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Old 08-28-2013, 04:54 AM
 
Location: South Jersey
7,780 posts, read 18,926,204 times
Reputation: 2329

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I've been saying this for a while. Philly is much worse then over here in NJ. Even tho its no picnic driving anywhere in our area..

Study: Philly area drivers are sixth worst in country - phillyburbs.com: National
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Old 08-28-2013, 06:00 AM
 
Location: Phila Pa & NYC
2,856 posts, read 2,067,739 times
Reputation: 1097
I have to agree with Frank on this. In Philly I see a lot of rude and aggressive drivers, and a lot of un-insured drivers. Over the years I have been burnt several times getting hit by an un-insured driver.
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Old 08-28-2013, 02:35 PM
 
1,953 posts, read 3,358,582 times
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Philly driving is a walk in the park compared to the DC area, and Maryland in general, as seen by the #1 DC/#2 Baltimore ranking. I want to kill myself driving down there, everyone is slow and in general awful. I've never had any problems up here besides trying to get around awful suburban drivers in the city (whether they are from NJ or PA is irrelevant, you can always tell they are from the burbs though).

Also, what exactly is Allstate including as part of the "Philadelphia area?" Seems like just the city and its PA burbs.
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Old 08-28-2013, 05:41 PM
 
Location: South Jersey
7,780 posts, read 18,926,204 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soug View Post
P

Also, what exactly is Allstate including as part of the "Philadelphia area?" Seems like just the city and its PA burbs.
According to the article, that is correct.
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Old 08-28-2013, 06:17 PM
 
2,394 posts, read 3,052,820 times
Reputation: 1976
meh. a "claim" could be someone sideswiping you on a narrow street or some other low speed fender-bender. Traffic in Philly is generally slow moving and the only really dangerous roads are Roosevelt Blvd and the like where you have a lot of traffic, a lot of pedestrians and high speeds.

As far as DC and Baltimore topping the list it's not really surprising. That area is full of transients from all over the country and the world - people with different driving habits and styles. I lived in a couple of different military towns and accidents were always worse than any other county around.
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Old 08-28-2013, 09:15 PM
 
508 posts, read 487,270 times
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A fact that seems to have evaded both the OP and the author of that article is that commuters from New Jersey comprise a substantial subset of "Philly Area Drivers". The author erroneously concludes that just because there are more traffic collisions on the Philadelphia side, that means Pennsyvania drivers are worse than New Jersey drivers? They don't even take account which subsets of Philly area drivers are most involved in these collisions. Are most of the collisions between two PA drivers or between a PA and a NJ driver, or even better two NJ drivers in PA? They don't tell us. How many traffic accidents involve out-of-towners or people who don't usually commute in the city? They don't tell us. All they say is Philadelphia drivers are worse because more accidents take place in Philadelphia.

They don't take into account
1) There is a much higher volume of traffic in Philadelphia than in any of the New Jersey Suburbs
2) More congested roads in Philadelphia vs. more free-flowing roads in NJ
3) More people commute to Philadelphia or the PA suburbs from NJ than the other way around
4) More densely populated in Philadelphia than in Jersey
5) More treacherous roads in Philadelphia, i.e. Roosevelt Boulevard, Lincoln Drive, the Schuylkill Expressway, etc.
6) More commercial traffic
7) More out-of-town drivers

From what I've seen in my daily travels it would seem New Jersey drivers are in fact more poorly-behaved than their PA counterparts. This is obviously anecdotal, but it's what I've observed driving around the area. I see many more New Jersey drivers speeding, tailgating, weaving in and out of traffic, violating other drivers' right of way, and just generally more erratic driving, many times with a mobile phone glued to their ear or worse in their lap. While PA drivers are certainly guilty of all these behaviors, it seems at least with New Jersey drivers driving in PA, active aggression is the rule, not the exception. PA drivers on the other hand tend to be more passive aggressive i.e. driving slower than everyone else, hogging the passing lane, turning out of driveways and sidestreets without clearance then driving 10 miles an hour in front of you, etc.

