Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
2,500,000 members. Thank you!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Pennsylvania > Philadelphia
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 09-22-2019, 08:32 AM
 
Location: NYC based - Used to Live in Philly - Transplant from Miami
2,307 posts, read 2,744,835 times
Reputation: 2610

Advertisements

I went down to Philadelphia and was proud of what the Gallery has become.
Before continue reading what I write, I want to apologize for my English. Since English is not my first, second or even third language, there will be mistakes. And since it will be a wrong writing, I will only slightly proofread it. :P :P :P

Several personal observations:

1. There were lots of people, and they came from various demographics; locals, tourists and suburbanites. No homeless was spotted in the food court. I hope this trend continues.

2. Cool and interactive arts; some similar to what we have in Hudson Yards.

3. Despite most of the corners spots have not been filled, H&M is definitely a major success. Three story high and shiny. Definitely sucked in suburbanites and tourists from the street.

4. Just beside H&M, there will be a Starbucks. It will be accessible only from the street level. Definitely it will make the street livelier especially in the colder months. Behind it will be Armani Exchange outlet; a downgrade from what we had back then but a welcomed addition. It will only be accessible from the inside.

5. Most of the stores that are "new" to Philly but / and are popular in the suburban areas are not accessible from the street level and located on the third level. Aerie, Hollister, AE and soon F21. Despite what people said about how suburbanites would not go to Center City just to shop for the same stores they could find in their neighborhoods, they were proven wrong. I noticed that most of the gals who came out from Aerie with shopping bags look like they came from the suburbs. I was being a creepy and asked indirectly where they are from. Two girls in their 20s come from Collingswood, NJ. And a mom with two daughters come from Bryn Mawr.

6. AMC is not open yet but F21 is strategically located just beside it. My fear is that it will attract the wrong crowd to the theater, i.e., loud teenagers, as I have noticed in lots of movie theaters adjacent to the chain across the country. This could be a major turn off for locals and others.

7. Candytopia attracts lots of people despite its "poor" design. By "poor", I mean the walls facing passerby are just walls. There are no windows or anything that allow them to interact or lure them to go inside. Good thing the venue will be there until January 2020. Rumor said that there will be a second Apple store there. Based on the posters attached on the wall to that area, it seems to be true; the walls are plastered with pictures of iPhones with whimsical messages.

8. Never been to City Winery. But it seems it has not opened yet. Instead it opens a pop-up wine bar, which I hope will stay there. It is kinda cool IMHO. Lots of suburban older people chilling there I thought. So I did my investigation and ordered a glass of wine. I talked to two gentlemen on my right and on my left. One in fact is from Jenkintown, and the other is from Olde City.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-22-2019, 08:45 AM
 
Location: NYC based - Used to Live in Philly - Transplant from Miami
2,307 posts, read 2,744,835 times
Reputation: 2610
9. Back to H&M: the clothes are arranged by colors. It looks more aesthetic and chic. It is a similar concept that H&M applied with their new store in SoHo. But the setting and decorations is similar to flagship H&M at Herald Square or Times Square to attract more tourists.

10. The Philly-based stores are located in one spot and it looks like an after-thought. It is very disappointing. Not too many crowds in that area. The setting reminds me of the old Gallery.

11. There will be Haagen-Dasz and Planet Smoothie island counters. :0

12. The food court (Market Eats?) surely looks like an airport food court. But it is successful to draw attention from passerby from Jefferson station. Chic-Fil-A line was super long. HA!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-22-2019, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Germantown, Philadelphia
13,880 posts, read 8,706,025 times
Reputation: 10198
Quote:
Originally Posted by asiandudeyo View Post
I went down to Philadelphia and was proud of what the Gallery has become.
Before continue reading what I write, I want to apologize for my English. Since English is not my first, second or even third language, there will be mistakes. And since it will be a wrong writing, I will only slightly proofread it. :P :P :P

Several personal observations:

1. There were lots of people, and they came from various demographics; locals, tourists and suburbanites. No homeless was spotted in the food court. I hope this trend continues.

2. Cool and interactive arts; some similar to what we have in Hudson Yards.

3. Despite most of the corners spots have not been filled, H&M is definitely a major success. Three story high and shiny. Definitely sucked in suburbanites and tourists from the street.

