Small Business Friendly in Philly and suburbia? (Philadelphia, Reading: fit in, best cities)
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I have lived in Philly for 1.5 years, a transplant from well, all over - Seattle for 17 years, lived in Raleigh, NC for less than 1 year...lived abroad for 6 years. Having said that, I keep reading that PA is one of the worst states for launching a new business, but I have "fallen" for those lists before and based a move to Raleigh on several of the "best cities..." blah blah. It was a huge mistake, and while I met a lot of wonderful people there, I never could be down with how things were there. You had to do a LOT of massaging to get your foot in the door, not that I am afraid to work, but perhaps my business idea was not right for that climate, either.
So, now, I am in Philly, and am thinking that perhaps it is best to move to the 'burbs because I hate where I live (love the apartment, hate the area AND the landlord). But now I am wondering if we should just move to another state altogether. Then again, my husband has a job, and although they treat him like crap, he tends to ignore it even if I can't - but that's everywhere.
Would anyone be willing to share their experience on launching a business, what it's been like, etc? (And if not here, then feel free to PM me.) I can't even figure out how to get a business license, assuming I even need one when providing a service, and not tangible goods. It also seems like doing business INSIDE Philly proper is different from outside (a privilege tax??), just like I am learning that living in Philly there is a city tax or something, whereas living in Montgomery Cty there isn't??
I would be much obliged if anyone has any pointers...
Although I don't have personal experience with setting up a business, I just wanted to chime in with a few thoughts.
First if all, the "best states for business" type of lists are incredibly useless and misleading. They are based on the idea that all states have the same taxation structure in place, whereas that obviously isn't true. For example, some states don't have an income tax, but they may have obscenely high property or sales taxes. Not to mention, there's no considering quality of public services (i.e., you get what you pay for).
I think, especially if you're running a small business, success simply comes down to having the right idea in the right place at the right time, and that can happen in any state. The "rankings," as it seems you're aware, are based on very marginal aspects compared to those primary factors.
That being said, as a consistently growing, stable, diverse, increasingly dynamic and relatively affluent metropolitan region, I definitely think Philly and its suburbs are a fantastic place to start a small business, as opposed to contemplating moving out of state.
It's a shame that you're not keen on staying in the city, as its absolutely undergoing a renaissance, which small businesses are fueling, and the idea that the city is harsh when it comes to starting a business I think is a bit overstated (this website, for example, makes the process fairly user friendly: https://business.phila.gov/) and there's lots of potential assistance from local non-profit organizations: (Guide to Opening Small Business in Philadelphia | The Philly Post | News | Philadelphia Magazine).
But even if you think the suburbs are a better fit, I will say that small businesses tend to cluster in fairly defined areas, particularly in/around the various business districts/commerical corridors.
Of course, what is ideal completely depends on what your business is and who you are marketing to, but some "hot spots" include towns like West Chester, Media, Phoenixville, Conshohocken, Wayne, Doylestown, etc. These are just a handful, but I'm sure if you're willing to share more information myself and others can try to give you a more tailored reply.
Although I don't have personal experience with setting up a business, I just wanted to chime in with a few thoughts.
First if all, the "best states for business" type of lists are incredibly useless and misleading. They are based on the idea that all states have the same taxation structure in place, whereas that obviously isn't true. For example, some states don't have an income tax, but they may have obscenely high property or sales taxes. Not to mention, there's no considering quality of public services (i.e., you get what you pay for).
I think, especially if you're running a small business, success simply comes down to having the right idea in the right place at the right time, and that can happen in any state. The "rankings," as it seems you're aware, are based on very marginal aspects compared to those primary factors.
That being said, as a consistently growing, stable, diverse, increasingly dynamic and relatively affluent metropolitan region, I definitely think Philly and its suburbs are a fantastic place to start a small business, as opposed to contemplating moving out of state.
It's a shame that you're not keen on staying in the city, as its absolutely undergoing a renaissance, which small businesses are fueling, and the idea that the city is harsh when it comes to starting a business I think is a bit overstated (this website, for example, makes the process fairly user friendly: https://business.phila.gov/) and there's lots of potential assistance from local non-profit organizations: (Guide to Opening Small Business in Philadelphia | The Philly Post | News | Philadelphia Magazine).
But even if you think the suburbs are a better fit, I will say that small businesses tend to cluster in fairly defined areas, particularly in/around the various business districts/commerical corridors.
Of course, what is ideal completely depends on what your business is and who you are marketing to, but some "hot spots" include towns like West Chester, Media, Phoenixville, Conshohocken, Wayne, Doylestown, etc. These are just a handful, but I'm sure if you're willing to share more information myself and others can try to give you a more tailored reply.
