You're leaving PA? Why and where? (Philadelphia, Pittsburgh: apartment, condo, home)

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by pman

It wouldn't be a bad thing, though, if more Pennsylvanians considered living in its own cities such as Philadelphia or Pittsburgh before bailing on the whole state.

Nah, let 'em leave.

If they really believe that geography holds them back, then they're not worth keeping anyway. Instead of worrying about people staying, focus instead on attracting people from elsewhere. It's a much more organic and effective way of promoting change than listening to people who think they're intellectually and culturally superior to their peers ***** about how "backwards" or "behind the times" everybody is simply because they live within a certain political boundary.

[bluecarebear]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

Like you, I grew up in a small town (Pittston Township) in Northeastern Pennsylvania. It was a suburb roughly equidistant from either Scranton or Wilkes-Barre, two larger cities. I didn't view the area as being a particularly "bad" place to live; however, I certainly did see it as being unnecessarily mediocre. Most people there were content to leave things "as-is" while I saw nothing but potential for betterment all around me. All of the "bones" were there to make Northeastern Pennsylvania a great place, but people overwhelmingly had the "if it ain't broke, then don't fix it" mentality. I viewed the area as being very racist and homophobic, and I still do to this day, despite positive changes that are finally occuring there (such as Pittston drafting an ordinance prohibiting discrimination against the LGBT community as it tries to reinvent itself as a quasi-hipster artists' colony).

I graduated from college in Wilkes-Barre and hoofed it to Northern Virginia, where I had accepted a job offer. I quickly learned "the grass ain't always greener on the other side" as I quickly grew homesick for PA and couldn't find many redeeming qualities about where I was living. Northern Virginia is a great place to live (if you're rich), but if you're poor and just starting out it's horrible. The area felt like a huge suburb with no real defined communities or "towns", if you will. Traffic congestion was immense, and it really put those supposedy bad "rush-hour back-ups" on I-81 near Scranton into perspective. I fell into a crowd of ruthless people, and being a small-town bumpkin who trusted everyone I let myself be taken advantage of emotionally and socially.

Eventually therapy taught me that sometimes an area can be toxic to your well-being. I knew I was homesick for PA, but I didn't want to move back near family, who still (to this day) doesn't embrace me for being homosexual. I tried Pittsburgh on a whim, and I've taken to it like a fish to water. It is like a larger version of Scranton, except with educated, open-minded, and tolerant people instead of uneducated, narrow-minded, intolerant ones. My partner and I don't display affection in public, but if we so chose to do so we could hold hands here without fear of persecution. I don't exactly think the same would be true if we held hands while walking to the movies in Scranton or Wilkes-Barre. Various races live harmonisouly here whereas the few blacks and Hispanics that the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area had were all dumped into small pockets of the city cores while bigoted white people moved away from them to expensive lily-white suburbs like Clarks Summit or Shavertown to offer their children a "better quality-of-life" (away from black people).

PA is a large and diverse state. Just because Northeastern and North Central Pennsylvania may suck doesn't mean Philadelphia or Pittsburgh have to.

Funny because I am leaving Pittsburgh. The city was fabulous back in the 2000s but has become, as you say, a great place to live (if you are rich). Pittsburgh has embraced TRENDY. Not good.

As a 20 year old (OP), you haven't reached the stage where you are dealing with college loans, a mortgage, a career, a family, COL, and taxes. Once you hit that point in life, you will understand why the old people and families are moving to the burbs and that a relocation decision has nothing to do with race or sexual preference.

[JJ Johnson]

I moved west 29 years ago and will likely never move back. I miss a some things about the greenery and the hills of Pennsylvania, but if it ever becomes too much of a longing, I'd probably move back east to some place like North Carolina or Tennessee. There are so many things that I dislike about Pennsylvania, I just wish I would have left sooner.

[loose cannon]

Had a few unsuccessful attempts to leave the commonwealth in years past and I am haunted by my foolish decisions not to stick with it. I now know what I want more than before. In the meantime I am a prisoner of the Lehizzle foshizzzle and make the best of it. In 2 years I hope to be in "Flair Country" (Carolinas) , Austin, Denver Washington St., or Oregon.

