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Grew up in a large family with a single wage earner. I never went to bed hungry but we never took a family vacation either. No credit card in the home. Everything except a vehicle was paid for with cash. I knew not to ask for frivolous things because the answer was going to be no.
Left home and joined the military service. Hung around long enough to earn a pension. Lived within my means most of the time. I delayed a lot of gratification. My friends said I was cheap. But I was actually thrifty.
Nearing retirement age, I have no loans. I got a few bucks in the bank. I travel often. Home is paid for. So are both the vehicles. Occasionally I regret not spending money when I was younger. But lacking a crystal ball, I didn't realize that things would work out OK in the end.
Now how does this compare to someone that grew up higher up the class ladder? Is it easier for someone from meager means to find financial contentment when compared to someone who was more of a silver spooner? If you land lower on the socioeconomic ladder when compared to your parents, is that underachieving?
And how about reaching down? Should parents intervene when their children struggle financially? Or is the struggle part of the learning process?
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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As parents, we hope for our kids to do better than we did in life, financially and otherwise. I was one of 9 kids, one working parent, and we managed but there was no extravagance by any means. I remember when in college (all paid for myself working full time0 in the 1970s hoping that some day I would make as much as my father, but with less or no kids. He was making $40k, that would be a real struggle today. Thankfully I ended up at 3.5x that much, plus a working wife. Here, that's still just comfortable, and just below the median income in our city. Over the years we have had some struggles, such as in the 2008 recession.
All 3 of our kids have gotten degrees, and with little need for our help financially. Two of them are making good livings, own a house and have kids. The 3rd is getting some help from us. I really don't know anyone who grew up with a silver spoon, so I can't compare, but it seems to me that when you start out on your own with little money or help you appreciate your success more when it comes.
Now how does this compare to someone that grew up higher up the class ladder? Is it easier for someone from meager means to find financial contentment when compared to someone who was more of a silver spooner? If you land lower on the socioeconomic ladder when compared to your parents, is that underachieving?
And how about reaching down? Should parents intervene when their children struggle financially? Or is the struggle part of the learning process?
I wasn't a silver spooner, but I did grow up solidly middle class, maybe upper middle class by the time I was in high school. Even though my dad was making more money at that point, we stayed in the same middle class neighborhood. My mom went back to work when I was in 4th grade, but my dad was the main breadwinner.
Having savings and avoiding debt other than a reasonable mortgage (i.e. a smaller mortgage than the bank was willing to give you) was definitely stressed in my household. It was also emphasized that even if you could afford something, it didn't automatically mean you should buy it. I thought everyone lived like we did--or at least aspired to it. It was a bit of a shock to find out a lot of people didn't emphasize those things.
I think there are pros and cons in any financial situation. Overall, I'd say the higher you are on the economic ladder, the more advantages you have. But there are always drawbacks. There are certainly some upper middle class and rich kids who will never do much with thelr lives (financially or otherwise) because things came too easily and they're not used to putting the required effort into things to be successful at anything. This extends to things like relationships as well as finances. I've seen this happen. A lot of times their parents are propping them up well into adulthood. It may not look as bad as being poor, but when everything is hard for you because things came easy, I'm not sure your life is really better just because your parents are propping you up in a better lifestyle.
I do think it's easier for people who grew up with lesser means to be happier with less stuff. But it can go the opposite way, too. Some kids who grew up without stuff go crazy with spending if/when they get a good income. So there's a danger of being a high income broke person. They can also go the other way and sell themselves short in terms of expectations in life.
I'm lower on the socioeconomic ladder than my parents, but I'm not poor or broke. I didn't work as hard as my dad did. My dad worked a full time job, went back to school at night, and was in the Navy reserves 2 weekends a month for 22 years. I knew I didn't want to work that hard. My dad grew up poor/working class. He had more drive than I did. I was more comfortable growing up but have less than my parents, but I've always had more free time, and that's how I prefer it. This is how these things tend to go.
Should parents help their kids? In general, I think they should err on the side of giving them less than more, especially when in their teens and 20s. The exception might be truly necessary medical care and reasonable amounts for education (in a field that actually has market demand). Starting out in life debt free with a marketable college degree is not a small thing. In most cases, it simply isn't possible to work your way through college like people did in the past because tuition is too high.
