LOL, I think I revert to a 12 year old. Philly's newest police commisioner (Chester: real estate, rent)

[ActualUDResident]

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

The head of FOP Lodge 5 has also made positive remarks about her. So has the head of the Guardian Civic League.

It may not be that bad, then, though frankly, statements that have issued from John McNesby in both the recent and distant past cause me to discount him as a gauge of what good policing or police-community relations should be. In fact, the very existence of the Guardian Civic League tells me that there are still some internal issues with police attitudes that maybe Outlaw might be the right person to address. You did see the stories about the emails that have been uncovered, no?

As for the Portland Police Bureau taking a "hands off" approach to Antifa protests, this report of an interview Outlaw gave to a conservative talk show host in Portland suggests to me that those claims are baseless:

Portland Police Chief Says Protesters Went Off to "Whine and Complain" Last Week Because Police Officers "Kicked Your Butt" | Willamette Week

The description of the skirmish in question suggests to me that Antifa in Portland went looking for a fight, and the Portland Police Bureau gave them one.

Philadelphia's Antifa appears less belligerent than that, judging from the way the Philadelphia Police Department handled their protests here last year. Outlaw shouldn't have much trouble handling that.

As far as the serious problem, what 1ondoner said.

But I'd like to add something else: Back in the late 19th century, famed newspaper columnist Finley Peter Dunne (who wrote in the guise of an Irish bartender named "Mr. Dooley") said that "cops and criminals come from the same class." And given that both the cops and most of the people committing crime were poorer Irish immigrants, his statement was true. We would probably do a better job of combating crime were we to follow that practice now rather than hire cops who regard the people they are supposed to protect and serve as animals (which some of those cops do - and which McNesby may as well, given the thrust of some of his recent statements).

Not just the police force.

How often do we see actual community leaders quoted during articles about violence and how to combat it? Almost never.

Instead we often see some academic type who has somehow become an expert on urban violence despite being largely sheltered from it his or her entire life.

The media and mainstream society as a whole has always portrayed urban violence as a black and brown problem but the difference is their ignoring it or not going into depth about it in the past at least allowed the members of the communities to have their platform in their own alternative spaces and their own media.

Why should anybody expect the police to show respect to these communities when nobody else involved with shaping and discussing these policies seems to?

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by Pilot1

This will NOT end well.

Like Ross' tenure ended well. And I said a million times he was a terrible, just absolutely horrible, commish. The best commissioners have come from outside the PPD.

[eliza61nyc]

Originally Posted by kyb01

Like Ross' tenure ended well. And I said a million times he was a terrible, just absolutely horrible, commish. The best commissioners have come from outside the PPD.

100% agree.

I would not put anyone inside of the Philadelphia police department in control of the crossing guard unit

[Patmcpsu]

Originally Posted by KansastoSouthphilly

I keep seeing this "hands off" claim mentioned over and over but can't find any source for it outside of right wing message boards and opinion columns.

The claims have been denied:

https://www.wweek.com/news/courts/20...d-at-protests/

Are there any credible sources to back up the belief that Outlaw had a "hands off" approach to violent Antifa protesters? Please let me know if you are aware of any.

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

As for the Portland Police Bureau taking a "hands off" approach to Antifa protests, this report of an interview Outlaw gave to a conservative talk show host in Portland suggests to me that those claims are baseless:

Portland Police Chief Says Protesters Went Off to "Whine and Complain" Last Week Because Police Officers "Kicked Your Butt" | Willamette Week

The description of the skirmish in question suggests to me that Antifa in Portland went looking for a fight, and the Portland Police Bureau gave them one.

I don't put much value in any denials or back-patting she gave herself. Of course they would say what they said.