Good luck!
Gosh, thank YOU so much! After I posted this, I read several websites that listed some of the same states as "ideal" states which were friendly to small business (i.e., Thumbtack, Forbes, Entrepreneur, etc). That said, as I had mentioned, I had "fallen" for that before, so I don't put much faith on those lists as you said, although I understand many of their points because indeed it has been difficult to even find information as to where I even get a license. (Sorry, but I am not moving to Utah just because it appeared on a number of lists. While I loved Bear Lake, I know nothing about Utah, and it would be silly to move there based on what I read.) I do wonder if suburbia might be a better option, or simply keeping office options flexible until I figure that out.
Your reply is encouraging, and I am not sure why I was feeling so negative. Perhaps it came on the heels of a conversation yesterday morning with a business owner who is in a completely different business - he complained of competition, people who wanted refunds, etc, but competition is everywhere and one can't be afraid of that. In the end, it's like you said - differentiation is important, where, when and what you are marketing, as well as to whom. I HOPE Philly is undergoing a renaissance because when we visited in December of 2014, we were enamored with the city and its ambiance...and the people in general. Then again, that was during Christmas, and who isn't happy then?! ;-) Honestly, in Seattle, the holidays were stressful with lots of traffic, fighting over parking spaces, the best gifts, ad nauseum. I saw and felt something different here in Philly. In spite of trash I seem to have to step over every time I step outside the door, I hold out hope for Philly, that more people will begin to care about their beautiful city and renovations will begin.
As for business, obviously there are many, many businesses that thrive - all I have to do is look around. There is an odd phenomenon in this neighborhood - right across the street there is a plaza that simply cannot keep businesses open there (wrong place, wrong business?). Many storefronts have been sitting empty for the last 18 months - stores that vacated long before we arrived. It's odd. That said, I don't see a lot of health-inspired ventures around, nor does there seem to be a lot of emphasis on health and nutrition itself, although it is a health-driven industry. However, medicine is a bit different; it's not nutrition. (You know what I mean, right?) In other words, the application of medicine is not nutrition driven. I recall reading somewhere a few years ago that Seattle was one of the most active cities - and that wasn't just hype. We had several lakes, most notably Green Lake, which was a little over 3 miles to walk around and it was packed every weekend. The runners there are faithful to their fitness regimen, even running when it is 40 degrees out! I never could get there! Here, the only one I know of is Kelly Drive, and while we have been a few times, I don't know that I find it particularly enchanting, and would love to go by myself with the doggies, but I am guessing I watch the news too much. At any rate, I can't change the layout and accessibility of the city, but it would be easier to promote lifestyle change with a more walkable city. (Maybe there is one - as in one of the little surrounding towns - and I haven't discovered it yet!!! Please enlighten me!)
I am a metabolic health practitioner, so my business is health and nutrition-oriented which focuses on health promotion and behavioral change (without spilling ALL the beans!). I am very passionate about this subject, but I have learned my lesson that the right environment is critical. I obviously want to be successful, but I care MORE about people than I do making millions.
Does this give you a bit more insight as to where I am and the direction I want to go?
Again, I really do appreciate your very thoughtful response.
Not to bash Philly but I've ran in just about almost all major parks and trails in the area and they are underwhelming. Some like to point out that Fairmount is the largest park in a big city in the US, but it's still underwhelming. May be it's because they don't have a large body of water and the accompanying scenery. Even the SRT which is beside the Schuylkill is in bad shape in some of the sections. There's however a lot of amenities for outdoor lifestyle although I don't think it attracts a lot of tourists because like I said, it's underwhelming. My favorite running trail in terms of condition and absence of crowds is the Chester Valley trail on the east of Malvern. The western side get's really congested with joggers, dog walkers, cyclists, etc.
And it's not just Philly, I could say the same about most major cities in the US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by italian_fire
I recall reading somewhere a few years ago that Seattle was one of the most active cities - and that wasn't just hype. We had several lakes, most notably Green Lake, which was a little over 3 miles to walk around and it was packed every weekend. The runners there are faithful to their fitness regimen, even running when it is 40 degrees out! I never could get there! Here, the only one I know of is Kelly Drive, and while we have been a few times, I don't know that I find it particularly enchanting, and would love to go by myself with the doggies, but I am guessing I watch the news too much. At any rate, I can't change the layout and accessibility of the city, but it would be easier to promote lifestyle change with a more walkable city. (Maybe there is one - as in one of the little surrounding towns - and I haven't discovered it yet!!! Please enlighten me!)
