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Well I was a white guy who worked in an almost entirely black neighborhood in West Philadelphia for a year. Never once had a problem with anyone on the street, and I used to go buy food from the surrounding little stores on Lancaster Ave all the time. The junkie who hung out on the corner of 41st St used to say hi to me every morning as I got off the trolly. The Black parents of the kids I taught there never bothered me for being white.
My guess is you’ve never spent any time getting to know the “scary blacks” you so quickly move to demonize. Because if you did you wouldn’t be sounding like the ignorant fool you are.
Just an example of how you and others demonize one group and take objection to someone else allegedly demonizes another group.
Point being white-you weren't bothered in west philly, just like blacks, muslims etc can go about their business throughout the city without being bothered because they are black or muslim. Maybe even someone says good morning to a black guy in northeast on his way to work.
Really? I’ve mentioned it more then a few times on here. Granted I'm not the most frequent poster on here though.
Glad to know!
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01
Yes, really.
Afai knew before there were MarketStEl, cpomp, pine to vine, the fellow who shows up on the retail thread and me.
Wrt, the traditional gayborhood, things that happened were Boomers aging out of the club/bar scene and AIDs. AIDs killed 3 of my friends back in the late 80s. It obviously left a vacuum.
The Gayborhood IS changing, but some of this I actually consider A Good Thing.
Gay bars arose because there were so few places where gay men could socialize in a casual public setting the way straight folks did in all sorts of places, including bars, which are one of the "Great Good Places" - "third places" that are neither home nor work yet play an important role in holding a community together.
That they also doubled as pickup spots is perhaps unavoidable given our circumscribed social world prior to Stonewall.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MB1562
Yup, and now with 12th Street Gym closed, the Gayborhood lost another big community staple. I was a member there for the entire time I have lived in Philly and it was painful to see it close last week. Unfortunately the gay clubs, by far the best in the city, are being ruined by the changing neighborhood and straight people “discovering” them. Woodys is basically already too far gone and Voyuer will be the next victim.
I think the younger generation is more comfortable socializing in environments where it really doesn't matter what your orientation is, and if a gay guy hits on a straight guy in the course of things, no biggie. Which means that Woody's may be the future (though I actually think that it's simply the Weiss brothers trying to have it all ways), and we won't need a Gayborhood a generation hence. I'll shed a tear should that happen, though.
I was in Tabu today with the guy I'm dating. It's my go-to bar in the Gayborhood specifically because its staff and owners have a "no attitude, everyone's welcome" policy. I remember a pretty sloppy drunk woman planting a big wet kiss on me one night there. (Its days are also numbered, for the developer who just bought the buildings that housed the 12th Street Gym will probably buy its building as well in order to build a 10-story apartment house on the site.)
Today, of course, every bar was a "straight" bar in Center City because the place was full of Eagles fans celebrating the Super Bowl victory. My bf (can I really call him that? I'm not sure, tbh) was actually irritated by the presence of so many women (and he made some remarks to me about how white folks act so entitled on the way downstairs from the bar where the women were hanging out, something I didn't pick up from the two white women I was interacting with while waiting to get served but he did), but I was like, "Everyplace is for everyone today." Still, I guess I can see a continued value in "safe spaces" where LGBT folk can act whatever way we want to without having to worry about offending some straight guy's delicate sense of manhood (it's usually the guys who get bent out of shape. The women are totally cool with us. In fact, some women like going to gay bars because they know they can be among attractive guys who won't hit on them.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2e1m5a
Actually two of us, although I suppose I don't speak on it much on these boards. Germantown/Mt. Airy is really like the gayborhood for those a little bit older and with families. At one point on my tiny block in Germantown we had 5 lesbian households (3 married and 2 of those with children) and 3 gay households.
You've said on at least one occasion in the past that you'd like to meet me. Why don't you drop by the Northwest Philly LGBT Chat 'n' Chew at Earth Bread & Brewery in Mt. Airy some Tuesday night? It starts at 7 in the upstairs space. LMK in advance that you're coming and I'll do my best to be there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamms
Where are your black flash-mob hoodlums that beat up gay people in Center City?
While there are fears related to ''conservative'' northeast areas, aka white, ethnic, why does no one mention the heavily African-American neighborhoods, not exactly friendly to gays, and, obviously, whites, asians etc.?
Not exactly a great reflection of tolerance from the key Democratic base.
