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Old 04-26-2017, 08:03 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
2,130 posts, read 1,446,098 times
Reputation: 2413

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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp View Post
Another problem Philadelphia has is its attachment to cars and parking. I gave up my car upon my move to NYC and do not miss it at all.
How do you propose I get to my place of employment in New Jersey?
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:04 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
2,130 posts, read 1,446,098 times
Reputation: 2413
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
That's an American problem overall.
How's it a problem? I love the freedom my car allows me. Why should I wait for a bus or walk to the subway in the cold, rain and heat if I don't have to? Why should I be smashed in with strangers on public transit that span the spectrum if I don't have to? Why should I put my personal well being at risk?
I see the bicyclists on Delaware Ave, heading back to Fishtown from wherever it is they work and play ... sure, it's nice when the weather cooperates, but they never look happy in inclement weather. It sounds cool to say "I bike to work!," but I'd bet most of them would rather be in a toasty car when it's cold, a dry car when it's raining and a cold car when it's hot and humid. I get it if you can't afford a vehicle, but if you can ...
We own three vehicles between the two of us, with the third as a backup for when our regular rides are in the shop. The backup will become my everyday when my regular finally dies.

Last edited by 2002 Subaru; 04-26-2017 at 08:31 PM..
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:23 PM
 
Location: The City of Brotherly Love
1,296 posts, read 1,217,230 times
Reputation: 3504
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2002 Subaru View Post
How's it a problem? I love the freedom my car allows me.
The car isn't necessarily the problem; instead, the problem lies within certain residents and politicians who believe that parking is a right rather than a privilege. There is no way that a dense, urban, walkable city such as Philadelphia should alter its urban form to please motorists (especially those who don't even live in the city). Historic buildings should not be demolished for surface parking lots and urban highways. I-676 and I-95 are two examples of altering the urban fabric to accommodate motorists, which has led to a disconnection of Center City from the Delaware River waterfront and North Philly (this is being mended west of Broad). Center City is already the 2nd best urban core in the United States, and it will only become better once every surface parking lot is occupied with a building of sufficient density.

Honestly, I could care less if someone owns a car in the Far Northeast or parts of the Northwest, such as Roxborough; however, changing the urban fabric for cars can be a problem in the older, more urban parts of the city. If living in a dense, urban city is something that one desires, then car ownership may not be for them. There are plenty of alternatives, such as walking, biking, public transportation, and car-share services. Suburbanites who wish for parking should park at a Regional Rail station and take the train into the city. Suburbanites who want to change the city to accommodate cars are the worst kind of people, as they do not live in Philly.
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:29 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
2,130 posts, read 1,446,098 times
Reputation: 2413
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan2013 View Post
The car isn't necessarily the problem; instead, the problem lies within certain residents and politicians who believe that parking is a right rather than a privilege. There is no way that a dense, urban, walkable city such as Philadelphia should alter its urban form to please motorists (especially those who don't even live in the city). Historic buildings should not be demolished for surface parking lots and urban highways. I-676 and I-95 are two examples of altering the urban fabric to accommodate motorists, which has led to a disconnection of Center City from the Delaware River waterfront and North Philly (this is being mended west of Broad). Center City is already the 2nd best urban core in the United States, and it will only become better once every surface parking lot is occupied with a building of sufficient density.

Honestly, I could care less if someone owns a car in the Far Northeast or parts of the Northwest, such as Roxborough; however, changing the urban fabric for cars can be a problem in the older, more urban parts of the city. If living in a dense, urban city is something that one desires, then car ownership may not be for them. There are plenty of alternatives, such as walking, biking, public transportation, and car-share services. Suburbanites who wish for parking should park at a Regional Rail station and take the train into the city. Suburbanites who want to change the city to accommodate cars are the worst kind of people, as they do not live in Philly.
Yeah, but the city needs those suburbanites with their cars, they bring a lot of money into the city. I doubt many of them would come if they had to take SEPTA.
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:41 PM
 
Location: The City of Brotherly Love
1,296 posts, read 1,217,230 times
Reputation: 3504
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2002 Subaru View Post
Yeah, but the city needs those suburbanites with their cars, they bring a lot of money into the city. I doubt many of them would come if they had to take SEPTA.
Sure, they help the economy, but I don't think that we need them as much as we did in the past. Not only has the city's population been on the rise since 2006, but so has the city's median income. We would definitely take an economic hit if they decided to head elsewhere, but gone are the days where we planned and built structures solely to attract the money of suburbanites (ex. The Gallery). We also don't need to add more parking spaces, either. As the supply of parking in Center City has decreased over the years, so has the utilization of those spaces. This points to a previous oversupply of parking, which should continue to decrease until an equilibrium is reached.

