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Old 08-21-2013, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
8,520 posts, read 10,848,867 times
Reputation: 5441

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Bowa View Post
Sorry to disillusion you, but a lot of white people move to Philly.
And some of them even stay when they have kids ... they can't all afford to move (or even want to) to the suburbs.
I don't buy into that whole delusion about not being able to raise a family in an urban environment. What to they have to say about the millions of families that live in New York City and Chicago. Just because the suburban environment works for some families doesn't mean it works for all families.
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Old 08-21-2013, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
1,166 posts, read 1,297,252 times
Reputation: 442
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Bowa View Post
Don't buy into that "We need $50,000,000 or we can't teach/learn!" crap.
Don't really need 50,000,000 dollars to teach Calculus, logic, etc. Just a piece of chalk, a blackboard, some paper and a pencil! I'm not sure why logic isn't required in our schools...

Things change though when you get into literature, business computing and programming, etc. Those cost money... but perhaps for English we should wean off the class being entirely literature in most schools to actually focusing on the student's ability to write. I know a lot of people who graduate with a B.A. and still can't use proper "their, they're, there" etc., let alone punctuate near proper or have sentences that agree in quantity, etc. A bit sad... money is important, but culture is more important. Right now in America, we hardly have a culture that values learning.
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista
2,472 posts, read 3,486,213 times
Reputation: 2202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cnote11 View Post
Don't really need 50,000,000 dollars to teach Calculus, logic, etc. Just a piece of chalk, a blackboard, some paper and a pencil! I'm not sure why logic isn't required in our schools...

Things change though when you get into literature, business computing and programming, etc. Those cost money... but perhaps for English we should wean off the class being entirely literature in most schools to actually focusing on the student's ability to write. I know a lot of people who graduate with a B.A. and still can't use proper "their, they're, there" etc., let alone punctuate near proper or have sentences that agree in quantity, etc. A bit sad... money is important, but culture is more important. Right now in America, we hardly have a culture that values learning.
You're missing the most important and expensive supplies, the teachers themselves. Study after study proves that a good teacher can make all the difference in the world. American teachers in comparison to other developed nations pay their teachers far less while at the same time American teachers pay far more to receive the college education they need to teach. The end result is rarely do our best and brightest end up teaching.

Morons continue to say things like "Stop throwing money at education, it doesn't work" even though study after study proves that throwing money at education is actually great public policy. Not only does it increase the quality of education but it also directly correlates to decreases in crime, poverty rates, unemployment, and increases in housing values and community investment.

Spending money on education is one of the very best ways to spend public money and yet we as a country continue to prioritize funding prisons and our massive military industrial complex instead.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:07 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
1,041 posts, read 1,281,018 times
Reputation: 471
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillies2011 View Post
You're missing the most important and expensive supplies, the teachers themselves. Study after study proves that a good teacher can make all the difference in the world. American teachers in comparison to other developed nations pay their teachers far less while at the same time American teachers pay far more to receive the college education they need to teach. The end result is rarely do our best and brightest end up teaching.

Morons continue to say things like "Stop throwing money at education, it doesn't work" even though study after study proves that throwing money at education is actually great public policy. Not only does it increase the quality of education but it also directly correlates to decreases in crime, poverty rates, unemployment, and increases in housing values and community investment.

Spending money on education is one of the very best ways to spend public money and yet we as a country continue to prioritize funding prisons and our massive military industrial complex instead.
So you're saying the ignorant teachers are to blame ...? Give me a figure on how much money is enough.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:14 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
1,041 posts, read 1,281,018 times
Reputation: 471
More Money =/= Better Education | The Snark Who Hunts Back
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:39 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
1,166 posts, read 1,297,252 times
Reputation: 442
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillies2011 View Post
You're missing the most important and expensive supplies, the teachers themselves. Study after study proves that a good teacher can make all the difference in the world. American teachers in comparison to other developed nations pay their teachers far less while at the same time American teachers pay far more to receive the college education they need to teach. The end result is rarely do our best and brightest end up teaching.

Morons continue to say things like "Stop throwing money at education, it doesn't work" even though study after study proves that throwing money at education is actually great public policy. Not only does it increase the quality of education but it also directly correlates to decreases in crime, poverty rates, unemployment, and increases in housing values and community investment.

