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Old 09-11-2018, 11:39 AM
 
Location: Denver, CO
23,613 posts, read 10,782,374 times
Reputation: 17709

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MB1562 View Post
As a teacher I can tell you: educated, involved parents and a stable home life are just as important, if not moreso, then the teacher and "quality" of the school.
^^^^^This. Sadly, that is not the case in many instances. Throwing more, and more money at schools is not the answer either.
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Old 09-11-2018, 11:51 AM
 
Location: Dude...., I'm right here
1,243 posts, read 799,046 times
Reputation: 736
This goes back to my point. If city public schools are to get better, the changes will have to first start in the black communities that make up the majority of the students.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl View Post
No, it really doesn't, and I think that's a reasonable question to ask, but find me one.

I could throw back at you an old African-American saying: "The white man's ice is colder and his sugar is sweeter." I have neither the time nor the inclination right now to write the dissertation on all the ways our societal structure, public policies and various customs have to date made it necessary to bring white people in because for too long, they were set up to keep black people away from all the real benefits, and there is a sense in which this is dismissing African-Americans' ability to construct schools that excel (actually, they have, but they're public charters. I'm thinking in particular of the KIPP [Knowledge is Power Principle] schools in New York and elsewhere; there are at least two in Philadelphia I'm aware of).

But remember, I'm an integrationist, as are many blacks. You can't have integration sitting off by yourself. And there is a part of me that says about this, "You all [whites collectively] made this mess. It's your responsibility to pitch in on cleaning it up."
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Old 09-11-2018, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Germantown, Philadelphia
6,213 posts, read 3,048,381 times
Reputation: 3932
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ondoner View Post
This goes back to my point. If city public schools are to get better, the changes will have to first start in the black communities that make up the majority of the students.
Tell you what. Become a Big Brother to a fatherless child in an inner-city neighborhood then report back to me. (My Dad was one.)
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Old 09-11-2018, 12:15 PM
 
Location: New York City
1,371 posts, read 781,463 times
Reputation: 2125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot1 View Post
^^^^^This. Sadly, that is not the case in many instances. Throwing more, and more money at schools is not the answer either.
Money is by no means the only issue, but it is a huge one. Philadelphia schools are woefully underfunded in comparison to what they need.
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Old 09-11-2018, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Dude...., I'm right here
1,243 posts, read 799,046 times
Reputation: 736
For the few years I have lived in Philly, I have made an annual donation to BBBS and even attended a session on participating in their program.

As a proud American, I'm hoping to contribute in bettering the local communities of where I live and I intend to make substantial contributions once I'm an empty nester. My focus right now is on my own kids.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl View Post
Tell you what. Become a Big Brother to a fatherless child in an inner-city neighborhood then report back to me. (My Dad was one.)
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:59 PM
 
Location: southern california
57,831 posts, read 76,774,881 times
Reputation: 51150
The welfare department in some states give the casas test -basic math and reading -most here score at 6th grade level - most have finished 10th grade or have a high school diploma on file -
You must be reading at 9th grade level to get a job -you must be able to follow written instructions -
What does that tell you about the importance of literacy?
What does that say about incarceration and literacy correlation?
You seem to put cultural enrichment ahead of literacy
Not good
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:10 PM
 
Location: Germantown, Philadelphia
6,213 posts, read 3,048,381 times
Reputation: 3932
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
The welfare department in some states give the casas test -basic math and reading -most here score at 6th grade level - most have finished 10th grade or have a high school diploma on file -
You must be reading at 9th grade level to get a job -you must be able to follow written instructions -
What does that tell you about the importance of literacy?
What does that say about incarceration and literacy correlation?
You seem to put cultural enrichment ahead of literacy
Not good
In which case I think I need to ask about your reading comprehension.

I agreed that those were the fundamentals. But you had gone on to say they were all that mattered. I'm saying they're not. Nor did I say they mattered more. I did say they will probably be more useful than you claim.

Yes, if a school can't execute the fundamentals, then it needs to let the rest slide until it can. But there's also this: How well a school executes the fundamentals may depend on factors outside the classroom. (Which is an issue FKD19124 raised.) The flip side is also true: parents who know how to get the most out of their school may be able to get great performance on the fundamentals from a mediocre school, especially if that school has responsive and caring faculty and staff.
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Old 09-11-2018, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Germantown, Philadelphia
6,213 posts, read 3,048,381 times
Reputation: 3932
Quote:
Originally Posted by MB1562 View Post
Money is by no means the only issue, but it is a huge one. Philadelphia schools are woefully underfunded in comparison to what they need.
My landlord introduced me to the headmaster of Wiliam Penn Charter School (the oldest and perhaps most prestigious private school in the city, its name notwithstanding; the "charter" refers to the document William Penn issued in 1689 establishing it) a couple of years ago, I think with the idea that I might pursue teaching as a side activity there.

He said this to me over breakfast: "There is a lot of waste in the School District budget. And the schools do not get the funding they need to do their job. I usually say the second sentence first."

In other words, even if you cut out all the waste, the schools still wouldn't be adequately funded.
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Old 09-12-2018, 05:27 AM
 
Location: New York City
1,371 posts, read 781,463 times
Reputation: 2125
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl View Post
My landlord introduced me to the headmaster of Wiliam Penn Charter School (the oldest and perhaps most prestigious private school in the city, its name notwithstanding; the "charter" refers to the document William Penn issued in 1689 establishing it) a couple of years ago, I think with the idea that I might pursue teaching as a side activity there.

He said this to me over breakfast: "There is a lot of waste in the School District budget. And the schools do not get the funding they need to do their job. I usually say the second sentence first."

In other words, even if you cut out all the waste, the schools still wouldn't be adequately funded.
That is because the bureaucracy at 440 lives in luxury with the best of everything, while the rest of us can't even get money for basic school supplies or air conditioning. I was shocked to see how nice the headquarters of a strapped school district looked like when half the school buildings are falling apart. So yes, it is top heavy at 440, but that doesn't equate for any, or most, of the financial problem.

PA has the most inequitable school funding "formula" of any state in the US. It is currently being challenged in court and hopefully they rule it unconstitutional. Poor school districts like Philadelphia that need support the most get screwed while places like Lower Merion who need it the least get the most benefit.
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Old 09-12-2018, 06:19 AM
 
Location: Kennett Square, PA
1,782 posts, read 2,752,720 times
Reputation: 2898
I speak as an "outsider" (suburbanite); I can't speak to the state of affairs in Philly schools. What I do know is they must be screaming for teachers. I have my resume on Indeed.com for P-T teaching positions. In the past two months, I have been inundated by "consulting" firms who advertise for a variety of teaching jobs in, according to their advertisements, "Aston, Ridley Park, Malvern, Eddystone" and others. Now I peruse Delco School websites continually. I know what that job market is. I wanted to get to the bottom of these false ads and was finally connected to someone in Georgia who told me that locations were not "exact," but in the "general area." I finally got them to admit that the jobs were in Philly. Things must be bad indeed (no pun intended) if the hiring process is tainted.
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