[Pine to Vine]

I wonder if someone can help me with an interesting observation. I am soon 59 years old. During my life so far, I have lived in or near the largest city in five different states: Wilmington (DE), Boston (MA), Kansas City (MO), and Houston (TX) before retiring to Philly 3 and a half years ago. In each of these others cities, I felt I was a resident in both the cities and states. I experience a whole different vibe where, however. PA seems really "out there" - a place I only have to deal with at license plate renewal and tax time. Other than that, it seems a remote entity that nevertheless has a say in how I fund my schools and who I can marry. I've sensed here on CD (though not in real life) a line of thinking by some that Philly has a more natural affiliation with NJ. In truth, I do feel that, though I do NOT want to be a NJ resident.

At the end of the day, I simply feel like I live in Philly - not PA. I guess I might say "I'm in PA but not of PA." There's just something that I can't put my finger on that makes it so for me. The answer is not that I feel disconnected because Philly is a liberal island in a conservative state. I did that for 26 years: Houston is a Democratic city in . . . well, you know. (BTW - I am here in Philly to stay. At least that's the plan.)

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by jm02

I wonder if someone can help me with an interesting observation. I am soon 59 years old. During my life so far, I have lived in or near the largest city in five different states: Wilmington (DE), Boston (MA), Kansas City (MO), and Houston (TX) before retiring to Philly 3 and a half years ago. In each of these others cities, I felt I was a resident in both the cities and states. I experience a whole different vibe where, however. PA seems really "out there" - a place I only have to deal with at license plate renewal and tax time. Other than that, it seems a remote entity that nevertheless has a say in how I fund my schools and who I can marry. I've sensed here on CD (though not in real life) a line of thinking by some that Philly has a more natural affiliation with NJ. In truth, I do feel that, though I do NOT want to be a NJ resident.

At the end of the day, I simply feel like I live in Philly - not PA. I guess I might say "I'm in PA but not of PA." There's just something that I can't put my finger on that makes it so for me. The answer is not that I feel disconnected because Philly is a liberal island in a conservative state. I did that for 26 years: Houston is a Democratic city in . . . well, you know. (BTW - I am here in Philly to stay. At least that's the plan.)

Pennsylvania has not gone Republican in a presidential election since 1988, and the people also elected a Democrat governor for two terms from 2003 through 2011, so I'm really not sure where this idea of a "conservative" state comes from. Conservative compared to Philadelphia and the East Coast megalopolis doesn't necessarily mean conservative overall.

[bradjl2009]

Originally Posted by bluecarebear

Funny because I am leaving Pittsburgh. The city was fabulous back in the 2000s but has become, as you say, a great place to live (if you are rich). Pittsburgh has embraced TRENDY. Not good.

Lol. There are so many affordable parts of Pittsburgh you can't be taken seriously. It's time for some people to realize there are more parts of the city than Shadyside and Squirrel Hill.

[Pine to Vine]

Originally Posted by Gnutella

Pennsylvania has not gone Republican in a presidential election since 1988, and the people also elected a Democrat governor for two terms from 2003 through 2011, so I'm really not sure where this idea of a "conservative" state comes from. Conservative compared to Philadelphia and the East Coast megalopolis doesn't necessarily mean conservative overall.

My point is not that PA is conservative in the same manner as TX. I am making an analogy that compared the the rest of their respective states, Philadelphia and Houston are (my term) liberal islands:

Pennsylvania Overview - 2012 Election Center - Elections & Politics from CNN.com
Texas Presidential Race - 2012 Election Center - Elections & Politics from CNN.com

[JJ Johnson]

Keep in mind that Pennsylvania has historically had a high percentage of union workers, which generally translates to voting Democrat. Outside of the cities of Pittsburgh and Philadelphia, I don't think the voting trends translate into being liberal. The rural portions of PA, just like most states, are quite conservative.

[bluecarebear]

Originally Posted by bradjl2009

Lol. There are so many affordable parts of Pittsburgh you can't be taken seriously. It's time for some people to realize there are more parts of the city than Shadyside and Squirrel Hill.

Or Lawrenceville, South Side, Mexican War Streets, Strip, etc. Not a whole lot of choices left.