30th Street Station: Upping the Game? (city hall, home, school)

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by cpomp

I don't think high end is needed, but a Shake Shack, Honeygrow, Pret a Manger, Sweetgreen, etc. is a lot better then a Wendys and a crappy Chinese place. Even a small CVS or drug store would be great since there aren't any close by.

Also, I wish advertisers would stop hanging credit card banners in the main area of the station, it covers the beautiful elements of the building, but I guess that is for funding? I am not familiar with how all that stuff works.

The federal government forces Amtrak to do tacky things like that advertising because of, yes, inadequate funding. The goal is to kill Amtrak.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by jbgusa

New York's Penn was once, according to a close friend's report more beautiful than Grand Central Terminal. In 1963 it was demolished to accommodate a relocated Madison Square Garden. This destruction, not announced in advance, led to New York's landmark law. In 1978 this law averted a similar catastrophe planned for Grand Central, with the notable leadership of Jackie (Kennedy) Onassis.

There's an American Experience doc about why it was built, how it was built and why it disappeared. For those interested it's worth watching.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by Redddog

Word!!

I can't tell you how many times I've watched that train pull out seconds before I got there forcing a full 30 minute wait. That train is always pretty full. They could surely add to the schedule.

Not enough rolling stock. Not enough money to buy new equipment and hire personnel. Come on guys. You all know why the service is more limited than it should be.

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by kyb01

Do you even remotely understand that whatever happens to the area around 30th St Station will be impacted by what the federal government does or will support? There is already a delay wrt when a developer will be selected. With Reps controlling the fed gov you will be holding your breathe for a very long time about this.

In the case of Powelton Yard, Amtrak doesn't need Congressional action to do something to alter its use. If it can find a private developer willing to build over it, it can negotiate some deal with that developer - most likely Brandywine Realty Trust, given that it's Drexel's partner in Schuylkill Yards next door.

Unless I'm mistaken about the role the Feds play in the management and disposal of Amtrak-owned property. I think they had a hand in the Moynihan Station project because the building was owned by the U.S. government and Federal funds would be needed for its repurposing. I don't think either of those conditions apply to Powelton Yard.

Originally Posted by kyb01

The federal government forces Amtrak to do tacky things like that advertising because of, yes, inadequate funding. The goal is to kill Amtrak.

But as I noted above, Amtrak won't be killed because enough people, including in Republican Congressional districts, want to preserve passenger rail service in some form. Hence it will remain the same hydra-headed creature it's been, quasi-public yet expected to run like a private corporation (which it is, technically; it just happens to have only one stockholder), for the foreseeable future. And there's certainly no appetite among the nine states served by Northeast Corridor trains to take over ownership and operation of Amtrak's one profitable service directly.

Originally Posted by kyb01

Not enough rolling stock. Not enough money to buy new equipment and hire personnel. Come on guys. You all know why the service is more limited than it should be.

SEPTA is in the process of buying new bi-level passenger coaches for Regional Rail right now. These will increase the system's capacity but do nothing for service frequency unless they don't replace all the Silverliner IVs.

Personnel is another matter, but SEPTA had been on a hiring and training spree for Regional Rail locomotive engineers last year, after retirements and departures for other agencies left the Railroad Division extremely short-handed. Notice that you haven't heard about a rash of train cancellations this year?

The main reason Regional Rail doesn't run more often isn't financial, though SEPTA would definitely need to budget more money for operations if it did reduce headways. It's attitudinal, on the part of both the brass at 1234 Market and the leadership of the UTU and the Railroad Brotherhoods.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

In the case of Powelton Yard, Amtrak doesn't need Congressional action to do something to alter its use. If it can find a private developer willing to build over it, it can negotiate some deal with that developer - most likely Brandywine Realty Trust, given that it's Drexel's partner in Schuylkill Yards next door.

Unless I'm mistaken about the role the Feds play in the management and disposal of Amtrak-owned property. I think they had a hand in the Moynihan Station project because the building was owned by the U.S. government and Federal funds would be needed for its repurposing. I don't think either of those conditions apply to Powelton Yard.



But as I noted above, Amtrak won't be killed because enough people, including in Republican Congressional districts, want to preserve passenger rail service in some form. Hence it will remain the same hydra-headed creature it's been, quasi-public yet expected to run like a private corporation (which it is, technically; it just happens to have only one stockholder), for the foreseeable future. And there's certainly no appetite among the nine states served by Northeast Corridor trains to take over ownership and operation of Amtrak's one profitable service directly.

I have not checked the budget just passed by the House, but it's almost guaranteed that they've zeroed out Amtrak's budget.
I'm not saying the Senate will go along with it but, honestly, what you are saying above could just end completely. It's almost like you believe that there are actually a lot of rational Republicans left. If any funds are syphoned off, inspite of its corporate status, it will probably lose any ability to function eventually.

[Woodlands]

Love 30th Street Station.. Have so many fond memories of coming in there on Amtrak as a kid. It is one of the best train stations on the east coast.. I can only hope it only gets better. Not being familiar with any of the long range plans. but seems like the yards coming and going out of the station should be good candidates for "decking over"?


On a slightly different note.. wasn't there a plan to bring Amtrak into Market East in the future? I have wondered how the trains from western Pennsy are able to platform on the lower level when they run from Harrisburg to NYC

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by Woodlands

On a slightly different note.. wasn't there a plan to bring Amtrak into Market East in the future? I have wondered how the trains from western Pennsy are able to platform on the lower level when they run from Harrisburg to NYC

Second question first:

The way the PRR ran things, trains traveling from New York to points west of Philadelphia made their main Philadelphia stop at North Philadelphia Station and bypassed the stations in Center City. There is a short tunnel at Zoo interlocking that these trains used to move between the NEC main and the Main Line; it bears the grandiose name "New York and Pittsburgh Subway."

It's not been used for through passenger trains since the early 1990s, when Amtrak decided to have these trains use 30th Street instead thanks to conditions both at and around North Philadelphia. The stop at 30th Street is in essence a terminal move: they pull into the station from the north and then reverse direction to resume the trip to New York or Harrisburg and points west. IIRC, there's an engine move while the train is at 30th Street where the locomotive changes ends (or rather, Amtrak changes locomotives, removing the one at the train's south end and adding one at the north end. If the train is coming from or headed to somewhere west of Harrisburg, the switch also exchanges a diesel locomotive for an electric one, or vice versa, depending on which way the train is headed).

Now to the first question: The "Amtrak at Market East" thingy is part of a plan currently making its way through the review process for a completely new NEC alignment that will allow for higher speeds than the current alignment can handle. One of the proposals envisions a north-south tunnel through Philadelphia with underground stations at Philadelphia International Airport and Market East. I give this proposal less than 50-50 odds of becoming reality, largely because of its price tag.

[cpomp]

A friend of mine sent me a picture this morning of signs in 30th St Station displaying a Pret a Manger coming soon! Looks like someone read our forum

[AJNEOA]

Originally Posted by cpomp

A friend of mine sent me a picture this morning of signs in 30th St Station displaying a Pret a Manger coming soon! Looks like someone read our forum

I wish it was going to be there by Thursday when I have to travel through 30th street.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by cpomp

A friend of mine sent me a picture this morning of signs in 30th St Station displaying a Pret a Manger coming soon! Looks like someone read our forum

There's already an Au Bon Pain. There isn't a heck of a lot of difference. In that genre, I personally prefer Panera.