Not to bash Philly but I've ran in just about almost all major parks and trails in the area and they are underwhelming. Some like to point out that Fairmount is the largest park in a big city in the US, but it's still underwhelming. May be it's because they don't have a large body of water and the accompanying scenery. Even the SRT which is beside the Schuylkill is in bad shape in some of the sections. There's however a lot of amenities for outdoor lifestyle although I don't think it attracts a lot of tourists because like I said, it's underwhelming. My favorite running trail in terms of condition and absence of crowds is the Chester Valley trail on the east of Malvern. The western side get's really congested with joggers, dog walkers, cyclists, etc.
And it's not just Philly, I could say the same about most major cities in the US.
I certainly know what you mean. I didn't want to sound like I was bashing Philly, either, but I guess I was just spoiled by Seattle for 17 years, not that it was a "perfect" city by any means. I never could deal with the clouds, and that's one thing about Philly - you guys have a nice mix of weather and when other places have fires and flooding, Philly has been relatively spared from all of the unfortunate circumstances others face. There is a space along Lincoln Drive that has a place to walk and "hike", but if you live in that area, you definitely have to cross that busy street. While it is certainly not the most beautiful place I have ever laid my eyes on, it is refreshing in a way to walk the trails, hear the trickle of water somewhere and set out to find it. My only concern is that I have small dogs, and while I don't tend to scare easily by snarling dogs who cross my path, my Havanese is terrified, which pretty much keeps us off the trails in the back woods!
That said, we might have to check on the Chester Valley Trail!
I will agree that Philly is not exactly known for access to pristine hiking trails all over the city--as an old, dense, post-industrial East Coast city, integration with nature in the vain of say, Seattle, just isn't its forte (although I think that will definitely change for the better over time).
That being said, I'd absolutely put Fairmount Park (and especially the Wissahickon) up against any urban park in the US. It may not necessarily put on its best face everywhere in terms of maintenance and accessibility, but I think a slow but sure transformation is occurring generally in Philly in terms of park revitalization an expansion. Ambitious plans, such as a "High Line" type trail on the Reading Viaduct and construction of new trails along Delaware River are prime examples. I can certainly understand criticisms, but the potential for renewal and planning efforts in place are absolutely a plus for Philly.
As for the OP, I think you're definitely onto a burgeoning trend in Philly. And walkability is certainly a very notable strength of Philly, as it ranks 4th among large US cities (https://www.redfin.com/blog/2015/04/...s-of-2015.html).
As a much more health-conscious generation takes root in the city/suburbs (largely driven by increasing educational attainment; there's a very strong link between healthy behaviors and education levels), I think your venture at a basic level, without hearing specifics, would fit in perfectly for the market.
Of course, you'd likely want to locate in an area with a growing number of folks with some disposable income and health-consciousness. I think any of the neighborhoods ringing Center City (i.e., Fishtown/Northern Liberties, Bella Vista, Fairmount/Brewerytown) would be very ideal.
Outer neighborhoods like Manayunk and Roxborough, Conshohocken and Ardmore would also be top contenders for attracting that young, fit, educated and more affluent demographic.
I hope I'm not coming off as an infomercial, but there truly is some great opportunity with the industry you're in if you look in the right place (and get in touch with people who can help, like local Chambers of Commerce, business associations, or political offices).
Philly is definitely the kind of place where its large enough to find a large array of opporunities but small/approachable enough that you're part of a true community. I hope you find what you're looking for!
I will agree that Philly is not exactly known for access to pristine hiking trails all over the city--as an old, dense, post-industrial East Coast city, integration with nature in the vain of say, Seattle, just isn't its forte (although I think that will definitely change for the better over time).
That being said, I'd absolutely put Fairmount Park (and especially the Wissahickon) up against any urban park in the US. It may not necessarily put on its best face everywhere in terms of maintenance and accessibility, but I think a slow but sure transformation is occurring generally in Philly in terms of park revitalization an expansion. Ambitious plans, such as a "High Line" type trail on the Reading Viaduct and construction of new trails along Delaware River are prime examples. I can certainly understand criticisms, but the potential for renewal and planning efforts in place are absolutely a plus for Philly.
As for the OP, I think you're definitely onto a burgeoning trend in Philly. And walkability is certainly a very notable strength of Philly, as it ranks 4th among large US cities (https://www.redfin.com/blog/2015/04/...s-of-2015.html).
As a much more health-conscious generation takes root in the city/suburbs (largely driven by increasing educational attainment; there's a very strong link between healthy behaviors and education levels), I think your venture at a basic level, without hearing specifics, would fit in perfectly for the market.
Of course, you'd likely want to locate in an area with a growing number of folks with some disposable income and health-consciousness. I think any of the neighborhoods ringing Center City (i.e., Fishtown/Northern Liberties, Bella Vista, Fairmount/Brewerytown) would be very ideal.
