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I've got to say this east-valley-vs-west-valley is way over played....
Yes, I agree, and I don't know why some in this thread started an East/West battle when all I did was point out factual information (pro's/con's) for both locations.
Would it be a factual statement to say that there is at least 5-10 times more *quality* employment within a 10 mile radius of Ahwatukee as opposed to Litchfield Park? You know the answer, but does that mean there is "Absolutely NO employment in the entire West valley"?. No. Let's not get carried away.
For what it's worth, every factual statement I posted about LP in relation to Ahwatukee is true if you substitute Chandler (the part of Chandler where I live) for LP. Chandler is further from the employment (ahwatukee is centrally located, let's not argue this), Chandler has less shopping and dining options within 5 miles, Chandler Unified is rated below Kyrene, and Chandler is newer and shinier, and has a slightly slower pace with less congestion. Chandler Unified and Litchfield Park districts rate similarly, with Chandler Unified only a couple spots higher (negligible difference), but the Kyrene District rates MUCH higher, and everyone here in Chandler is cognizant of that. You just choose where you live based on your own criteria. The schools here are "good enough", we don't eat out a ton, I don't need to commute to employment, so that isn't a factor. Chandler has better youth sports than Ahwatukee, is still close to everything, and has nicer neighborhoods, so that's why I chose it. The same may be true about LP, but it doesn't change the facts that I was called out as being false.
Not sure what is wrong with pointing out the differences, when that is what the OP was looking for. I really wasn't choosing one over the other, just pointing out the objective differences. And I certainly wasn't starting an East VS. West flame war.
Would it be a factual statement to say that there is at least 5-10 times more *quality* employment within a 10 mile radius of Ahwatukee as opposed to Litchfield Park?
Only when one considers how much larger Ahwatukee is to Litchfield Park. LP is 3.1 square miles, while Ahwatukee is 35.8 square miles. Take that factor out, and they are likely even. Or, if anything, LP comes out ahead because of it's proximity to Luke AFB and the quality jobs associated.
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every factual statement I posted about LP in relation to Ahwatukee is true
What factual statements? I'm still waiting for them....
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You know the answer
Thanks, I knew you'd see it my way.
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but it doesn't change the facts that I was called out as being false.
Again, what facts? All you said was a bunch of hot air about no-life-in-the-west-valley and that Kyrene school district is the best. But you ignore (both here and in prior threads) the great schools and school districts elsewhere. Look at the list of "excelling" schools I posted earlier. No, really, open the link and look. There are literally hundreds of "excelling" schools in the Phoenix area that are not in the Kyrene district. That's nothing against Kyrene, which is a great school district. But it does demonstrate that there are many, many, many, many, many other options--including on the west side--for great schools and districts, and that Kyrene isn't the be-all, end-all of school districts (like you make it out to be).
Thanks for your insights. I feel like I'm leaning more towards Ahwatukee due to all the amenitites nearby. There are a few houses that I am interested in that are located in Litchfield Park, but apparently they aren't "in the walls". What's that all about anyway? What is bad about being outside of the "walls"?
Nothing wrong outside the walls. They just add an aura of exclusivity for the people who live within the walls. There are no bad areas of Litchfield Park.
For what it's worth, every factual statement I posted about LP in relation to Ahwatukee is true if you substitute Chandler (the part of Chandler where I live) for LP. Chandler is further from the employment (ahwatukee is centrally located, let's not argue this), Chandler has less shopping and dining options within 5 miles, Chandler Unified is rated below Kyrene, and Chandler is newer and shinier, and has a slightly slower pace with less congestion. Chandler Unified and Litchfield Park districts rate similarly, with Chandler Unified only a couple spots higher (negligible difference), but the Kyrene District rates MUCH higher, and everyone here in Chandler is cognizant of that. You just choose where you live based on your own criteria. The schools here are "good enough", we don't eat out a ton, I don't need to commute to employment, so that isn't a factor. Chandler has better youth sports than Ahwatukee, is still close to everything, and has nicer neighborhoods, so that's why I chose it. The same may be true about LP, but it doesn't change the facts that I was called out as being false.
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From greatschools.com:
"Chandler's Santan Elementary School serves grades K-6 in the Chandler Unified District. It is among the few public elementary schools in Arizona to receive a distinguished GreatSchools Rating of 10 out of 10."
School just happens to be 1mi from me so I looked it up (moot since I homeschool, lol). Just wanted to point out that if you get serious about looking at schools in an area, you need to look at the specific schools rather than just the prestige of the district. That said, Kyrene is regarded very highly. But if LP and Ahwa. are both good districts, might be better to move on to research individual schools in each district.
