Buying a house - requesting credit at closing in lieu of repairs (Phoenix: tile, FSBO)

[starla]

Originally Posted by Zippyman

There's nothing dirty about asking for what you want, the dirty part is agreeing on a price, getting the property under contract & using that leverage to extract concessions unrelated to necessary repairs. "I can renegotiate anything I want at any time" isn't the /intent/ of the inspection contingency. Your offer wouldn't have been accepted by any sane seller if they knew the attitude you had going in. The intent of the purchase agreement is to bind both parties in good faith & prevent the attitude that "buyers can walk anytime they want, for no reason". Buyers with that attitude are likely to walk away /without/ their earnest money if they aren't actually "earnest" in their dealings with sellers if the seller's agent is doing their job. The only weak link in that system is brokers who don't want to anger potential "buyers" by taking away their cheese (earnest money) for playing games with sellers. Time *is* money to a seller & taking a property off the market for inspection is getting something of value from a seller without paying for it if you don't fully intend to perform.

My attitude towards AAR forms & contract provisions *isn't* that of a brainwashed minion who's scared of his own shadow - I've actually met at least one of the people who hashed out the wording on the AAR document & frankly, I "pity the foo" who tries to improvise a "better" provision/clause/addendum that fairly represents both sides of the transaction.

The concessions are DIRECTLY related to necessary repairs. I don't know where you're getting the idea they aren't.

[SMG]

Starla- My only concern on this is that the lender may not want to lend on a home where you are choosing concessions over repairs. Remember, that property is the lenders and not yours. You have an interest. I understand that you are getting up to 6%. They still might choose to have the property repaired, as opposed to getting a property in disrepair and having you get concessions.

[starla]

Originally Posted by SMG

Starla- My only concern on this is that the lender may not want to lend on a home where you are choosing concessions over repairs. Remember, that property is the lenders and not yours. You have an interest. I understand that you are getting up to 6%. They still might choose to have the property repaired, as opposed to getting a property in disrepair and having you get concessions.

Yeah, I understand that concern. But my realtor isn't concerned about that. If that was his concern we can just call the processor and verify in advance that they're ok with a credit at close for roof repairs. He was saying we had to give the seller the option of performing the repairs himself. I don't want to give that option on major repairs because the seller will probably hire the cheapest contractor to do the job, and that person will cut corners because they figure by the time anyone finds out it will be years down the road. That's pretty much what happened on my last purchase, but instead of cutting corners on some foundation work, the contractor just didn't do the work (about $2k worth of work). The seller gave me receipts showing the work had been done. I only found out because I had a reinspection done on the walkthrough. I don't think the seller knew the work wasn't done, I think the seller picked the lowest bid and the contractor thought they could get away with just not doing the work. An inspector isn't going to be able to remove all the tiles off the roof to make sure the underlayment is done to spec. He could maybe spot check a few places at best.

Anyway, my realtor wrote up the form and its STILL giving the option of the seller doing the repairs. So we're going back around in circles.

[Zippyman]

Originally Posted by starla

The concessions are DIRECTLY related to necessary repairs. I don't know where you're getting the idea they aren't.

Your "roof inspector" claiming that "if it isn't leaking now, it will start next time it rains hard". That's an unsupportable statement. It's either leaking or it isn't & if you're in the business of "inspecting roofs" you ought to have the expertise to say if it is or is /not/ leaking - or you're not much of an expert. did your "expert" even look at the roof, or did he make that statement from the driveway? Someone who owned the house & got an assessment like that would ask more questions, not take it as gospel.

I have a neighbor who was told by a roofer that she "needed" new tar paper under her tile roof 20 years ago. Evidently, she didn't "need" it that badly, because it still isn't leaking.

The use of a questionable "expert", and an insistence on cash vs. an actual repair, combined with your attitude that "I can renegotiate whatever I want, whenever I want" gives the the "idea" that you're using the inspection as an opportunity to get another bite at the apple. Are you really intending on hiring someone the day after closing to "fix" that roof, or are you going to wait for actual evidence of a leak before handing over stacks of cash for repairs?

[lvmensch]

Originally Posted by Zippyman

Your "roof inspector" claiming that "if it isn't leaking now, it will start next time it rains hard". That's an unsupportable statement. It's either leaking or it isn't & if you're in the business of "inspecting roofs" you ought to have the expertise to say if it is or is /not/ leaking - or you're not much of an expert. did your "expert" even look at the roof, or did he make that statement from the driveway? Someone who owned the house & got an assessment like that would ask more questions, not take it as gospel.

I have a neighbor who was told by a roofer that she "needed" new tar paper under her tile roof 20 years ago. Evidently, she didn't "need" it that badly, because it still isn't leaking.

The use of a questionable "expert", and an insistence on cash vs. an actual repair, combined with your attitude that "I can renegotiate whatever I want, whenever I want" gives the the "idea" that you're using the inspection as an opportunity to get another bite at the apple. Are you really intending on hiring someone the day after closing to "fix" that roof, or are you going to wait for actual evidence of a leak before handing over stacks of cash for repairs?

You really are not making much of a point in this post. There is absolutely no limitation anywhere implied or stated that one cannot renegotiate price or credits on an aged roof. Perfectly reasonable and raises no direct or implied bad dealings. It is how the world works...nothing unusual. And I will generally suggest to the client to take money not repairs. You can work the repair bit if something requires it by mutually agreeing to who does the work or such. It is however generally easier to do a credit or price reduction.

I would be very careful about the bank and credits when it comes to repairs. They are not the same thing. So I would want under writer agreement that it will not cause a problem. Been down this road a couple of times with unpleasant results including having to find a new lender after an outrageous underwriter blockage...so caution.

[Dangerous Dave]

The house may not appraise at the value if the repairs aren't made before closing. Also, I'm assuming many VA loans get made in the area, so I'm sure it's SOP to get the repairs done and not the credit.

[lvmensch]

Originally Posted by Dangerous Dave

The house may not appraise at the value if the repairs aren't made before closing. Also, I'm assuming many VA loans get made in the area, so I'm sure it's SOP to get the repairs done and not the credit.

Very unlikely any appraiser is going to pick up on an aged roof unless it is actively showing damage or leakage. Outside their competence.

[AZ_Rookie]

OP, why don't you ask seller for roof repair and request that the roofer is of your choosing...

Your roof is fixed, you are confident with the repairs - house is sold, the end.

I read the thread - the biggest concern is shoddy work on repairing a (questionably) damaged roof... Seems like your going at it in a difficult manner. If you really want the roof fixed with confidence, is there a reason the suggestion above can't happen?

[starla]

Originally Posted by AZ_Rookie

OP, why don't you ask seller for roof repair and request that the roofer is of your choosing...

Your roof is fixed, you are confident with the repairs - house is sold, the end.

I read the thread - the biggest concern is shoddy work on repairing a (questionably) damaged roof... Seems like your going at it in a difficult manner. If you really want the roof fixed with confidence, is there a reason the suggestion above can't happen?

I was told that wasn't possible either. The seller has a right to use the contractor of his choosing. That would have been an acceptable solution. Preferable, even, as the roof would have been done when we moved in.

[lvmensch]

Originally Posted by starla

I was told that wasn't possible either. The seller has a right to use the contractor of his choosing. That would have been an acceptable solution. Preferable, even, as the roof would have been done when we moved in.

There is no rule that says you cannot agree with the owner on who does the work. Generally the rule would be a licensed contractor which kills all the cheap solutions. So try it. If your guys is to expensive get some competitive bids and kick in a few bucks to cover the difference. It can be worked.