Spending money on education is one of the very best ways to spend public money and yet we as a country continue to prioritize funding prisons and our massive military industrial complex instead.
The teachers are a given and aren't quite up for bargaining in my estimates. I'm merely referring to extra supplies. You don't have a class without a teacher, obviously, and we should aim for competent at worst. It isn't quite shocking that our best and brightest don't have anything to do with teaching, and I don't think it is just about the pay...
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Old 08-22-2013, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
2,377 posts, read 2,695,391 times
Reputation: 1492
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cnote11 View Post
The teachers are a given and aren't quite up for bargaining in my estimates. I'm merely referring to extra supplies. You don't have a class without a teacher, obviously, and we should aim for competent at worst. It isn't quite shocking that our best and brightest don't have anything to do with teaching, and I don't think it is just about the pay...
imo the best and brightest wouldn't want to teach at the grade school level because they wouldn't be able to do advanced things. I think kids under the right environment can learn things way above what grade school's will allow. If the grade schools were better at providing more fast paced and specialized classes for students who wanted them then I'm sure the best and brightest would be there to teach them.

Grade school is all about providing a day care that gives children common knowledge to help them relate better to each other to have a unified people / nation.
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:30 PM
 
12,767 posts, read 28,906,844 times
Reputation: 7341
If you want a conversation about what makes a good school, I invite you to come over to the education forum - //www.city-data.com/forum/education/ We've had many discussions there about teacher salaries, teaching to the test, the quality of teachers, etc.

Let's try to keep this thread about Philadelphia schools.
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Old 08-26-2013, 02:20 PM
 
Location: back in Philadelphia!
3,260 posts, read 4,877,400 times
Reputation: 2051
An open letter to Gov. Corbett in today's paper:
Open letter to Corbett

IMO he most important point in the letter is in regard to fairness in PA state funding to schools:

"Nearly 40 percent of Pennsylvania's 500 school districts receive more state aid per student than does Philadelphia, according to the Pennsylvania Education Department. We rank as the 67th poorest of the state's 500 school districts. The Pittsburgh School District, ranked the 261st poorest, received $2,126 dollars more for every one of its students from the state in 2011-12 than Philadelphia did. If treated equitability, our schools would be receiving $429 million more from the commonwealth. Additionally, we spent 7 percent less per student than the state average in 2011-12. In the three years before your cuts, the school district ran annual surpluses of about $30 million. We weren't spending beyond our means then and we're not doing so today."

So if I'm getting this straight, if Philly schools got their fair share of state funding, they would have a large budget surplus, not an (artificial) $320mil shortfall. There wouldn't have had to be a "doomsday". The City of Philadelphia wouldn't be scrambling to pony up hundreds of millions of dollars it doesn't have. And our teachers wouldn't be getting coerced into taking salary cuts.
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Old 09-04-2013, 12:39 PM
 
Location: back in Philadelphia!
3,260 posts, read 4,877,400 times
Reputation: 2051
Excerpt from an article posted this Monday on the subject:

"The School District of Philadelphia, the eighth largest school district in the United States, nestled in the country’s fifth largest city, will make history when it permanently closes it doors within the next two years.
While Philadelphia is one of the largest school districts in the country, it is also one of the most bankrupt. The district will start the 2013-2014 school on September 9 but stares at a $304 million deficit. If it weren’t for the city borrowing $50 million on behalf of the school district, none of the 218 public schools would be opening next week. The slight infusion of money allows Superintendent William Hite to open schools on time but it’s far from meeting the needs of the district that had to lay off 20 percent of its total staff over the summer. It was the second consecutive year of thinning out staff that saw 3,800 teacher and staff positions eliminated, 100 school nurses, 90 school resource officers, and 43 bilingual counselors.

Although the school district continues to have financial and academic trouble year after year, the finger pointing halts at the State of Pennsylvania. After taking control of the district in 2001, the state has not fixed any of the problems in Philadelphia; allowing the current situation to spread like a virus. Jerusah O. Conner is an education professor at Villanova University and is an expert on the Philadelphia school district. In a recent interview, Professor Conner said that the state shoulders much of the blame for the district’s problems. “Pennsylvania ranks 8th lowest in the country, spending only 35.8 percent on education. Were it not for the deliberate underinvestment and disinvestment in Philadelphia schools by the state, the district could easily be enjoying a multibillion dollar surplus instead of a deficit.”


Read more: Why Philadelphia schools will close their doors forever
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