4. Just beside H&M, there will be a Starbucks. It will be accessible only from the street level. Definitely it will make the street livelier especially in the colder months. Behind it will be Armani Exchange outlet; a downgrade from what we had back then but a welcomed addition. It will only be accessible from the inside.

5. Most of the stores that are "new" to Philly but / and are popular in the suburban areas are not accessible from the street level and located on the third level. Aerie, Hollister, AE and soon F21. Despite what people said about how suburbanites would not go to Center City just to shop for the same stores they could find in their neighborhoods, they were proven wrong. I noticed that most of the gals who came out from Aerie with shopping bags look like they came from the suburbs. I was being a creepy and asked indirectly where they are from. Two girls in their 20s come from Collingswood, NJ. And a mom with two daughters come from Bryn Mawr.

6. AMC is not open yet but F21 is strategically located just beside it. My fear is that it will attract the wrong crowd to the theater, i.e., loud teenagers, as I have noticed in lots of movie theaters adjacent to the chain across the country. This could be a major turn off for locals and others.

7. Candytopia attracts lots of people despite its "poor" design. By "poor", I mean the walls facing passerby are just walls. There are no windows or anything that allow them to interact or lure them to go inside. Good thing the venue will be there until January 2020. Rumor said that there will be a second Apple store there. Based on the posters attached on the wall to that area, it seems to be true; the walls are plastered with pictures of iPhones with whimsical messages.

8. Never been to City Winery. But it seems it has not opened yet. Instead it opens a pop-up wine bar, which I hope will stay there. It is kinda cool IMHO. Lots of suburban older people chilling there I thought. So I did my investigation and ordered a glass of wine. I talked to two gentlemen on my right and on my left. One in fact is from Jenkintown, and the other is from Olde City.
1. I noticed a decent mix of ethnicities, ages, races and backgrounds among the concourse-level shoppers Saturday morning, when I used the concourse level to get from 8th and Market subway station to Jefferson Station to catch a train to Exton.

But to put that "iconic ghetto" stuff into perspective: I was on the media tour Monday, and as it ended, we got to talking about some of the goals PREIT had (stated and unstated). Another reporter I know, a WURD radio host, said to me about the "de-ghettoing", "It's not going to work. I teach these kids, and they already go to King of Prussia to spend $400 on Louis Vuitton handbags."

Let that soak in for a minute. My reply was, "Do they tear up the King of Prussia mall?" Her reply: "No." Mine: "Then what we have is really a behavior problem, and what we need to do is encourage them to bring their King of Prussia behavior here."

But did they really "tear up" the Gallery? As Inga Saffron writes in her review of the FDP mall today (mine will appear tomorrow), the old Gallery was the sort of retail gathering place completely missing from North Philly, and thus the folks there came here because it was easy to get to. It still is. The new design removes a semi-secluded space where the old folks could hang out all day, and I'm sure that was by design too. And what that woman told me about KofP tells me that some of that "iconic ghetto" stuff is the standard-issue Fear-of-a-Black-Planet reaction many middle- and upper-middle-class whites have to large concentrations of black folk doing what they do anywhere, and it's a shame we can't help them Get Over It. But I will concede it's not exclusively a white thing - there is a certain class element to this that crosses racial lines; it keeps certain blacks, but not me, off the buses as well. (Fortunately, it didn't keep the Indian-American VP of Government Relations for the Greater Philadelphia Association of Realtors off the Route 18 bus either when he lived in "Cedarbrook"; I wouldn't have my relationship with GPAR had I not struck up a conversation with him one morning as we both got off the same bus and headed for the subway at Olney. I noticed we were both wearing PHL pins and used that as the entrance.)

5. I haven't made it up to the third level yet; maybe I'll get up there when I hit Center City sometime this afternoon. I know that attracting people to level 3, period, was a major goal for PREIT, and I suspect that's why the theaters and bowling alley are going up on that level. There's a Filbert Street entrance done up with the same corrugated-metal pattern found on the 11th and Market Street facades at that point; there's a sign assembly over it - I'll bet this is the entrance PREIT intends theater patrons to use.

7. I only saw the iPhones on the concourse level. I suspect the second-Apple-store rumor is just that, though the one on Walnut Street is mobbed much of the time.

