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Old 02-16-2009, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Maine
502 posts, read 1,739,109 times
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ok - read over and over about people that don't pay income tax. They "invest" and "plan" so they pay nothing. I find it hard to believe.

So - assuming my wife and I make 90K a year - how does one not pay income tax? We don't own a business. One is a teacher, the other secretary.

Or are the people not paying taxes simply not making that much to begin with?

thoughts?
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Old 02-16-2009, 06:16 PM
 
2,197 posts, read 7,405,811 times
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They max out their retirement plans, maximize their write-offs, offset gains with losses and pay extra mortgage interest at the end of the year to zero out any taxable income. It's not easy to do and you generally have to make less than you would like. For some people, it's doable; for most, it's not. It helps to own a business where you can control how much you make.
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Old 02-17-2009, 01:48 AM
 
Location: Sputnik Planitia
7,829 posts, read 11,828,357 times
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for salaried W2 it is very difficult to cut a substantial amount in taxes besides the usual deductions for children, mortgage interest etc. If you have income as a consultant (1099) or as a corporation then there are all sorts of loopholes that can lead to very little taxation.
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Old 02-17-2009, 04:42 AM
 
20,793 posts, read 61,439,811 times
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We have a rental property that keeps our effective tax rate down pretty low too. I would guess if we had more we would pay no income taxes--keep in mind it doesn't mean we don't pay ANY tax because we still pay plenty in property taxes and other taxes.
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Old 02-17-2009, 05:50 AM
 
13,721 posts, read 19,327,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbyehollywood View Post
They max out their retirement plans, maximize their write-offs, offset gains with losses and pay extra mortgage interest at the end of the year to zero out any taxable income. It's not easy to do and you generally have to make less than you would like. For some people, it's doable; for most, it's not. It helps to own a business where you can control how much you make.
I own a business and since we contributed to retirement plans plus paid a lot of extra stuff last year, like state taxes and extra real estate tax, etc., I thought we'd get off easy at tax time this year. Nope. We paid $7000+ for health insurance/doctor bills/prescriptions, but we were a couple of hundred short of being able to itemize that because it has to be a certain percentage of your income and we didn't quite make it. Then they put a ceiling on the deductions you can take so all the extra stuff we paid only counted up to a point, the rest we were unable to claim, and then we got stuck with AMT (alternative minimum tax). I have come to the conclusion that you can't win. Work for cash is the only thing I can think of.
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Old 02-17-2009, 06:59 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,550 posts, read 61,623,322 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowfax1997 View Post
ok - read over and over about people that don't pay income tax. They "invest" and "plan" so they pay nothing. I find it hard to believe.

So - assuming my wife and I make 90K a year - how does one not pay income tax? We don't own a business. One is a teacher, the other secretary.

Or are the people not paying taxes simply not making that much to begin with?

thoughts?
During my career, my take home pay peaked at $75k, so I guess you could say that it was not much.

I was taught to itemize; which is the alternative to using the 'Standard Deduction'.

However when we really got into it, our best write-offs were using the 'schedules'.

Lowering our AGI on the front page of the 1040.

A schedule 'C', schedule 'E', and schedule 'F'.

Business activities. there are hundreds of types of business activities to choose from.

We have done a laundromat, catering service, bee hives, and apartment buildings.
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Old 02-17-2009, 07:01 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,550 posts, read 61,623,322 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k374 View Post
for salaried W2 it is very difficult to cut a substantial amount in taxes besides the usual deductions for children, mortgage interest etc. If you have income as a consultant (1099) or as a corporation then there are all sorts of loopholes that can lead to very little taxation.
During my work career, my stated income was from pay checks.

We only did the business activities on the side.
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Old 02-17-2009, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
5,725 posts, read 11,744,648 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
During my work career, my stated income was from pay checks.

We only did the business activities on the side.
So did you not report any income from the side business activities?
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Old 02-17-2009, 07:59 AM
 
Location: Houston
529 posts, read 1,302,988 times
Reputation: 374
I would like to know too especially from someone who had to pay close to zero taxes, I always read about it and people talk about all the deductions and so on but I haven't met anyone who can actually say that his/her taxes are almost zero.

In my experience, it would be almost impossible for me to reach that point, my wife and I maximize our 401k's claim deduction for education related to work, we try to claim for medical expenses but it's almost impossible to pass the 7.5% barrier, even claim for tax preparation and tax advise, and still paid tens of thousands in federal taxes between the two of us.
I guess I have to tell my wife to give birth to octuplets to see if that will lower my taxes

Edit: I forgot to add that I also put pretax money for public transportation, an HSA and I was contributing to a ROTH IRA until I got married and passed the income limit but that's just peanuts in comparison to the amount of taxes I pay every year.

Last edited by elikhom; 02-17-2009 at 08:15 AM..
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Old 02-17-2009, 08:29 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
37,550 posts, read 61,623,322 times
Reputation: 30538
Quote:
Originally Posted by maf763 View Post
So did you not report any income from the side business activities?
Always be honest with the IRS.

Never lie to them, never hide anything.

Always report all income [and losses].

I have been audited 3 times, which is not bad for a 20 year career. 2 audits changed nothing the third audit increased our 'refund'.

I say "Refund" because it is goofy. Nothing is withheld from my take pay, nothing is paid when I file my taxes, yet when everything is done we used to get money 'back'.

Running a business activity is very common in America. Most business activities are operated at a loss. Those businesses pay employees, they collect equipment, they serve their customers. But they also lose money.

The loss gets subtracted from the owner's AGI.

There once was an IRS rule that every third year a business had to show a $1 profit. We did that a few times. Every third year a $1 profit.

Now that rule went away.

I know a comic book collector. He goes to trade shows [all deductible], he buys comic books, file cabinets, temp and humidity controlled storage, he dumps a lot of money into this activity.

It is all done with the intent of one day making a huge profit.

But the big pay-off is somewhere in the future. So each year he has massive losses.

All of these losses are subtracted from his AGI. Keeping his AGI low or near zero. He pays no income taxes.
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