When will Philadelphia start GAINING population? (Bath: house, top schools, wage)

[btownboss4]

Originally Posted by NJ987654

Honestly and bluntly... when you can walk the streets at any hour without getting shot at.

if that were true then 1.5 milllion people wouldn't have stayed in Philly.

[DarkWolf]

If Philly were to fastrak Restoring the Septa Trollies and Expanding the system , then I can guarantee you'll see a building boom. Developers love Rail based Transit , its fixed in place , hard to remove and more attractive. Hench why Redevelopment isolated or only along Rail lines.... Developers and buyers alike need to be assured that there will always be a fixed line to be transported on. Rail also works better in the winter then buses...

[pman]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

If Philly were to fastrak Restoring the Septa Trollies and Expanding the system , then I can guarantee you'll see a building boom. Developers love Rail based Transit , its fixed in place , hard to remove and more attractive. Hench why Redevelopment isolated or only along Rail lines.... Developers and buyers alike need to be assured that there will always be a fixed line to be transported on. Rail also works better in the winter then buses...

then why isn't haddington booming?

[PennKid]

Originally Posted by rotodome

Shouldn't this old thread have been rendered moot since the latest census came out and showed that Philly DID start growing? Reality has answered the original question.

I guess now it's just a repository for ranting?

Thank you for pointing out that Philadelphia actually DID gain population in 2000-2010.

In 2000 the population was 1,517,550. In 2010 the population was 1,526,006.

The growth was fueled mostly by immigrants, with the largest groups being Vietnamese (settling mostly in South Philly), Chinese (settling mostly in the lower Northeast), Mexican (settling mostly in South Philly), Arab (settling mostly in the lower Northeast) and Sub-Saharan African (mostly in Southwest Philly).

The city's black population is just about stable, as most of the inner-ring suburbs are either too wealthy for most of the group to afford (Lower Merion, Cheltenham), or are buffered by large white areas (most of the Northeast, Northwest). Only a small trickle has headed out to Delaware County this last decade, mostly to Upper Darby and Lansdowne.

The city's white population is stable in numbers, but actually saw both a sizeable departure of whites from certain working-class neighborhoods on the fringes of larger, poorer, more heavily minority areas (Oxford Circle, Elmwood), as well as a tremendous influx of rather educated and affluent whites in gentrifying neighborhoods (Northern Liberties, Southwest Center City, Newbold, Cedar Park, etc).

[kidphilly]

A good link on growth rates and demograohics by neighborhood with changes from 2000 to 2010




The 2010 Census | Philly

[DarkWolf]

Originally Posted by pman

then why isn't haddington booming?

It also depends on what the neighborhood wants , and if the Neighborhood is stable and decent looking developers will bypass it. A Trolley line down Vine Street would do the trick....you need to have alot of Rail lines in a city like Philly to jump start growth....

[Jerseykids2011]

The Philadelphia Public School system itself has been a direct factor for many, many family's departure from that city. The Schools are HORRIBLE:

"The state released the list, which differed from the version the District published from the state, Kristen Graham of the Inquirer reported. Gratz and Audenriend High Schools are on the complete state list.

The Pennsylvania Department of Education released its persistently dangerous schools list for 2011-2012.

“Persistently Dangerous School” shall mean any public elementary, secondary, or charter school that meets any of the following criteria in the most recent school year and in one additional year of the two years prior to the most recent school year:
(1) for a school whose enrollment is 250 or less, at least 5 dangerous incidents;
(2) for a school whose enrollment is between 251 to 1000, a number of dangerous incidents that represents at least 2% of the school’s enrollment; or
(3) for a school whose enrollment is over 1000, 20 or more dangerous incidents.

“Safe Public School” shall mean a public school that has not been designated as a persistently dangerous school under these standards.
http://www.governor.state.pa.us/portal/server.pt/community/regulations___standards/7504/approved_standards_for_persistently_dangerous_scho ols

The District schools on the persistently dangerous schools list for 2011-12 include:

Audenried High School

Edison High School

Fels High School

Frankford High School

Gratz High School

Kensington Business High School

Lincoln High School

Northeast High School

Sayre High School

Shaw Middle School

South Philadelphia High School

Strawberry Mansion High School

Last fall, the District announced a "Focus 46" strategy to address school violence, with a goal of reducing the number of persistently dangerous schools to zero within two years.

see also:
http://www.governor.state.pa.us/portal/server.pt/community/unsafe_school_choice_option/7417/persistently_dangerous_schools/508690



Anyone who loved their children would be less a parent to send them to a Philadelphia Public School.

[pman]

Originally Posted by PennKid

Thank you for pointing out that Philadelphia actually DID gain population in 2000-2010.

In 2000 the population was 1,517,550. In 2010 the population was 1,526,006.

The growth was fueled mostly by immigrants, with the largest groups being Vietnamese (settling mostly in South Philly), Chinese (settling mostly in the lower Northeast), Mexican (settling mostly in South Philly), Arab (settling mostly in the lower Northeast) and Sub-Saharan African (mostly in Southwest Philly).