8. The mall-facing bar at City Winery is a permanent feature - it's a sort of mini-version of the 2 Street Café bar that sat at the entrance to the old food court at just about that spot on the concourse level. And if you went down to the pillar between the wine barrels just to the west of the bar, you would have seen that City Winery is indeed open; they already have a full calendar of live music programmed for the end of this month and the next month or two. It will remain to be seen whether this bar/restaurant/concert venue achieves the goal PREIT has of activating Filbert Street (its main entrance is outside, at the SEC of 10th and Filbert, and it will have outdoor seating along Filbert). "Old City" - no faux-Olde English "e" on the end, btw.

10. The four "Uniquely Philly" shops on the concourse level are a nice gesture, but they are located in a spot where I think many patrons will simply pass them by. I hope I'm wrong about that.

11. I also like the mini-murals Conrad Benner of StreetsDept curated for temporary display on the concourse level; I Tweeted to him that he should persuade PREIT to make these a permanent rotating feature in the mall. Of those on display now, the one that is simply a big backlit sign reading "You Deserve It" is IMO the most subversive, given the context in which it hangs, but they're all thought-provoking.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-22-2019, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Buffalo NY
3 posts, read 1,525 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamms View Post
Trader Joe's and Whole Foods are ''different'' types of grocery stores; Giant is a traditional grocery store so it should work out in this location. I, for one, do not patronize TJ or WF but would go to this Giant

Remember, the Market-Schuykill Yards-Riverwalk areas are the focus for commercial and residential growth in Philly. So, given the short-to-long term plans for the west CC-UC areas, this does make sense. Plans for new commercial buildings are in the works for 20/Arch and 2100/2200 Market (I think it's 2100 Market, the block on ths south side of Market where a 7-11 and Liberty Bar are located). I expect a new MSL subway station to come into this section of Market Street as well to serve the commercial and residential growth...we'll see.

Giant wouldn't build its flagship store in River Walk without knowing what's going on there.
Is it actually possible to add a MFL stop at a reasonable cost? 22nd seems like the best choice, since there's nothing from City Hall to 30th. But the way the station is set up is that the MFL runs in the middle and then on either side of it are Trolley Lines, so not sure how there could be a platform built for the MFL if it runs in the middle? Because now the only way is to take the MFL to City hall and then transfer (it's free) to a trolley to get to anything in CC-west, or if you're coming from market street in West Philly, need to transfer at 30th street to a Trolley.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-22-2019, 11:05 PM
 
Location: Germantown, Philadelphia
13,880 posts, read 8,706,025 times
Reputation: 10198
A little more on the Fashion District:

I note that several of the stores are either new to the city (Columbia Sportswear, Levi's) or new to the region (Nike, City Winery).

And there are some outlets mixed in with the non-outlet stores, probably remnants of the early stage of this project, when PREIT sought to turn this into an outlet mall.

(I would have loved to see a Brooks Brothers outlet here. If it fits at Philadelphia Mills, it would fit here - and I don't think it would cannibalize the Walnut Street regular store, either.)

They also came up with some creative solutions to the problem of the orphaned top level.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2019, 09:27 AM
 
Location: New York City
9,315 posts, read 9,141,671 times
Reputation: 6367
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl View Post
A little more on the Fashion District:

I note that several of the stores are either new to the city (Columbia Sportswear, Levi's) or new to the region (Nike, City Winery).

And there are some outlets mixed in with the non-outlet stores, probably remnants of the early stage of this project, when PREIT sought to turn this into an outlet mall.

(I would have loved to see a Brooks Brothers outlet here. If it fits at Philadelphia Mills, it would fit here - and I don't think it would cannibalize the Walnut Street regular store, either.)

They also came up with some creative solutions to the problem of the orphaned top level.
I hope a few more mid / higher end stores fill in the mix. I'm not asking for a King of Prussia lineup, but some other good options would be...

Polo Ralph Lauren (were formally announced, not sure what happened)
Calvin Klein Outlet
Michael Kors Outlet
Coach Outlet
Clarks
Tory Burch Outlet
Fossil Outlet
Kate Spade Outlet
Nautica Outlet
Perry Ellis Outlet
Restoration Hardware Outlet
Tommy Hilfiger
White House Black Market


I saw Sephora signed on which is a solid tenant, I just hope the retail selection goes more in the direction of the above choices and less in the direction of Spensors Gifts and T-Mobile.

I also hope something is done with the horrible facade, everything above level 2 is untouched (exterior).