Outer neighborhoods like Manayunk and Roxborough, Conshohocken and Ardmore would also be top contenders for attracting that young, fit, educated and more affluent demographic.
I hope I'm not coming off as an infomercial, but there truly is some great opportunity with the industry you're in if you look in the right place (and get in touch with people who can help, like local Chambers of Commerce, business associations, or political offices).
Philly is definitely the kind of place where its large enough to find a large array of opporunities but small/approachable enough that you're part of a true community. I hope you find what you're looking for!
Thank you so much!
I completely agree with what you are saying about the level of education and health-consciousness, and this statement coincides with general statistics as well. Now I am just wondering if it would be easier to get my foot in the door in the suburbs where people may be more approachable, or in Philly.
Any thoughts since you know the area, and have likely lived here much longer than I?
Not to bash Philly but I've ran in just about almost all major parks and trails in the area and they are underwhelming. Some like to point out that Fairmount is the largest park in a big city in the US, but it's still underwhelming. May be it's because they don't have a large body of water and the accompanying scenery. Even the SRT which is beside the Schuylkill is in bad shape in some of the sections. There's however a lot of amenities for outdoor lifestyle although I don't think it attracts a lot of tourists because like I said, it's underwhelming. My favorite running trail in terms of condition and absence of crowds is the Chester Valley trail on the east of Malvern. The western side get's really congested with joggers, dog walkers, cyclists, etc.
And it's not just Philly, I could say the same about most major cities in the US.
Do you know that Fairmount Park was never meant to be like Central Park, for instance? It's original purpose was to improve/preserve the city's water supply coming from the Schuykill culminating in the Water Works pumping complex that sits on the western foot of the PMA. The pumping station was a marvel of engineering in its day with people coming from all over to see it.
I completely agree with what you are saying about the level of education and health-consciousness, and this statement coincides with general statistics as well. Now I am just wondering if it would be easier to get my foot in the door in the suburbs where people may be more approachable, or in Philly.
Any thoughts since you know the area, and have likely lived here much longer than I?
You're welcome!
I think it all comes down to your personal preference quite honestly, because the neighborhoods/towns I mentioned above span the city and suburbs, meaning that I think you'd find success in either.
That being said, as much as I try to advocate for the betterment of the city, if you're more accustomed to a less intensely-urban/more nature-oriented/Seattle-type of environment over a very densely-built, Philadelphia rowhome environment, I think the suburbs would be more aligned with your comfort zone (or at the very least, somewhere in Northwest Philadelphia).
The main point is, though, as overwhelming as I can imagine starting a business would be, you're not at a loss for options. And don't fear networking with local small business owners at events or even introducing yourself in person to obtain their advice/perspectives--I'm sure they can provide invaluable pointers.
I think it all comes down to your personal preference quite honestly, because the neighborhoods/towns I mentioned above span the city and suburbs, meaning that I think you'd find success in either.
That being said, as much as I try to advocate for the betterment of the city, if you're more accustomed to a less intensely-urban/more nature-oriented/Seattle-type of environment over a very densely-built, Philadelphia rowhome environment, I think the suburbs would be more aligned with your comfort zone (or at the very least, somewhere in Northwest Philadelphia).
The main point is, though, as overwhelming as I can imagine starting a business would be, you're not at a loss for options. And don't fear networking with local small business owners at events or even introducing yourself in person to obtain their advice/perspectives--I'm sure they can provide invaluable pointers.
Gosh, your response in encouraging! Thank you!! While it has been 9 years since I lived in Seattle, I remember it fondly - but I remember the overcast skies, too, which kind of keeps me away. Plus, once I made it to the Northeast, I was ready to leave yet as it has a lot of big cities very close by, creating a large hub of interconnectedness that we just didn't have (unless we counted Tacoma - and who wanted to do that?!).
It's too easy for me to think about many things while I am finishing up my Masters and contemplating these ideas, and it's obvious I am not plugged in at all. I am hoping the fall session affords me some time to be able to do this since it's imperative to getting started on the right foot, you know?! I have to say, I am a bit tired of the sirens screaming by our place several times a day, and sort of long to return to a little bit of suburbia and actually see some trees rather than a bunch of empty storefronts. I plan to check out the towns you mentioned. We currently live in NW Philly, but I really like Willow Grove, but my husband really likes West Chester, but West Chester seems so far removed from everything. I still want access to Philly - maybe I just don't need to live IN Philly. However, our lease is up at the end of January, and it is so cold but maybe it won't snow until February (we moved in the snow and ice 2 years ago). I don't know what's worse, the cold and snow, or heat of 104 degrees! Sheesh!
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