I'm a proponent of scoping out an area by shopping the local stores (esp places you'd likely shop) to people watch. If schools are a top priority, could do the same there -- drive by them, maybe even park across and watch the kiddos file in or out (just don't do that too much lest you get in trouble, lol). If you get really serious, make an appt to visit with the principal or get a tour of the school.
From greatschools.com:
"Chandler's Santan Elementary School serves grades K-6 in the Chandler Unified District. It is among the few public elementary schools in Arizona to receive a distinguished GreatSchools Rating of 10 out of 10."
School just happens to be 1mi from me so I looked it up (moot since I homeschool, lol). Just wanted to point out that if you get serious about looking at schools in an area, you need to look at the specific schools rather than just the prestige of the district. That said, Kyrene is regarded very highly. But if LP and Ahwa. are both good districts, might be better to move on to research individual schools in each district.
I'm a proponent of scoping out an area by shopping the local stores (esp places you'd likely shop) to people watch. If schools are a top priority, could do the same there -- drive by them, maybe even park across and watch the kiddos file in or out (just don't do that too much lest you get in trouble, lol). If you get really serious, make an appt to visit with the principal or get a tour of the school.
Definitely agree on focusing on individual schools and not districts, cities, states etc. Aggregated statistics are not particularly applicable. Greatschools and the state rating systems rely mostly on test scores. While test scores are an important indicator, other things might matter to parents as well. For example, does the school have an arts program, field trips, participate in things like Science Olympiad and Math counts programs, discipline issues, teacher/parent/administration relations, school security, advanced classes, online access to teachers and homework reports, level of assistance for slower learners, how much money does the community donate to the school (very important source of funding in AZ) and a host of others. These things can vary widely from school to school within a district, particularly in the rapidly growing rural/urbanizing districts where the demographics as so complex.
I don't know anything about LP but a lot about Ahwatukee, as I have an apartment in the area. The 202 route will be along the present Pecos road. Studies have shown that the carcinogens of the soot and other pollutants from freeways linger up to a mile from the freeway. So if you are worried about the effects of freeways, live more than one mile west of the north/south leg of I-10 and one mile north of the 202 extension.
The mountain views are nice in Ahwatukee. I am fortunate to have a mountain view from my living room window.
Schools - I have no kids so I cannot rate them. If I did, I'd have them in private schools and make sure my wife or myself would be a stay-at-home parent at least until the youngest kid gets into school.
Family-oriented. I guess. When I was younger I was bored by being in a family-oriented community. But I have a car anyway. It does not matter.
Crime: Ahwatukee had occasional issues, but nothing out of the ordinary. Support your local police! I live in a gated community anyway, but don't pay through the nose for it. I had no problems so far in the last five years. And I am a proud responsible gun owner. I respect the quiet of Ahwatukee and desire of my neighbors for a stable community because I want the same from them.
I know nothing about Litchfield Park, but have lived in Ahwatukee for a year. We absolutely love it. For us, it was between Scottsdale and Ahwatukee. The decision ended up coming down to a choice between 2 houses and we liked the house in Ahwatukee better. We're renting, so house prices weren't a factor for us.
What are the things that are important to you:
-schools?
-neighborhood feel?
-kids in the neighborhood?
-restaurants?
-stores close by?
-lots of property?
Here's what we like about Ahwatukee:
1)Convenience - we live near the intersection of Ray Rd and 33rd St. Almost every store you can think of is between where we live and the 10. I really love that. It takes me 7 minutes to get to the 10, including missing some lights. So almost every store I need is within 7 minutes of my house. The only exceptions I can think of are Walmart and a major mall with department stores. And those are only another 5 minutes or so away. I never lived so close to things and it's one of those small things that I wasn't even that concerned about, but which makes daily life really nice. I can get to a Fry's in 2 minutes - that's a really nice convenience.
2)We love the schools. My kids have had great teachers, and everyone at the school is friendly and helpful. Right after we decided on Ahwatukee, I had a little buyer's remorse, because I saw that the scores were slightly higher on the standardized tests in Scottsdale. I don't know if there's a way to really figure out which schools will be better, unless you have some specific requirement, like special ed.
One thing to know about Ahwatukee schools is that they are neighborhood schools, so all the kids in your kids' classes will live nearby. We like that. Also, all my kids are in the same school, which is nice. If you want to do research on scores, etc, the 2 web sites I found most useful were schooldigger.com and greatschools.org.