That said, I admit to being a bit of a hypocrite. I'm 52 and living at my mom's right now (after being on my own from age 19 until a few months ago). I have significant retirement savings plus a decent pension coming in 2 years, so living at her place is not an absolute necessity. But since I didn't have enough in non-retirement savings to live on for the next 2 years without dipping into retirement accounts, I am working part time, looking for a better position, and saving a good chunk of my low earnings. I also help around the house with small things. It helps my mom, but she could manage without me, it would just be a bit harder or more time consuming. My dad passed away a year ago and I do think having someone else in the house is good for her. Should she let me live here rent free? People will have their opinions.
I can definitely see I have a certain amount of privilege/advantage. My mom is in a decent financial position, so I don't need to help support her. I can live at her place rent free and even though I'm not making a lot, I can save a decent amount since my expenses are low. This is a real advantage over what other people have. I have a certain amount of financial pressure, but I'm not desperate. Sometimes desperation leads to really bad decision making. So even though I'm not squandering my advantage, it's still an advantage nonetheless.
Last edited by mysticaltyger; 04-20-2023 at 09:54 AM..
My parents were upper middle class based on income (I think) but didn't buy us things for the sake of buying them. My mom drove a used minivan and my dad never bought a new vehicle until he was 65 and retiring.
We went to private grade school and they paid for my college. When I was laid off from my job in the recession they paid for my COBRA health insurance. They gave me support for neccessary things that would impact health, safety, and opportunity but nothing frivolous. Not having student loan debt allowed me to save more for retirement and housing down payment. They didn't give me money for a house but I certianly their previous support helped us in other ways.
I will never earn as much as my dad did (I think about $250,000/year) and my mom stayed home, so we won't be "better off" from an income perspective but when they pas we'll certainly have a chunk of change (I think about $2m per sibling) so we can provide my kids the same things my parents provided to me. I plan to pay for my kids college but not buy them a car or anything.
I can't answer your question regarding someone that grew up from a higher socioeconomic ladder, but I can from the bottom. I grew up dirt poor, like the trailer in Central FL I last lived in my mother sold for $500 kind of poor. Didn't have Air-conditioning in FL, and when something broke it pretty much stayed that way missing windows, shower water draining to under the house, hot water heater broke and stayed that way. Terrible schools and I dropped out of HS in the 11th grade.
I did wind up getting my GED, joined the military. Flash forward to today, I'm retired military, have a Masters Degree, make six figures, live in Southern CA and own my home, take vacations frequently, own 3 new cars, etc. To achieve all of this took tons of sacrifice and a lot of work. I literally went from absolute nothing and absolute zero help from my parents and relatives none whatsoever. I think a huge motivation for me is I hated my childhood and hated being poor and it drove me (still does) into overdrive to work hard to achieve the life I wanted.
Growing up we were the poorest of my family compared to Uncles and Aunts and their families. They grew up solidly middle class and now struggle to maintain that life with some falling below that, and even some are scummy and steal money from other relatives or constantly trying to borrow money to maintain their lifestyle. They know I live in CA and am doing well and constantly try to mention money to me, nope have a nice life. I'm the most successful out of all of my cousins etc. in my family as far as where I am now on the socioeconomic ladder.
My son is almost 20 and I did recently co-sign on a new car loan for him, but he saved up $5700 of his own money and I didn't give any. I can afford to send him to college, but I won't pay for it, and he is going and working at the same time to pay for his own college. I'm only willing to help when he is on track doing the right thing e.g. working, school, spending wisely. I do let him fail and not help him sometimes like recently he owes $1000 and has to go to court. I told him he better save up and work extra cause I'll watch you go to jail and not bail you out either. I refuse to help people that won't help themselves or feel they are entitled to something. Struggle is part of developing. If your handed everything you don't develop ways to improve you own life on your own.
I'm watching a friend struggle with those questions right now. He's an engineer with a solid six figure salary job, his wife grew up poor working hourly wages. He just went to work and left the home finances and child rearing to his wife. Now their 20-something aged kids are struggling because they never learned to get those salaried jobs, they are all smart enough to get college degrees but there was no expectation or push to do so. It's like they assumed the mothers financial mindset while growing up in an upper middle class household, but didn't learn the skills to maintain or exceed that.
The irony is his parents were poor immigrants who insisted their 4 kids get college degrees, and subsequently they all have salaried professional jobs. With those jobs comes health insurance, retirement plans, investments, bonuses, maybe stock options, tax planning, etc... I guess the bottom line I see is that financial class is very much driven and perpetuated by family culture and expectations. If the parental expectation is graduate high school then go to work, or get a college degree and salaried job, or maybe everyone becomes a doctor/lawyer/phd, then that's what the kids generally learn to do.