Now is it possible that New Jersey drivers who don't regularly commute to PA are generally better behaved than those who commute to Phila? Maybe, I don't know. I don't drive in New Jersey very often, but as someone who regularly drives around the city and the PA suburbs, I can say I see much worse behavior from those with New Jersey plates.
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Old 08-28-2013, 09:57 PM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
8,520 posts, read 10,851,006 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankgn87 View Post
I've been saying this for a while. Philly is much worse then over here in NJ. Even tho its no picnic driving anywhere in our area..

Study: Philly area drivers are sixth worst in country - phillyburbs.com: National
I don't think it's really fair to compare one city to an entire state. I will say that New Jersey drivers are far worse than Pennsylvania drivers. Speaking from experience having lived in both states.
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Old 08-28-2013, 10:11 PM
 
2,394 posts, read 3,052,820 times
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You don't see "worse behavior" from Jersey drivers. You're just more likely to associate bad driving with being from NJ because you see the plates. If someone from PA cuts you off you don't take notice of which county they might be from.

Crashes per county
Camden = 2.835 (crashes per 100 people)
Burlington=2.835
Gloucester=2.637
Montgomery=1.049
Bucks = .943
Delaware = .818
Chester = .864
Philadelphia = .745

The NJ data is from 2011 and the PA data is from 2012.
Fatal crashes per capita:

Gloucester 26
Delaware 28
Chester 31
MontCo 44
Camden 49
Burlington 52
Bucks 65
Philadelphia 107

I didn't do the numbers per capita because they're too small and my calculator isn't that big but DelCo would have the lowest rate of fatal crashes followed by Philly. Bucks and Burlington would have the highest rates.

The correlation to me seems to be speed - for fatalities - Camden County might have a lot of accidents because of roads like Route 130, 70, 38, 295, the Turnpike, 42, etc. Bucks might have a lot of fatalities because of having a lot of fast moving traffic on winding roads that are the modern day equivalent of wagon trails. DelCo and Philly probably have the lowest rate of fatalities because there's not a lot of fast moving traffic. For accidents it seems to be a combination of speed and traffic volume.

Last edited by drive carephilly; 08-28-2013 at 10:34 PM..
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Old 08-28-2013, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
8,520 posts, read 10,851,006 times
Reputation: 5443
Quote:
Originally Posted by drive carephilly View Post
You don't see "worse behavior" from Jersey drivers. You're just more likely to associate bad driving with being from NJ because you see the plates. If someone from PA cuts you off you don't take notice of which county they might be from.

Crashes per county
Camden = 2.835 (crashes per 100 people)
Burlington=2.835
Gloucester=2.637
Montgomery=1.049
Bucks = .943
Delaware = .818
Chester = .864
Philadelphia = .745

The NJ data is from 2011 and the PA data is from 2012.
Fatal crashes per capita:

Gloucester 26
Delaware 28
Chester 31
MontCo 44
Camden 49
Burlington 52
Bucks 65
Philadelphia 107

I didn't do the numbers per capita because they're too small and my calculator isn't that big but DelCo would have the lowest rate of fatal crashes followed by Philly. Bucks and Burlington would have the highest rates.

The correlation to me seems to be speed - for fatalities - Camden County might have a lot of accidents because of roads like Route 130, 70, 38, 295, the Turnpike, 42, etc. Bucks might have a lot of fatalities because of having a lot of fast moving traffic on winding roads that are the modern day equivalent of wagon trails. DelCo and Philly probably have the lowest rate of fatalities because there's not a lot of fast moving traffic. For accidents it seems to be a combination of speed and traffic volume.
Those stats don't surprise me. People in New Jersey drive like maniacs.
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:32 PM
 
Location: a swanky suburb in my fancy pants
3,391 posts, read 7,739,657 times
Reputation: 1586
It has always been my theory that Philly drivers (including suburbs) are more aggressive because they are bored, have been driving the same roads since they were 16 years old, know exactly where they are going and exactly how to get there which dose not make them bad drivers , just aggressive. Well maybe that's bad.
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