hot humid midatlantic summers.

who is judging? each city should be judged on its own merits. baltimore is also midatlantic. my, aren't we off topic

I'm not talking about things like climates or small things like the industry that Philadelphia and Baltimore both had.

I'm talking about the fact that Baltimore and Pittsburgh both straddle multiple distinct areas. Baltimore has the Mid-Atlantic and South, and Pittsburgh has Appalachia, the Mid-Atlantic, and the Rust Belt.

Both cities share characteristics of the areas they straddle, which makes them unique.

Originally Posted by HeavenWood

Baltimore is definitely Mid-Atlantic, but I don't think Pittsburgh cleanly fits into that distinction the same way Washington, Philadelphia and New York do. Cleveland is a much closer peer city to Pittsburgh than any of those.

I consider Pittsburgh to be in a cultural transition zone--neither wholly Midwestern nor Northeastern, with a touch of Appalachia thrown in. I think "Gateway to the Midwest" (or "Northeast" if the Midwestern label offends you for whatever odd reason) is the most appropriate designation for the 'Burgh.

Exactly, which is exactly what I was saying.

[ElijahAstin]

Originally Posted by pman

Actually they are all cultural transition zones

How is Philadelphia in a cultural transition zone?

[pman]

Originally Posted by HeavenWood

How is Philadelphia in a cultural transition zone?

The same way baltimore is...culture AND geography change gradually. Pittsburgh occupies the same position culturally as it does geographically....same with philadelphia which reflects subtle changes as you go south from ny. There are even noticable cultural.differences in a given area. For example, rivertown culture is different from areas like monto or chesco. Pay attention to context

Originally Posted by couldntthinkofaclevername

I'm not talking about things like climates or small things like the industry that Philadelphia and Baltimore both had.
I'm talking about the fact that Baltimore and Pittsburgh both straddle multiple distinct areas. Baltimore has the Mid-Atlantic and South, and Pittsburgh has Appalachia, the Mid-Atlantic, and the Rust Belt.
Both cities share characteristics of the areas they straddle, which makes them unique.

small things like industry? so steel is a small thing in Pittsburgh's past? the ports and railroads are a small part of Baltimore and Philadelphia's past? without these things the towns either wouldn't exist or would be much smaller, like charleston. I also find the Rust Belt to be kind of a meaningless description. Philadelphia IS a rust belt city AND an east coast university town rolled into one. Baltimore is also very rust belt. I'm not saying places are clones, but it's also false that Pittsburgh=Cleveland...and really, what does any of this have to do with blacks in Philadelphia or Pittsburgh?

[escilade18]

Originally Posted by pman

and really, what does any of this have to do with blacks in Philadelphia or Pittsburgh?

This is true, I am contemplating making another thread (or adding to an existing one). Sorry if I kind of knocked this off topic a little