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Old 07-24-2012, 06:50 PM
 
Location: West Cedar Park, Philadelphia
1,225 posts, read 2,567,672 times
Reputation: 693

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rotodome View Post
The big problem with the Gallery is that its main pedestrian level is removed from Street level, both physically and also visually. The original planning vision for Market East still had the same idea of an interior mall, with a sub-street-level main concourse which connected with transit. But it had office towers above (which, yes, the Gallery could potentially be retrofit with to some extent), and more importantly - the mall interior had a strong visual connection to the city, from within and without, which is a much better way to do a mall in the center of the city. One that wouldn't isolate itself and suck all of the pedestrian activity off of the street, as the Gallery did even before it was a dump. The trouble is that they gave the development contract to a suburban mall developer, who designed it to work like a suburban mall - engaging the surrounding city similarly to the way suburban malls engage their parking lots. That's the reason why the Gallery, even in its better days, never really did anything to improve Market Street, even after all the money that was sunk into building it. IMO to fix it now would require a major reconfiguration that might actually end up being just as difficult as knocking it down.
I would say demolishing it would be prohibitively expensive given that it straddles the two most important transit lines in the city. Like it or not, the Gallery probably isn't going anywhere for a very, very long time. It will have to be gutted and retrofitted up to the standard of a world class downtown.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:25 AM
 
2,939 posts, read 4,128,527 times
Reputation: 2791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marius Pontmercy View Post
I would say demolishing it would be prohibitively expensive given that it straddles the two most important transit lines in the city. Like it or not, the Gallery probably isn't going anywhere for a very, very long time. It will have to be gutted and retrofitted up to the standard of a world class downtown.
I didn't mean you literally need to take a wrecking ball to it. The Gallery is actually 6 different buildings connected by the concourse. There are only 3 buildings that were built in the late 70s & early 80s as part of the Gallery. The other 3 buildings (part of the first phase of the Gallery) were already there and were incorporated into the Gallery concept. Of those 3 new buildings it's really only the one that that takes up all of the 1000 block of Market St. that needs to go.

I don't think deconstructing that building (on the 1000 block) would really be that difficult. There's nothing over the actual RR tracks on that block except a headhouse and the El runs under Market St. so there's no part of the building that hovers over those tracks (or that even comes that close to the tracks). That part of the concourse might have to close temporarily but there are other ways to access the RR and the El.
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Center City
7,528 posts, read 10,262,211 times
Reputation: 11023
A year after the groundbreaking, looks like construction on the Mormon temple will finally start this fall: Fall groundbreaking expected for Philadelphia's Mormon temple
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Old 07-26-2012, 04:10 AM
 
735 posts, read 1,130,118 times
Reputation: 291
Quote:
Originally Posted by drive carephilly View Post
Exactly. Compare CC to Downtown LA.
I don't think downtown LA compares to CC to be honest with you. I think they still have a ways to go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drive carephilly View Post
... I'd rather have more mid-rise buildings before I had one or two more giant skyscrapers soaking up all the demand for square footage. When the market returns there will be more proposals for big office buildings. Personally i'd like to see the wrecking ball taken to the Gallery so the Aramark Tower could have some company. Some more height east of City Hall would be a nice balance and right over Market East Station is the perfect place.

Also - there are plenty of US cities with killer skylines that have absolutely nothing doing on the street. You can't really beat our city when it comes to scale and street life in Center City and all the neighborhoods around it.
Agree with everything except demolishing the Gallery.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drive carephilly View Post
absolutely agreed that open space is important. we could definitely do a better job in funding the space we have but I still feel like Center City already has what it needs. Central Park was set aside, in part, to make up for the almost complete lack of preserved park space south of it.

Center City has the 4 squares, the Parkway, the expanding Schuylkill River Trail, Independence Mall and associated parks and gardens, Fitler Square, Starr and Seger Rec Centers . . . and of course we have the hardscape public spaces like Dilworth, Love Park, Penn's Landing, etc. and it's also looking likely that the Reading Viaduct is going to wind up as a combination of green space/plaza.

I don't think Center City is ever going to have the problem that Manhattan or Santa Monica has . . . but to be fair, Santa Monica has been built out for quite some time. The lack of park space there didn't happen over the last 30 years.
Agree with this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Summersm343 View Post
The redevelopment of Market East is very simple, and demolishing the Gallery is not the answer.

1. The Gallery needs a facelift. Possibly add signage and billboards like Times Square, and the bottom needs to be opened up with retail facing Market to add to a more pedestrian friendly experience. Here pedestrians could enter stores from Market Street or enter the Gallery.