That being said, I did spend time watching youtube videos as objectively as I could, and it is untrue to say that the cops were completely hands-off, they were only partially hands-off and probably doing typical crowd control tactics: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yT9bit2-1pg

When watching the below videos, the first response I had was "where are the cops"? There are large groups of people being as conspicuous as possible, on a day that riots were expected, and a situation obviously about to occur, and no cops are present. Without fail though, cops tend to arrive a couple minutes later to break it up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...ature=emb_logo
https://youtu.be/nSQrM3R-0HA (in this video, you can hear people saying that they have two minutes until the cops arrive)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WzMZxT-41k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJLylzPRvyw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwRY...ature=youtu.be


So yes, the cops did their job by showing up a few minutes after violence began, but I won't call it good police work. Of the five videos, cops should have been there proactively in the first three, as a situation was obviously about to develop.

Again though, the cops are outnumbered in situations like these, and they can't be everywhere at once. They do deserve the benefit of the doubt, but there are legitimate criticisms.

[KoNgFooCj]

Originally Posted by Gerania

Nothing, but ha ha ha, Outlaw. You don't find this even mildly amusing?

I definitely would've found her last name ironically amusing if as soon as I learned of her appointment, I didn't see her last name being used as the butt end of many nasty jokes and accusations against her made by people who didn't even know she existed the day before and possibly have some racist tendencies.

[ActualUDResident]

Originally Posted by Aussiehoff

Why wouldn't you care about those things when they are the two primary indicators of how she will attempt to deal with what you are concerned about??

Because they are two very different cities.

Racism is a real problem in Oregon. That state is mostly white and largely rural, and those dynamics play out in Portland. With nowhere near the level of crime or violence as Philadelphia, it was easy for racism and partisan losers fighting each other with homemade weapons like six year olds playing pirates to be the focus.

If she repeats that in Philadelphia, she'll have people trying to run her out of the city. Nobody wants Antifa here, and the people cheering her hiring because they feel she's a voice for reform will eventually turn on her if she doesn't actually make sweeping changes. People have no tolerance for empty words when so much is at stake.

[bursitis]

Originally Posted by ActualUDResident

Racism is a real problem in Oregon. That state is mostly white and largely rural, and those dynamics play out in Portland. With nowhere near the level of crime or violence as Philadelphia, it was easy for racism and partisan losers fighting each other with homemade weapons like six year olds playing pirates to be the focus.

How do you know racism is a real problem in Oregon?


How long have you lived there?


I've always heard that the different types of people there get along well.

[Aussiehoff]

Originally Posted by ActualUDResident

Because they are two very different cities.

Racism is a real problem in Oregon. That state is mostly white and largely rural, and those dynamics play out in Portland. With nowhere near the level of crime or violence as Philadelphia, it was easy for racism and partisan losers fighting each other with homemade weapons like six year olds playing pirates to be the focus.

If she repeats that in Philadelphia, she'll have people trying to run her out of the city. Nobody wants Antifa here, and the people cheering her hiring because they feel she's a voice for reform will eventually turn on her if she doesn't actually make sweeping changes. People have no tolerance for empty words when so much is at stake.

Sure, two different cities, but the same commissioner. A commissioner with a very clear track record. Just a hunch on my part, but I don't think she will view her appointment to this role as a repudiation of her methods and philosophy.

[FKD19124]

I think anti semitism is a bigger problem.

The media is hyping up the narrative about white

Supremacy .

Originally Posted by FindingZen

Interesting that there is concern about Antifa violence when they would not exist if not for the violence to which they formed as a response.

White supremacist violence is indeed growing here in Philly. They're also pursuing more insidious tactics like attempting to get on the Abington School Board. Hopefully Chief Outlaw will take her experience in Portland with supremacist violence and head off potential skirmishes that such types may instigate here.

[FindingZen]

Originally Posted by bursitis

How do you know racism is a real problem in Oregon?

It is. Oregon had laws near its founding that made it a crime for Black people to live there.

Today's racism is not just the seasonal gatherings of White supremacists (who aren't necessarily all Oregonians) to goad anti-fascists into a fight. It also comes in the form of everyday micro-aggressions. And of course, as Portland becomes more expensive, the disproportionately poor among Black residents are forced out of their traditional neighborhoods.

How long have you lived there?

Never. But I know locals there (who happen to be White) that can co-sign on the above.

I've always heard that the different types of people there get along well.

Perhaps on the surface...but despite its progressive pedigree, Portland is not the racial utopia one might assume.