Because - if my experience is any guide - the African-American neighborhoods aren't "not exactly friendly to gays." Certainly no worse than, say, neighborhoods in the Far Northeast. (FTR, I lived in the lower Northeast for 18 months, off Oxford Circle. It was an eye-opener - that part of the city has become a little United Nations what with immigration from the Caribbean, East Asia and some other places.
(DomJon96: Northeast Philadephia was the last part of the city to be developed - except for Frankford and some of the neighborhoods along the Delaware, none of it was developed before 1900 and much of it postdates the Second World War. It's home to most of the white ethnics who left other parts of the city to flee from Them (I'm one of Them) but didn't leave the city entirely (in some cases, they had to stay because they worked for the city and it used to require that anyone who worked for it lived in it). Most of the city's Republican voters, and its only Republican district member of City Council, live in the Northeast. But as the lower Northeast shows (and the area around Bustleton in the Far Northeast, which has seen significant immigration from Russia), even it's not what it used to be.)
I've lived in an African-American neighborhood for five years now after 18 months in the Northeast and almost 30 in the Gayborhood. I've chatted with obviously gay men who've walked past my front porch when I'm out barbecuing on it. A neighbor once asked me point blank if I was and basically said "no big deal" when I confirmed it.
African-Americans tend to be culturally conservative but less likely to engage in anti-gay violence. I'd say based on some stories I've heard from middle-class blacks who've come out to their families that a more common reaction could be characterized as "We still love you anyway," with "but we wish you hadn't come out" implied. I know it happens, but it seems to me I hear of more white kids who get thrown out of their homes for coming out than I do black kids. Shoot, I just met a young black man who's coming out of the closet whose straight brother recommended he look me up at a networking event we both attended.
This may get deleted, but Kamms, I do get from you a sense that you doth protest too much and that you use the same broad brush to tar people that you complain about when others use one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamms
If Philly safety is the issue, and because you are a gay male with a bf, no need to limit that issue to conservative/republican areas. That's blanket stereotyping.
Safety is hardly limited as a concern in these ''conservative'' (whatever that means in Philly) areas; just keep your wits about you like anywhere else. Gun violence, assault, the occassional center city flash-mob, are the biggest threats to you in Philly.
Don't bite into the bait related to that 2014 street fight in Center City with those 2 gay guys.
Oh, and don't walk around with ear-buds in.
Maybe I'm incredibly naïve, or perhaps incredibly lucky, but I walk around with earbuds all the time. Including walking around East Germantown.
If gun violence were that much of a threat, I should be dead by now, for I know that there have been three murders on my block over an 18-month period ending last September, two of them within a month of each other and in the same spot. Yet I've yet to hear gunfire at night. I must be away or asleep when these things happen.
The truth is, in most cases where someone dies from a gunshot, the perp and the victim know each other.
The friends I've invited up to my place - black and white alike - have had nothing untoward happen to them save for one guy who went out looking for weed but found something else. (He still visits. He's also a white guy who lives in Strawberry Mansion.)
So now that I've said all this, what would you like to know about living ***** in Germantown, DomJon96? (Edited to add: Didn't know that the Q-word triggered the auto-censor, but I guess it figures.)
It's actually had a non-trivial LGBT population (mostly L when I moved here in the 1980s but definitely more mixed now) for decades. Like its two sister neighborhoods up Germantown Avenue, Mt. Airy and Chestnut Hill, it has a boskier feel than the rest of the city, and community spirit here runs high. Large parts of it are down at heels, but I get this feeling that positive changes are happening here, and I know I'm not alone based on the conversations I've had with fellow Germantowners.
It has good transit connections to the rest of the city; I can be at City Hall in 30 minutes during the workday and no more than 45 minutes at most other times. The neighborhood's west side is better off and has less crime than its east side; in fact, based on what people who attended the Northwest Philly District Plan meeting last week plotted in the planning charettes, it seems that the major intersection closest to my home is probably the most troubled part of the neighborhood.
It's probably the most socioeconomically diverse neighborhood in the city, something I consider a plus. (With 65,000 residents, it's also the most populous.)
If you want to be close to LGBT nightlife, you should look elsewhere, but as that Chat 'n' Chew I mentioned above should indicate, there are social activities for LGBT people up this way. The LGBT population probably does skew older and more settled than that in the Gayborhood.
Should you ever desire, I'd be happy to show you around.
Last edited by MarketStEl; 02-08-2018 at 07:27 PM..