The city's black population is just about stable, as most of the inner-ring suburbs are either too wealthy for most of the group to afford (Lower Merion, Cheltenham), or are buffered by large white areas (most of the Northeast, Northwest). Only a small trickle has headed out to Delaware County this last decade, mostly to Upper Darby and Lansdowne.

The city's white population is stable in numbers, but actually saw both a sizeable departure of whites from certain working-class neighborhoods on the fringes of larger, poorer, more heavily minority areas (Oxford Circle, Elmwood), as well as a tremendous influx of rather educated and affluent whites in gentrifying neighborhoods (Northern Liberties, Southwest Center City, Newbold, Cedar Park, etc).

actually, puerto ricans were are a large factor in hispanic growth.

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

It also depends on what the neighborhood wants , and if the Neighborhood is stable and decent looking developers will bypass it. A Trolley line down Vine Street would do the trick....you need to have alot of Rail lines in a city like Philly to jump start growth....

the city needs to encourage growth along existing lines before laying down scratch for trains where buses run. Aleast generally speaking. things like improved headways, lower off peak pricing for city regional rail lines, etc could go a long way to leveraging the infrastructure better

[PennKid]

Originally Posted by Jerseykids2011

The Philadelphia Public School system itself has been a direct factor for many, many family's departure from that city. The Schools are HORRIBLE:

"The state released the list, which differed from the version the District published from the state, Kristen Graham of the Inquirer reported. Gratz and Audenriend High Schools are on the complete state list.

The Pennsylvania Department of Education released its persistently dangerous schools list for 2011-2012.

“Persistently Dangerous School” shall mean any public elementary, secondary, or charter school that meets any of the following criteria in the most recent school year and in one additional year of the two years prior to the most recent school year:
(1) for a school whose enrollment is 250 or less, at least 5 dangerous incidents;
(2) for a school whose enrollment is between 251 to 1000, a number of dangerous incidents that represents at least 2% of the school’s enrollment; or
(3) for a school whose enrollment is over 1000, 20 or more dangerous incidents.

“Safe Public School” shall mean a public school that has not been designated as a persistently dangerous school under these standards.
http://www.governor.state.pa.us/portal/server.pt/community/regulations___standards/7504/approved_standards_for_persistently_dangerous_scho ols

The District schools on the persistently dangerous schools list for 2011-12 include:

Audenried High School

Edison High School

Fels High School

Frankford High School

Gratz High School

Kensington Business High School

Lincoln High School

Northeast High School

Sayre High School

Shaw Middle School

South Philadelphia High School

Strawberry Mansion High School

Last fall, the District announced a "Focus 46" strategy to address school violence, with a goal of reducing the number of persistently dangerous schools to zero within two years.

see also:
http://www.governor.state.pa.us/portal/server.pt/community/unsafe_school_choice_option/7417/persistently_dangerous_schools/508690



Anyone who loved their children would be less a parent to send them to a Philadelphia Public School.

I will agree that all but 1 of those schools are legitimately crappy, but I will defend Northeast as a good option (with a particularly high-ranking magnet program). My reasoning is as follows:

So why is Northeast on the list in the first place? Because it had 21 arrests made during the 2010-2011 school year. Does that seem like a bad thing to you to have that many arrests? Well it shouldn't, for the following reasons:

Most obviously, it means that the school has stepped up enforcement. According to the principal, the majority of the arrests were of students who were caught with weapons during the metal detector check. So it's a good thing that there were 21 arrests, and not only 19, like last year- that would have meant two extra students getting into the school with guns, right?

So the school seems to be punished for crime prevention. But even worse is the fact that the Persistently Dangerous status is applied based on whether a school has 20+ arrests, no matter what their size, which means that a school with a huge student body like Northeast gets punished twice. Even worse is the fact that this status was applied even though the number of violent crimes at the school actually went down last year, from 52 in 09-10 to 49 in 10-11. 49 violent incidents may seem like a lot, but 49 violent incidents per 3300 students is a rate that not only makes Northeast one of the safest high schools in the district (not too much worse than the renowned magnets), but about the same as many suburban schools (such as Cherry Hill West).

I'm pissed off that the mandatory safety reporting uses this one-size-fits-all criteria. I think that anyone who cares about Northeast can see the major strides it's made recently to restore credibility, and to re-apply this status because of a single, selective, immutable statistic can drive away the parents who have been convinced that NEast is a decent school again...

Finally, while NEast and GW may be the only tolerable neighborhood high schools, Philadelphia has a long, long list of charter and magnet options- Central, Masterman, Bodine, Prep Charter, Science Leadership, Constitution... the list goes on. Sending your kids to Philadelphia public high school (like my parents did) DOES NOT MAKE THEM LESSER PARENTS

[Jerseykids2011]

"Sending your kids to Philadelphia public high school (like my parents did) DOES NOT MAKE THEM LESSER PARENTS "
I can only imagine that, when your parents were sent to Philadelphia Public Schools by your grandparents, that the schoools were a great deal better and more civilized than what they are now.