New Yorker's experience of Philly (Philadelphia, Penn: renters, lofts, condo)

[AJNEOA]

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

Since I commute to work in Center City from Germantown every day, like many other Philadelphians in outlying neighborhoods do, I think most of us are familiar with more than our "standard running ground." But this post makes it clear to me that there are parts of the city you haven't been to. You'll find several large apartment buildings dotting City Avenue here and there, starting with the four-building Presidential City complex, a 1950s landmark, at its eastern end near the Schuylkill, and likewise, there are a number of apartment buildings scattered around Germantown's west side, none more prominent than Alden Park, a trio of 1920s Tudor Revival buildings that is the most photogenic apartment complex in the city. (The approach to the Manor building, which terminates the view down Chelten Avenue to the west, ends with two tallish apartment buildings flanking Chelten, the Hathaway House and Park Manor.)

And this is another thing about Northwest Philly in particular: rowhouses aren't the only house type that's widespread up this way. Like in parts of University City, large twins dominate some neighborhoods, and you'll even find single-family homes on several blocks in Germantown, Mt. Airy and Chestnut Hill. There are plenty of rowhouse blocks, true, but they aren't as relentless as they are in North or South Philly, or West Philly past 47th Street.

I'm definitely not saying row houses are the only type of housing. Or that there aren't a good number of apartment buildings. I routinely take regional rail to other hoods and towns on the weekend to explore, so I hear what you're saying.

Having traveled throughout North America, Europe, South America and Asia, I have been to many cities. When comparing Philly to other cities its size, I find that there are less apartment buildings mixed in with our row house neighborhoods, which span a remarkable portion of the city. I actually work at the top of one of our tallest buildings and I have a nice bird's eye view (as an added layer of analysis), and many other cities would normally have large apartment buildings sprinkled in more consistently, especially in the core.

We tend to build more row houses even in Center City when apartment buildings would be more reasonable IMO. And there is an anti-apartment sentiment among many neighborhoods simply because there are so many home owners.

Btw, I love row houses and love when they are implemented with mixed use. Very walkable and a better QOL than apartments in some ways. But I think the scales are tipped for sure.

[Lenses & Lights.]

Originally Posted by Gerania

OK, it feels like a small city. I grew up in Wilkes-Barre, PA, and I feel very comfortable in Philly.

Well I grew up in West Philly and was not comfortable in Wilkes-Barre...... So, therefore., NO.

[Gerania]

Originally Posted by Lenses & Lights.

Well I grew up in West Philly and was not comfortable in Wilkes-Barre...... So, therefore., NO.

Fair enough. We all have a comfort level.

When I am in Philly, I'm in a neighborhood. It may be Rittenhouse, Queen Village, East Falls or Port Richmond. All of those places feel like towns to me. People live, work, eat and sleep there.

Philadelphia is a big city, but like most, it is a conglomeration of towns and neighborhoods.

When did you go to Wilkes-Barre? Did something unpleasant happen?

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by AJNEOA

I'm definitely not saying row houses are the only type of housing. Or that there aren't a good number of apartment buildings. I routinely take regional rail to other hoods and towns on the weekend to explore, so I hear what you're saying.

Having traveled throughout North America, Europe, South America and Asia, I have been to many cities. When comparing Philly to other cities its size, I find that there are less apartment buildings mixed in with our row house neighborhoods, which span a remarkable portion of the city. I actually work at the top of one of our tallest buildings and I have a nice bird's eye view (as an added layer of analysis), and many other cities would normally have large apartment buildings sprinkled in more consistently, especially in the core.

We tend to build more row houses even in Center City when apartment buildings would be more reasonable IMO. And there is an anti-apartment sentiment among many neighborhoods simply because there are so many home owners.

Btw, I love row houses and love when they are implemented with mixed use. Very walkable and a better QOL than apartments in some ways. But I think the scales are tipped for sure.

I wouldn't quibble at all with your last sentence - I do think that Philadelphians on the whole prefer single-family row houses to apartments. Though in the lower-income neighborhoods, the number of single-family houses that have been subdivided into apartments might surprise you (I live in one), and there are certainly enough of those in Center City as well.

And maybe had you put "relative" before "lack of apartments" in your prior statement, I wouldn't have responded as I did. But I'd say that there are pockets of some neighborhoods, west Germantown especially, where apartment buildings are thicker on the ground than that statement implies to me.

