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Old 06-27-2018, 10:47 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia Pa
1,205 posts, read 932,797 times
Reputation: 1312

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
A lot of people(30 something millennials) are having babies. Lots of strollers in the city. Can 20somethings who probably owe lots of student debt afford shopping very much? Empty nesters are around but ....

As I said, I don't shop for clothes like I used to. My retirement wardrobe does not match my working one. And now I may get something new a few times a year. When I was working I was getting something new just about every month. So someone like me isn't helping.

Restaurants are busy so people are spending that way.
Right, agreed. I think this is ultimately less about demographics though and more about how people shop. There is no chance I'd go walk through the crowds of the Rittenhouse area to individual stores for the privilege of paying top retail prices when I could drive between 30 and 60 minutes and be at one of three massive outlet malls. Not only can I get 50% off at the outlets and find a bigger selection, I can get literally all my clothes, shoe, and in some cases, home goods shopping done in one fell-swoop. If I need something specific like a suit or sports coat, I'm probably going to Enzo or somewhere for customization, as custom has become almost as affordable as off the rack these days. And, if I know my size, I'm just ordering it online for even bigger discounts and ultimate convenience.

Other than a last minute one-off purchase or for people who cannot travel outside the city and/or order online, I don't even understand the purpose of retail in the city.
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Old 06-27-2018, 11:26 AM
 
Location: New York City
9,317 posts, read 9,141,671 times
Reputation: 6372
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennsport View Post
Right, agreed. I think this is ultimately less about demographics though and more about how people shop. There is no chance I'd go walk through the crowds of the Rittenhouse area to individual stores for the privilege of paying top retail prices when I could drive between 30 and 60 minutes and be at one of three massive outlet malls. Not only can I get 50% off at the outlets and find a bigger selection, I can get literally all my clothes, shoe, and in some cases, home goods shopping done in one fell-swoop. If I need something specific like a suit or sports coat, I'm probably going to Enzo or somewhere for customization, as custom has become almost as affordable as off the rack these days. And, if I know my size, I'm just ordering it online for even bigger discounts and ultimate convenience.

Other than a last minute one-off purchase or for people who cannot travel outside the city and/or order online, I don't even understand the purpose of retail in the city.
Not understanding the purpose/ not utilizing the retail doesn't mean it should not be there.

Obviously there are other factors... its a combo of a lackluster retail market, ecommerce high rents on Walnut, low sales per sqft, weak brands, underdeveloped retail market, and KoP.

And as I said before, you can have your shopping preferences, we all do, but if a city of 1.5M can't sustain a semi-decent retail corridor, or even attract everyday home stores and retail, then demographics and the market in the city are certainly a factor.
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Old 06-27-2018, 11:38 AM
 
Location: close to home
6,201 posts, read 3,485,956 times
Reputation: 4761
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp View Post
Not understanding the purpose/ not utilizing the retail doesn't mean it should not be there.

Obviously there are other factors... its a combo of a lackluster retail market, ecommerce high rents on Walnut, low sales per sqft, weak brands, underdeveloped retail market, and KoP.

And as I said before, you can have your shopping preferences, we all do, but if a city of 1.5M can't sustain a semi-decent retail corridor, or even attract everyday home stores and retail, then demographics and the market in the city are certainly a factor.
I think demographics are key. And I can’t be the only one who would welcome with open arms somewhere other than quasi Targets to shop in which are poorly stocked and in disarray. I go there mostly for Peet’s coffee and raspberries, which are inexpensive and fresh, respectively.
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Old 06-27-2018, 12:02 PM
 
5,546 posts, read 6,811,871 times
Reputation: 3824
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannah5555 View Post
I think demographics are key. And I can’t be the only one who would welcome with open arms somewhere other than quasi Targets to shop in which are poorly stocked and in disarray. I go there mostly for Peet’s coffee and raspberries, which are inexpensive and fresh, respectively.
I've found the mini-Targets to not be useful. They carry so little that I go in looking for something they don't have...and now I never go in.
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Old 06-27-2018, 12:07 PM
 
