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I'm not looking to get into a philosphical debate either so if you could just cite the passage in the Consititution about the right to "equitable health care & access to healthy food" and health insurance then I'll let the subject go...
Quote:
Originally Posted by b75
Right b/c the constitution is the only document that proves our founding father's intent or that substantiates our rights as citizens...
The problem is health care providers and drug companies have gotten away with charging exorbitant fees for their goods and services because people like YOU don't ask questions. The insurance companies, drug companies, and health care providers are all in cahoots with the government.
Philip T. said it beautifully in his earlier post on this thread:
So why are you all such conditioned sheep into never questioning the over-priced medical bills? That is where the problem lies -- not in the need for nor lack of insurance. The bills have been ran up to gouge US and medical, pharmco and insurance industry all profit from this. They have paid Congress and rest of the related government hundreds of millions to make this all possible.
They are all making bank by working together. Have you tracked how medical bills are marked down by the insurance industry before payment, but it still all profitable to medical and pharmco folks end? The whole thing is a fraud. Time to out-source around the crooks. The Mexicans are right -- nothing but loss in the whole mess and time to route around.
and Yes, I do not buy "health insurance." (a racket). We pay cash as needed and I will sue the @ss off any provider who tries to gouge us for paying cash.
lemon drop
I am not trying to call you out. I am just making the point that you are going without insurance but if you have a major expense your choice is going to cost the taxpayers and probably not you (unless you have deep pockets). I think if you can afford it then you should have a major medial policy. If you don't then you are as much a part of the problem as you accuse me of being.
I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I think the solution is to add more market forces into the industry. That is why I think HSAs are such a good idea, or at least a good start. That encourages people "like me" to ask questions about the price.
Well technically an American should be able to have all 3, including equitable health care & access to healthy food, which is a whole other area that would provide for exhaustive debate (which I don't want to get into).
If an American is entitled to all three then what are you basing this on? The Constitution is a basic outline of our rights (and the limitations of Big Government - another topic).
I think HSAs were a horrible idea...Let me guess you voted for W, right? We couldn't be on more opposite sides of the fence here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan
I am not trying to call you out. I am just making the point that you are going without insurance but if you have a major expense your choice is going to cost the taxpayers and probably not you (unless you have deep pockets). I think if you can afford it then you should have a major medial policy. If you don't then you are as much a part of the problem as you accuse me of being.
I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I think the solution is to add more market forces into the industry. That is why I think HSAs are such a good idea, or at least a good start. That encourages people "like me" to ask questions about the price.
I hate paying my health insurance premiums each month. I have a huge deductible and my fear is, well, if I really did get sick, they would drop me anyhow.
I don't trust health insurance companies.
On the original subject, I have been thinking about this. I am in the middle of deciding whether to make some changes to the health insurance that our company offers.
In our area (So Cal) the premiums for a family run about $800 per month for an HMO with a $20 co-pay. It is excellent coverage with Kaiser Permanente. However, that is $9600 per year. What are the odds that any one family is going to use $9600 per year in services? Many do, but most don't. I bet most families would spend under $2000 per year if they added up the full cost of their care, including labs, tests, visits, and prescriptions. Obviously if you have a chronic condition then the above figures are off.
So are health insurance premiums throwing money out the window? I think most families would be better off with a Health Savings Account and a high-deductible policy.
What I said is that an American should be able to access equitable health care & healthy food. Not so sure what is controversial about that. I mean technically one could say that falls under the concept of "right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness," you know what with a person's health being essential to attaining any of those things. People seem to confuse the concept of the government being available to be used by its citizens, as the resource that it is, as somehow being on the same level of being intruded upon legally. The two are very different concepts and as you can see by our founding fathers alternative statements advocating certain social programs, the former was their intentions at the time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan
If an American is entitled to all three then what are you basing this on? The Constitution is a basic outline of our rights (and the limitations of Big Government - another topic).
I think HSAs were a horrible idea...Let me guess you voted for W, right? We couldn't be on more opposite sides of the fence here.
I did vote for W, but very reluctantly. I don't trust "compassionate conservatives" as being either.
b75, we are never going agree on this because we apparently have a very different idea of the role of government. HSA are such a good idea that I am surprised that Congress passed them! Maybe we'll have the debate on a different thread.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.
Why wouldn't they? It was a Republican congress passing a Republican president's bill - It must've been a real hard sell ya' know?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan
I did vote for W, but very reluctantly. I don't trust "compassionate conservatives" as being either.
b75, we are never going agree on this because we apparently have a very different idea of the role of government. HSA are such a good idea that I am surprised that Congress passed them! Maybe we'll have the debate on a different thread.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.
And on your personal issue check out ehealth.com and see if there are any other alternatives there for yourself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan
On the original subject, I have been thinking about this. I am in the middle of deciding whether to make some changes to the health insurance that our company offers.
In our area (So Cal) the premiums for a family run about $800 per month for an HMO with a $20 co-pay. It is excellent coverage with Kaiser Permanente. However, that is $9600 per year. What are the odds that any one family is going to use $9600 per year in services? Many do, but most don't. I bet most families would spend under $2000 per year if they added up the full cost of their care, including labs, tests, visits, and prescriptions. Obviously if you have a chronic condition then the above figures are off.
So are health insurance premiums throwing money out the window? I think most families would be better off with a Health Savings Account and a high-deductible policy.
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