3)Neighborhood feel - we love the neighborhood we're in. My wife was all freaked out when we first moved in, because none of the neighbors came over and welcomed us. We're from NY, and when we bought our house in NY, many of the neighbors came over when we moved in. Here, we eventually met everyone, and at Christmas time, a few neighbors even came by with food. In the end, the people were all very friendly. One big difference though, at least compared to our neighborhood in NY, is that the kids don't play out in the street. In NY, the houses all had big front lawns, and we lived on a really quiet street, so the kids were all running all over the neighborhood. We tried to find that here, but we had a time limit, and we never found it in time. It's fine though. We just have play dates and kids come over and play in our pool. If I were looking again though, and I had time, I would try some more creative ways of finding out how many kids there are in a neighborhood. We drove through the neighborhoods, but it was during summer, so not many people were out. This might sound a little crazy, but if having a lot of kids in the neighborhood is important to you, and you can wait until after school starts, I would try following the school bus and seeing where lots of kids get off. Don't get yourself arrested :-) I couldn't figure out any other way to find out how many kids there were. You could try asking people in the neighborhood, but what I found is that people tend to only know about the kids who live very close to them, and kids the same ages as their own.
lots of property
Having a big back yard was on our list, but in the end we settled for less. Don't assume that all houses in a given neighborhood have the same size lots. Our back yard is almost all pool, but we have friends who live pretty close to us who have a big pool, and also a huge grassy yard next to it.
restaurants:
I've found plenty of good places in Ahwatukee. People say there are a lot more good restaurants in Scottsdale, and I'm sure there are, but I've found lots of great places in Ahwatukee and Tempe.
I hope some of this helps. Good luck with your decision, and feel free to contact me if you have any questions about Ahwatukee. And take advantage of this forum. There are many very knowledgable people on here. I was on here like crazy before we moved, and it was a huge help in making all the decisions we had to make. I've been so busy, I haven't been on here in months, but I just came on today to look up an old question I asked, that I got great feedback on.
I don't understand all the negative posts on Litchfield Park. I've never been there, and don't even live in Arizona (unfortunately) but how can a place so beautiful be bad? I've been trying to decide between moving to Houston or Phoenix (Scottsdale was my first choice) and if I picked Phoenix I would probably seriously consider LP instead of Scottsdale. BTW, is it true that the W Valley is a little more lush than the E Valley? Whenever I come out there I'm always in the E Valley so IDK but it looks that way in the pics and google earth maps I've seen.
I don't understand all the negative posts on Litchfield Park. I've never been there, and don't even live in Arizona (unfortunately) but how can a place so beautiful be bad? I've been trying to decide between moving to Houston or Phoenix (Scottsdale was my first choice) and if I picked Phoenix I would probably seriously consider LP instead of Scottsdale. BTW, is it true that the W Valley is a little more lush than the E Valley? Whenever I come out there I'm always in the E Valley so IDK but it looks that way in the pics and google earth maps I've seen.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with Litchfield Park. Nothing at all. In a comparison of LP and Scottsdale, the first thing that comes to mind to me is that most everything is more expensive in Scottsdale, from gas to housing. It's a lovely city, but you get more "bang for your buck" in any other area of Maricopa County. I also love Scottsdale, just not the higher cost of living. I don't think everyone in Scottsdale is a snob.
I also don't think the west valley is more lush or attractive than the east valley. It's a matter of personal preference. I happen to prefer the east valley. That's just my preference, and I'm sure you'll have many people advocating for the other side of the valley.
I don't understand all the negative posts on Litchfield Park. I've never been there, and don't even live in Arizona (unfortunately) but how can a place so beautiful be bad? I've been trying to decide between moving to Houston or Phoenix (Scottsdale was my first choice) and if I picked Phoenix I would probably seriously consider LP instead of Scottsdale. BTW, is it true that the W Valley is a little more lush than the E Valley? Whenever I come out there I'm always in the E Valley so IDK but it looks that way in the pics and google earth maps I've seen.
The natural desert in the far east and northeast areas is more lush due to more rain. It starts getting pretty sparse out by Buckeye compared to Fountain Hills. As for the city scape, there is a trend over the recent years for more and more landscaping of shopping areas, streets, and even homes. So if you are comparing a recent development to one from the 80/90's you are going to see more lush stuff like tree-lined boulevards along streets, many trees in islands in parking lots, heavily landscaped retention areas in subdivisions, etc. But both sides have newer malls and subdivisions, so I think it all depends on the specific area that you are looking at rather than the vague east or west.
Litchfield Park inside the walls is older and from a time when no one paid much attention to water conservation so the place is LUSH. The same thing can be found in parts of Tempe and Phoenix where they use flood irrigation. With the emphasis on water today, newer landscaping is mostly water sparing shrubs and trees which look lush to me but maybe not someone from the humid regions.
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