Location: close to home
6,201 posts, read 3,485,956 times
Reputation: 4761
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
I've found the mini-Targets to not be useful. They carry so little that I go in looking for something they don't have...and now I never go in.
Exactly, unfortunately. As cpomp has pointed out before, a Bed Bath and Beyond would be awesome. Not sure why there isn’t one since I think the demographics could support it.
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Old 06-27-2018, 12:51 PM
 
741 posts, read 442,714 times
Reputation: 1195
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
I've found the mini-Targets to not be useful. They carry so little that I go in looking for something they don't have...and now I never go in.
Same.
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Old 06-27-2018, 06:18 PM
 
10,787 posts, read 8,627,443 times
Reputation: 3983
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp View Post
Not understanding the purpose/ not utilizing the retail doesn't mean it should not be there.

Obviously there are other factors... its a combo of a lackluster retail market, ecommerce high rents on Walnut, low sales per sqft, weak brands, underdeveloped retail market, and KoP.

And as I said before, you can have your shopping preferences, we all do, but if a city of 1.5M can't sustain a semi-decent retail corridor, or even attract everyday home stores and retail, then demographics and the market in the city are certainly a factor.
The foot traffic in Center City, especially since it's gotten warmer, is very high. So is it what you said: do people not want to shop in stores even when the stores are right there?

I was in KoP last Thursday and it was pretty dead in there too. Granted it was a week day but still....
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Old 06-27-2018, 07:12 PM
 
10,787 posts, read 8,627,443 times
Reputation: 3983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannah5555 View Post
Exactly, unfortunately. As cpomp has pointed out before, a Bed Bath and Beyond would be awesome. Not sure why there isn’t one since I think the demographics could support it.
Well, we still do not know entirely what's going to be in the new "Gallery". The demographics would support it and have for quite some time so it's a mystery as to why not. Location of a large enough store could be the reason why.

Anyhow depending on what it is, and isn't too bulky, I go to the one in Wynnewood Shopping Center. You can take the Paoli-Thorndale train. The shopping center, which has been there since the 50s, is right across the street from the Wynnewood train station. Of course there's uber too. I grew up nearby so I'm pretty familiar with the area.
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Old 06-27-2018, 07:19 PM
 
Location: close to home
6,201 posts, read 3,485,956 times
Reputation: 4761
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
Well, we still do not know entirely what's going to be in the new "Gallery". The demographics would support it and have for quite some time so it's a mystery as to why not. Location of a large enough store could be the reason why.

Anyhow depending on what it is, and isn't too bulky, I go to the one in Wynnewood Shopping Center. You can take the Paoli-Thorndale train. The shopping center, which has been there since the 50s, is right across the street from the Wynnewood train station. Of course there's uber too. I grew up nearby so I'm pretty familiar with the area.
Good to know. I was dismayed to learn there’s no train to KoP but there will be 😃.
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Old 06-28-2018, 08:05 AM
 
Location: New York City
9,317 posts, read 9,141,671 times
Reputation: 6372
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
The foot traffic in Center City, especially since it's gotten warmer, is very high. So is it what you said: do people not want to shop in stores even when the stores are right there?

I was in KoP last Thursday and it was pretty dead in there too. Granted it was a week day but still....
I've never been to KoP on a weekday, but I imagine its a lot slower than Friday - Sunday.

And I think a lot of the super high-end stores (Jimmy Choo, Hermes, Bottega, etc.) cater to a specific customer who spends $20k on a visit, moreso than foot traffic. That's how it is in NYC too (as you probably know).

I was in the Nordstrom, Neiman Marcus, and Bloomingdales a month ago and they were all very busy, as was the Macys in Center City, so that is good, I'm always sad when a department store closes.
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