Also, I think that more people would rather take SEPTA than deal with the price of parking, traffic, the PPA, etc. I live in Delaware County (until June 1st), and I take a bus, train, and the Broad Street Line going to and from the campus of Temple each day. The only thing that deters more people from taking SEPTA involves headways. I would bet money that ridership would increase significantly with more frequent (and later) headways. I take either the Media/Elwyn or Wilmington/Newark Line each day, and I will have to wait an hour during non-peak hours if I happen to miss a train.
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:53 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
2,130 posts, read 1,446,098 times
Reputation: 2413
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan2013 View Post

Also, I think that more people would rather take SEPTA than deal with the price of parking, traffic, the PPA, etc. I live in Delaware County (until June 1st), and I take a bus, train, and the Broad Street Line going to and from the campus of Temple each day. The only thing that deters more people from taking SEPTA involves headways. I would bet money that ridership would increase significantly with more frequent (and later) headways. I take either the Media/Elwyn or Wilmington/Newark Line each day, and I will have to wait an hour during non-peak hours if I happen to miss a train.
I pray to God I never have to deal with any of that.
And don't underestimate the impact suburbanites revenue has (and will continue to have) on the city. Take a look at 676 east on a Friday night around 6:30.
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:55 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,316 posts, read 12,920,013 times
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I'd posit that there's a happy medium between ripping seams left and right into the fabric of the urban core to cater to motorists and flipping the bird at drivers by destroying all non-garage parking in the name of urbanism. Interstate highways are also a necessary evil, though capping the exposed sub-surface portions is a valiant goal to strive toward. While I-95 cutting off the waterfront is unfortunate, I'd argue that the Vine Street Expressway cuts through Center City in the least disruptive way possible. I-676 isn't a socioeconomic barrier the way urban interstate highways are in many cities. Quite the contrary, in fact.

I happen to enjoy the regional rail, and since I have a pass, I'll use it to get into and out of Center City outside of working hours. But if I didn't have that pass and wanted to go into Town with my spouse, we'd almost pay less driving and parking in one of those surface lots than shelling out for advance fare tickets--and that's coming from Zone 2. And unless we planned on drinking too much to drive safely, we'd probably do just that.
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Old 04-26-2017, 09:14 PM
 
Location: The City of Brotherly Love
1,296 posts, read 1,217,230 times
Reputation: 3504
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2002 Subaru View Post
I pray to God I never have to deal with any of that.
And don't underestimate the impact suburbanites revenue has (and will continue to have) on the city. Take a look at 676 east on a Friday night around 6:30.
That's why I'm glad to move back to the city! Never do if you can. As much as I enjoy the commute, it can be a PITA if one mode is even a few minutes late. Also, I agree that they do make a sizable economic impact. I would love to redirect those who frequent KOP to Walnut Street, honestly. The previous statement I made was probably hyperbolic; I was just trying to establish the point that we don't need to dedicate an effort to plan for their patronage with projects like The Gallery due to a Philly that is more vibrant than past decades.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElijahAstin View Post
I'd posit that there's a happy medium between ripping seams left and right into the fabric of the urban core to cater to motorists and flipping the bird at drivers by destroying all non-garage parking in the name of urbanism. Interstate highways are also a necessary evil, though capping the exposed sub-surface portions is a valiant goal to strive toward. While I-95 cutting off the waterfront is unfortunate, I'd argue that the Vine Street Expressway cuts through Center City in the least disruptive way possible. I-676 isn't a socioeconomic barrier the way urban interstate highways are in many cities. Quite the contrary, in fact.

I happen to enjoy the regional rail, and since I have a pass, I'll use it to get into and out of Center City outside of working hours. But if I didn't have that pass and wanted to go into Town with my spouse, we'd almost pay less driving and parking in one of those surface lots than shelling out for advance fare tickets--and that's coming from Zone 2. And unless we planned on drinking too much to drive safely, we'd probably do just that.
I can agree with that. The VSE was more of an issue when there were surface parking lots on either side of Vine. With the Mormon Temple, 1601 Vine (The Alexander), and the recladding of the ex-GSK building on 15th and Race, CC and North Philly feel more connected. Projects along North Broad are also helping this. East of Broad, the area along the VSE has a little further to climb, but will probably blossom once the Rail Park finishes up.

To me, the Northwest is the biggest happy medium that the city has to offer. It is walkable, transit-rich, naturally beautiful, and has tons of large homes with character (for a cheaper price than one would find in many suburbs!). If my place of employment ends up being located in NJ or DE, then I would probably buy a car (only for work) and move to Manayunk. The NW would also be my compromising piece if my future spouse decides that she wants to move out to the suburbs.
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Old 04-26-2017, 09:26 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
2,130 posts, read 1,446,098 times
Reputation: 2413
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan2013 View Post
That's why I'm glad to move back to the city! Never do if you can. As much as I enjoy the commute, it can be a PITA if one mode is even a few minutes late. Also, I agree that they do make a sizable economic impact. I would love to redirect those who frequent KOP to Walnut Street, honestly. The previous statement I made was probably hyperbolic; I was just trying to establish the point that we don't need to dedicate an effort to plan for their patronage with projects like The Gallery due to a Philly that is more vibrant than past decades.

Agreed - no more Galleries! And I-95 along Center City should have been built underground.
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Old 04-26-2017, 09:32 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
9,316 posts, read 12,920,013 times
Reputation: 6163
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan2013 View Post
To me, the Northwest is the biggest happy medium that the city has to offer. It is walkable, transit-rich, naturally beautiful, and has tons of large homes with character (for a cheaper price than one would find in many suburbs!). If my place of employment ends up being located in NJ or DE, then I would probably buy a car (only for work) and move to Manayunk. The NW would also be my compromising piece if my future spouse decides that she wants to move out to the suburbs.
I happen to live in the Northwest as a compromise to my wife, so I agree with what you're saying. Whether we stay in the city limits with school-age children is another ball of wax, but we're a ways off from even having children, much less worrying about their education.

If you were working in New Jersey or Delaware, why would you move to Manayunk, though (where, with the exception of a few doorman buildings, parking's no picnic, by the way)? Better you should pay for garage (or even surface lot ) parking and not needlessly remove yourself from I-95 and/or the bridges.
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