I'd also agree with you that there's a relative lack of apartments in Center City compared to other big-city downtown residential districts. But the big developers have done a lot to reduce the gap over the past few years.

[Warszawa]

I think they should replace some of the parking lots between Old City and Center City with apartment buildings. They already have enough parking there, if they build some nicer modern apartment buildings they can make tons of $$$

[Pennsport]

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

I wouldn't quibble at all with your last sentence - I do think that Philadelphians on the whole prefer single-family row houses to apartments. Though in the lower-income neighborhoods, the number of single-family houses that have been subdivided into apartments might surprise you (I live in one), and there are certainly enough of those in Center City as well.

And maybe had you put "relative" before "lack of apartments" in your prior statement, I wouldn't have responded as I did. But I'd say that there are pockets of some neighborhoods, west Germantown especially, where apartment buildings are thicker on the ground than that statement implies to me.

I'd also agree with you that there's a relative lack of apartments in Center City compared to other big-city downtown residential districts. But the big developers have done a lot to reduce the gap over the past few years.

I understand the density argument, but Philly has been so underdeveloped for decades that we don't really have to get insanely vertical just yet. But why on earth is everyone acting like apartments are some incredible institution that Philly sadly lacks? I've lived in apartments and they suck:
- Get off bus/cab, etc...
- Walk to lobby
- Navigate the crowds in lobby; say hello to doorman who does nothing for you but you have to tip four times a year
- Wait on the lift
- Get in lift with five other people
- Get off lift after five stops
- 10 minutes later arrive at your door
- Go in and hear your upstairs neighbor getting ready to go out - clumping on the hardwood with her heels
- Uh oh, neighbor to the right - baby just woke up. Crying
- Oh good, neighbor to the left is home and just turned on his Play Station to get into another epic Call of Duty battle.

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by Pennsport

I understand the density argument, but Philly has been so underdeveloped for decades that we don't really have to get insanely vertical just yet. But why on earth is everyone acting like apartments are some incredible institution that Philly sadly lacks? I've lived in apartments and they suck:
- Get off bus/cab, etc...
- Walk to lobby
- Navigate the crowds in lobby; say hello to doorman who does nothing for you but you have to tip four times a year
- Wait on the lift
- Get in lift with five other people
- Get off lift after five stops
- 10 minutes later arrive at your door
- Go in and hear your upstairs neighbor getting ready to go out - clumping on the hardwood with her heels
- Uh oh, neighbor to the right - baby just woke up. Crying
- Oh good, neighbor to the left is home and just turned on his Play Station to get into another epic Call of Duty battle.

I worked for about six months as a security guard at one of those Germantown apartment buildings I mentioned upthread, the Hathaway House.

The description above bears little resemblance to what I experienced there from the other side of the desk. I still get invited back to the building's holiday party by a member of the maintenance staff who tips me off.

A friend of mine moved from there to a house he owns in G'town. I helped him move from one unit to another in the building before taking on the security guard duty. He definitely had a good experience renting there. (He had rented the house out, then decided to move back into it.)

I realize that the plural of anecdote is not data. I just post this to offer an alternative narrative to this one.

[Pine to Vine]

Originally Posted by Warszawa

I think they should replace some of the parking lots between Old City and Center City with apartment buildings. They already have enough parking there, if they build some nicer modern apartment buildings they can make tons of $$$

We’re taking up a collection to do that now.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by Warszawa

I think they should replace some of the parking lots between Old City and Center City with apartment buildings. They already have enough parking there, if they build some nicer modern apartment buildings they can make tons of $$$

That's happening as are some old garages being converted into living spaces. There were a lot more surface lots than there are now.

[AJNEOA]

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

I wouldn't quibble at all with your last sentence - I do think that Philadelphians on the whole prefer single-family row houses to apartments. Though in the lower-income neighborhoods, the number of single-family houses that have been subdivided into apartments might surprise you (I live in one), and there are certainly enough of those in Center City as well.

And maybe had you put "relative" before "lack of apartments" in your prior statement, I wouldn't have responded as I did. But I'd say that there are pockets of some neighborhoods, west Germantown especially, where apartment buildings are thicker on the ground than that statement implies to me.

I'd also agree with you that there's a relative lack of apartments in Center City compared to other big-city downtown residential districts. But the big developers have done a lot to reduce the gap over the past few years.

Well, there is a straight-up lack of apartments in many non core neighborhoods (there are exceptions). And I'm not an apartment lover, but a good mix makes for a healthy city IMO.