Where are your black flash-mob hoodlums that beat up gay people in Center City?
While there are fears related to ''conservative'' northeast areas, aka white, ethnic, why does no one mention the heavily African-American neighborhoods, not exactly friendly to gays, and, obviously, whites, asians etc.?
Not exactly a great reflection of tolerance from the key Democratic base.
People in those type of areas arent friendly to anyone, even other blacks, it goes without saying that a young guy fresh out of college wouldnt be planning on moving to places like Olney some consider it not worth mentioning.
But most younger black professionals (especially the females) are very tolerant of gays. Wouldnt shock me if we had more gays per capita than any other race tbh.
Sandy, Disston Saw started at 2nd and Market in 1850 and moved to Tacony in 1872. So saying that not much was going on north of Frankford before 1900 isn't quite true.
Sandy, Disston Saw started at 2nd and Market in 1850 and moved to Tacony in 1872. So saying that not much was going on north of Frankford before 1900 isn't quite true.
I said "and some of the neighborhoods along the Delaware."
Sandy, Disston Saw started at 2nd and Market in 1850 and moved to Tacony in 1872. So saying that not much was going on north of Frankford before 1900 isn't quite true.
^^^^ Good info. I just assumed that Disston was always in Tacony.
The Gayborhood IS changing, but some of this I actually consider A Good Thing.
Gay bars arose because there were so few places where gay men could socialize in a casual public setting the way straight folks did in all sorts of places, including bars, which are one of the "Great Good Places" - "third places" that are neither home nor work yet play an important role in holding a community together.
That they also doubled as pickup spots is perhaps unavoidable given our circumscribed social world prior to Stonewall.
I think the younger generation is more comfortable socializing in environments where it really doesn't matter what your orientation is, and if a gay guy hits on a straight guy in the course of things, no biggie. Which means that Woody's may be the future (though I actually think that it's simply the Weiss brothers trying to have it all ways), and we won't need a Gayborhood a generation hence. I'll shed a tear should that happen, though.
I was in Tabu today with the guy I'm dating. It's my go-to bar in the Gayborhood specifically because its staff and owners have a "no attitude, everyone's welcome" policy. I remember a pretty sloppy drunk woman planting a big wet kiss on me one night there. (Its days are also numbered, for the developer who just bought the buildings that housed the 12th Street Gym will probably buy its building as well in order to build a 10-story apartment house on the site.)
Today, of course, every bar was a "straight" bar in Center City because the place was full of Eagles fans celebrating the Super Bowl victory. My bf (can I really call him that? I'm not sure, tbh) was actually irritated by the presence of so many women (and he made some remarks to me about how white folks act so entitled on the way downstairs from the bar where the women were hanging out, something I didn't pick up from the two white women I was interacting with while waiting to get served but he did), but I was like, "Everyplace is for everyone today." Still, I guess I can see a continued value in "safe spaces" where LGBT folk can act whatever way we want to without having to worry about offending some straight guy's delicate sense of manhood (it's usually the guys who get bent out of shape. The women are totally cool with us. In fact, some women like going to gay bars because they know they can be among attractive guys who won't hit on them.)
You've said on at least one occasion in the past that you'd like to meet me. Why don't you drop by the Northwest Philly LGBT Chat 'n' Chew at Earth Bread & Brewery in Mt. Airy some Tuesday night? It starts at 7 in the upstairs space. LMK in advance that you're coming and I'll do my best to be there.
Because - if my experience is any guide - the African-American neighborhoods aren't "not exactly friendly to gays." Certainly no worse than, say, neighborhoods in the Far Northeast. (FTR, I lived in the lower Northeast for 18 months, off Oxford Circle. It was an eye-opener - that part of the city has become a little United Nations what with immigration from the Caribbean, East Asia and some other places.
(DomJon96: Northeast Philadephia was the last part of the city to be developed - except for Frankford and some of the neighborhoods along the Delaware, none of it was developed before 1900 and much of it postdates the Second World War. It's home to most of the white ethnics who left other parts of the city to flee from Them (I'm one of Them) but didn't leave the city entirely (in some cases, they had to stay because they worked for the city and it used to require that anyone who worked for it lived in it). Most of the city's Republican voters, and its only Republican district member of City Council, live in the Northeast. But as the lower Northeast shows (and the area around Bustleton in the Far Northeast, which has seen significant immigration from Russia), even it's not what it used to be.)