2. The Gallery needs to be a middle class shopping and tourist destination. I'm thinking of Abercrombie and Toys R Us and Gap's, etc. in the Gallery, it does not need to be high end shopping like Walnut, but it should be middle class shopping like Times Square. Also bars and restaurants and Theaters and possibly a movie theater here would be a great addition. Like someone said before, multiple hotels in this area where tourists could walk out into a 24 hour tourist destination would be ideal.

3. I believe there are 3 or 4 palettes that can hold high rises on top of the Gallery. This is not the place for residential but I think this is a great spot for two hotels and two office buildings when the demand calls for them.

4. The entire South side of Market East needs to be redeveloped from 8th and Market to 12th and Market. I'm thinking a mix of highrise and midrise office, residential and hotel space would do the trick. There is nothing even remotely attractive or worth keeping on this stretch. Knock it all down and rebuild (except for that gorgeous building at the corner of 9th and Market, what is that place?)

5. Lastly, fill the parking lot at 13th and Market with highrise... why is this lot even here?


With this done, development can start to push outward, filling the empty lots, parking lots and underutilized lots south of Market Street as well as filling all the lots North of Market around Franklin Square and throughout Chinatown and redevelopment of that small neighborhood North of the Convention Center. Oh, and something needs to be done about that Greyhound Station just north of the Gallery.
Completely agree with everything except 4. Large scale one-size-fits-all demolition is what ruined Market East in the first place.
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Old 07-26-2012, 09:53 AM
 
2,939 posts, read 4,128,527 times
Reputation: 2791
Quote:
Originally Posted by UDResident View Post
I don't think downtown LA compares to CC to be honest with you. I think they still have a ways to go.
Oh yeah, I know CC Philly is better than DTLA - i'm just saying if you want to make apt comparisons DTLA would compare to CC would compare to downtown Boston, etc. Obviously LA would lose. I have to admit though, downtown LA has huge potential. It's a deceptively large downtown and has the bones to be a really amazing place. But yeah, they need 20-30 years to get there.
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Old 07-26-2012, 10:20 AM
 
Location: back in Philadelphia!
3,264 posts, read 5,653,809 times
Reputation: 2146
Yeah, downtown LA has made great strides just in the last few years, and is on a pretty good trajectory.
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Old 07-27-2012, 11:18 AM
 
Location: The City
22,378 posts, read 38,935,335 times
Reputation: 7976
Changing Skyline: Unions, developers stuck in standoff over Philadelphia building
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Old 07-27-2012, 03:03 PM
 
2,939 posts, read 4,128,527 times
Reputation: 2791
Disgusting.

It's a disservice to unions to consider the "building trades" a union. They're guilds made up of skilled laborers and thus they're price-fixing club.

Being an electrician or a carpenter is something that you only become good at after years on the job. It's not something you learn in a month or two. You can already command a premium for your services. Everything after that is extortion.

Back in my younger days I was driving a truck for a parcel service that shall rename nameless. At the time it wasn't unionized. The working conditions were terrible, the pay was bad, the turnover high and the frequency of accidents and injuries were at unacceptable levels. The company didn't care because it was easy to fire people who complained about the terrible ladders that people were always getting hurt on and bring in someone new for even less money. Unionizing was win-win because there was a more motivated workforce, one that knew what it was doing, that wasn't planning an exit strategy, that wasn't getting hurt and suing the company and that company is still one of the biggest in the biz.

There's a big city not too far from here where a major university hospital is buying up all of the smaller hospitals and closing some of them - in part to eliminate competition and in part to control wages. It's good for the bottom line but it creates an environment where nurses want to get out of that city as quickly as possible so you get high turnover and a lot of inexperienced staff. Not a great situation for a hospital.

I have no sympathy for the carpenter's guild. If they're too dumb to figure out that cheaper building costs mean more building and thus, more work, then they deserve what they get.
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Old 07-28-2012, 11:26 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
8,700 posts, read 14,701,215 times
Reputation: 3668
Topping off of the new Temple University Highrise

New Temple residential building reaches top height | Temple University News

Temple Univ. tops off new residence hall | 6abc.com
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Old 07-28-2012, 11:35 PM
 
2,939 posts, read 4,128,527 times
Reputation: 2791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summersm343 View Post
I was on 95 yesterday headed back towards Center City from the Northeast (I wasn't driving) and I was admiring this building. From afar it looks much taller than 27 floors. I guess the rise in altitude from CC to the Temple campus gives that building a leg up.
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