We were working class growing up - sometimes really struggled, sometimes a little more secure, but my parents were never able to save or get of debt until long after kids left home. I went to college on scholarship, and at the time the credit card companies were allowed to set up tables in the student center to convince kids to sign up for credit cards for a free frisbee or t-shirt or whatever, and I did fall for that a little bit, and thought paying the minimum payments was just fine for a while - had to learn financial responsibility on my own, but never got in real trouble, just got a fair amount of credit card debt that I had to buckle down and get serious about as I got a little older. It took time to get myself where I wanted to be financially - working myself up the ladder as well as getting smarter financially both had to happen to make that realistic. I think there are times when it is appropriate to help kids and times when it isn't. For example, the cost of college can truly set one up for starting out in a very deep hole, so it makes sense to develop a plan between kids and parents that shares some of the burden there if parents are able - not a free ride for the kid to go play and flunk out or pick the priciest option unnecessarily or go to college when they really have no interest and low chance of success as a result, etc., but something that makes sense for both the parents and kid. When I extended my undergrad by one year to get a teaching license, my scholarship had run out, so I was now on loans. The school would only do parent loans, but my parents told me that as soon as I graduated and got a job, I would be responsible for paying them back and taking over the remainder of the loan. At some point they forgave me much of what they had already paid, but only after I had consistently paid them back for quite a while. At one point they also sold me a used car of theirs for very low monthly payments, obviously better than I could get buying through a dealership. A few times, especially around holidays, my parents would give me and my brother a few hundred dollars to help out with groceries or gas, as a gift. One time, my refrigerator quit working and I went nine months with only a mini-fridge because at the time I couldn't afford a new fridge - my parents helped me out to get a new one. They also had helped me out a couple times with the cost of home repairs/work - for example, they paid for the wood for my brother to install a covered parking for me (since my house has no garage) after all our roofs and cars were totaled by hail twice in one summer.
Grew up in a large family with a single wage earner. I never went to bed hungry but we never took a family vacation either. No credit card in the home. Everything except a vehicle was paid for with cash. I knew not to ask for frivolous things because the answer was going to be no.
Left home and joined the military service. Hung around long enough to earn a pension. Lived within my means most of the time. I delayed a lot of gratification. My friends said I was cheap. But I was actually thrifty.
Nearing retirement age, I have no loans. I got a few bucks in the bank. I travel often. Home is paid for. So are both the vehicles. Occasionally I regret not spending money when I was younger. But lacking a crystal ball, I didn't realize that things would work out OK in the end.
The bottom line is what makes you happy.
Did you like the fact that you never got to take a vacation or travel when you were growing up?
Many people would consider that to be a deprivation.
I can't answer your question regarding someone that grew up from a higher socioeconomic ladder, but I can from the bottom. I grew up dirt poor, like the trailer in Central FL I last lived in my mother sold for $500 kind of poor. Didn't have Air-conditioning in FL, and when something broke it pretty much stayed that way missing windows, shower water draining to under the house, hot water heater broke and stayed that way. Terrible schools and I dropped out of HS in the 11th grade.
I did wind up getting my GED, joined the military. Flash forward to today, I'm retired military, have a Masters Degree, make six figures, live in Southern CA and own my home, take vacations frequently, own 3 new cars, etc. To achieve all of this took tons of sacrifice and a lot of work. I literally went from absolute nothing and absolute zero help from my parents and relatives none whatsoever. I think a huge motivation for me is I hated my childhood and hated being poor and it drove me (still does) into overdrive to work hard to achieve the life I wanted.
Growing up we were the poorest of my family compared to Uncles and Aunts and their families. They grew up solidly middle class and now struggle to maintain that life with some falling below that, and even some are scummy and steal money from other relatives or constantly trying to borrow money to maintain their lifestyle. They know I live in CA and am doing well and constantly try to mention money to me, nope have a nice life. I'm the most successful out of all of my cousins etc. in my family as far as where I am now on the socioeconomic ladder.
My son is almost 20 and I did recently co-sign on a new car loan for him, but he saved up $5700 of his own money and I didn't give any. I can afford to send him to college, but I won't pay for it, and he is going and working at the same time to pay for his own college. I'm only willing to help when he is on track doing the right thing e.g. working, school, spending wisely. I do let him fail and not help him sometimes like recently he owes $1000 and has to go to court. I told him he better save up and work extra cause I'll watch you go to jail and not bail you out either. I refuse to help people that won't help themselves or feel they are entitled to something. Struggle is part of developing. If your handed everything you don't develop ways to improve you own life on your own.
How big of a role did joining the military have in your success?
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