I've lived in an African-American neighborhood for five years now after 18 months in the Northeast and almost 30 in the Gayborhood. I've chatted with obviously gay men who've walked past my front porch when I'm out barbecuing on it. A neighbor once asked me point blank if I was and basically said "no big deal" when I confirmed it.
African-Americans tend to be culturally conservative but less likely to engage in anti-gay violence. I'd say based on some stories I've heard from middle-class blacks who've come out to their families that a more common reaction could be characterized as "We still love you anyway," with "but we wish you hadn't come out" implied. I know it happens, but it seems to me I hear of more white kids who get thrown out of their homes for coming out than I do black kids. Shoot, I just met a young black man who's coming out of the closet whose straight brother recommended he look me up at a networking event we both attended.
This may get deleted, but Kamms, I do get from you a sense that you doth protest too much and that you use the same broad brush to tar people that you complain about when others use one.
Maybe I'm incredibly naïve, or perhaps incredibly lucky, but I walk around with earbuds all the time. Including walking around East Germantown.
If gun violence were that much of a threat, I should be dead by now, for I know that there have been three murders on my block over an 18-month period ending last September, two of them within a month of each other and in the same spot. Yet I've yet to hear gunfire at night. I must be away or asleep when these things happen.
The truth is, in most cases where someone dies from a gunshot, the perp and the victim know each other.
The friends I've invited up to my place - black and white alike - have had nothing untoward happen to them save for one guy who went out looking for weed but found something else. (He still visits. He's also a white guy who lives in Strawberry Mansion.)
So now that I've said all this, what would you like to know about living ***** in Germantown, DomJon96? (Edited to add: Didn't know that the Q-word triggered the auto-censor, but I guess it figures.)
It's actually had a non-trivial LGBT population (mostly L when I moved here in the 1980s but definitely more mixed now) for decades. Like its two sister neighborhoods up Germantown Avenue, Mt. Airy and Chestnut Hill, it has a boskier feel than the rest of the city, and community spirit here runs high. Large parts of it are down at heels, but I get this feeling that positive changes are happening here, and I know I'm not alone based on the conversations I've had with fellow Germantowners.
It has good transit connections to the rest of the city; I can be at City Hall in 30 minutes during the workday and no more than 45 minutes at most other times. The neighborhood's west side is better off and has less crime than its east side; in fact, based on what people who attended the Northwest Philly District Plan meeting last week plotted in the planning charettes, it seems that the major intersection closest to my home is probably the most troubled part of the neighborhood.
It's probably the most socioeconomically diverse neighborhood in the city, something I consider a plus. (With 65,000 residents, it's also the most populous.)
If you want to be close to LGBT nightlife, you should look elsewhere, but as that Chat 'n' Chew I mentioned above should indicate, there are social activities for LGBT people up this way. The LGBT population probably does skew older and more settled than that in the Gayborhood.
Should you ever desire, I'd be happy to show you around.
My broad-brush is only used as a counter-example to the other broad-brushes being tossed around. Only certain group/s are allowed to be broad-brushed on this forum, others are no-go zones, so let's not broad-brush any group?
This whole crime point and the safety you have as a gay male in philly and a non-CC neighborhood is my point: one can be a victim of crime anywhere; gay male in s philly, w philly, n philly, ne philly. Not just the northeast stereotype of ''conservative areas''.
Location: NYC based - Used to Live in Philly - Transplant from Miami
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Reputation: 2610
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpomp
Also an FYI, most of the Philadelphia area (city and suburbs) are either very accepting/ don't care if you are gay, I know you will always run into an occasional pig from time to time, but you could pretty much settle in any neighborhood or town and be totally fine.
It should come down to what type of amenities you want, budget, do you want to be in a more or less gay neighborhood.
But never live in Middle Bucks County area.
Remember Kathryn Knott and her *****hole friends? *shudder*
I think in general South East Pennsylvania is very gay friendly and liberal.
And yes I am also gay.
Location: NYC based - Used to Live in Philly - Transplant from Miami
2,307 posts, read 2,766,054 times
Reputation: 2610
Sandy,
I just want to say congratulations!
I know it has been hard for you lately. Per your FB posts.
I hope with this, things will finally get better.
Sandy,
I just want to say congratulations!
I know it has been hard for you lately. Per your FB posts.
I hope with this, things will finally get better.
Thanks, and they have been!
Your move in Words with Friends already, and perhaps you might be able to meet up again sometime?
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Granted I'm not the most frequent poster on here though.