And that huge parking garages at 11th and Chestnut creates a huge opportunity for some larger footprint retailers (Container Stores, Homes Goods, etc.)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2019, 01:34 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
2,539 posts, read 2,254,111 times
Reputation: 2690
Walnut St Update:

I noticed today that there is a lease available sign on the current Timberland store. The store is not currently closed, but it would appear that they will not be staying open given the sign displayed.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2019, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
2,539 posts, read 2,254,111 times
Reputation: 2690
FDP:

I took a visit on Friday, and they definitely did a great job with the interior. Its focus on instagram worthy art and interactive exhibits definitely is a draw for the millenial social media crazed crowd. The lighting is bright and very sleek and modern, which is attractive.

I cannot say the same for the exterior, although it is positive to have more storefronts open out to Market St., it is embarrassing to see the original ugly facade on the upper floors of the exterior.

On ground level though, its current iteration is definitely an improvement, which is positive.

Potentially PREIT is saving the upper floor renovation of the facade for the later phase of this project, which would be the residential towers (if they proceed), so it is cohesive with its design. My guess is once the full roster of tenants open and the project is fully complete, PREIT will start taking steps towards financing the residential phase of the project.

The current roster of tenants is average at best, but it is promising to see a Sephora, DSW, and Eddie Bauer coming to the mall. If sales per sq. ft are strong, I could see PREIT convincing more mid/mid-upper retail to enter into the space.


Apple
Zara
Top Shop
Coach
Amazon Book Store
etc.

The DSW and Sephora are definitely good starting points. Both typically have a higher frequency of visits based on the product and offerings/popularity.

I do think PREIT missed an opportunity, to convert more of the floor space for bigger box retail which is void in Center City.
Bed Bath & Beyond
Fuller-size Target
Best Buy
WorldMarket


I also agree that the Philadelphia retail portion is poorly executed and does seem to be an afterthought. I only see a handful of those tenants being successful.

Last edited by rowhomecity; 09-23-2019 at 03:46 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2019, 05:21 PM
 
8,947 posts, read 20,971,175 times
Reputation: 3723
Quote:
Originally Posted by Broadcastthatboom View Post
Is it actually possible to add a MFL stop at a reasonable cost? 22nd seems like the best choice, since there's nothing from City Hall to 30th. But the way the station is set up is that the MFL runs in the middle and then on either side of it are Trolley Lines, so not sure how there could be a platform built for the MFL if it runs in the middle? Because now the only way is to take the MFL to City hall and then transfer (it's free) to a trolley to get to anything in CC-west, or if you're coming from market street in West Philly, need to transfer at 30th street to a Trolley.
I personally like that people have an option to switch between the trolleys and the El at 30th, 15th or 13th Street. To me, the El space between 30th and 15th acts as a mini-express train; that's pretty valuable at rush hour.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-23-2019, 11:57 PM
 
Location: Germantown, Philadelphia
13,880 posts, read 8,706,025 times
Reputation: 10198
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp View Post
I hope a few more mid / higher end stores fill in the mix. I'm not asking for a King of Prussia lineup, but some other good options would be...

Polo Ralph Lauren (were formally announced, not sure what happened)
Calvin Klein Outlet
Michael Kors Outlet
Coach Outlet
Clarks
Tory Burch Outlet
Fossil Outlet
Kate Spade Outlet
Nautica Outlet
Perry Ellis Outlet
Restoration Hardware Outlet
Tommy Hilfiger
White House Black Market


I saw Sephora signed on which is a solid tenant, I just hope the retail selection goes more in the direction of the above choices and less in the direction of Spensors Gifts and T-Mobile.

I also hope something is done with the horrible facade, everything above level 2 is untouched (exterior).

And that huge parking garages at 11th and Chestnut creates a huge opportunity for some larger footprint retailers (Container Stores, Homes Goods, etc.)
That's part of National Real Estate Development's East Market project.

Two mixed-use buildings will replace that garage, with a mid-block passage between them. One of the two will contain offices, I believe. I'm not sure that the retail portion will have footprints large enough for big-box, which would have to be multi-floor anyway. Given that NRED intends the mid-block passage to be lined with smaller shops and things like restaurants with outdoor seating (like the Iron Hill Brewery already there), I wouldn't hold my breath for those.

HomeGoods "big-box," though? That's a TJX nameplate. There's already a TJ Maxx in the development. That could probably fit there.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Pennsylvania > Philadelphia

All times are GMT -6.

¬© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top