Chicago-area native - thing I've noticed about downtown Phoenix (Chandler: hotel, construction)

[Finger Laker]

I'm from a small town. It's much easier to be away from people in a place like Phoenix than there.

As Chicago - really, who cares?!

I went to school in an urban city. It was fun. Definitely not where I'd want to live forever or raise a family.

Different strokes for different folks at different times

I like that Phoenix continues to improve it's urban fabric and that it still remains very accessible.

Will probably need to add more density and height from a pure urban planning stand point, however there is a lot to like here and no real reason to cherry pick it against other cities

The metro size is just outside the top 10 - your not going to have the same characteristics of a place that has double the metro population

I also really like Boise. Its downtown/urban like doesn't surpass Phoenix

[Veritas Vincit]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

I'll definitely agree on these points. The only question I have is: if somebody doesn't prefer to be around other people very much, why live in a large, sprawling metro area? Even in the suburbs/exurbs, there is still going to be some issues with traffic, crime, and dealing with people regularly. Why not live in a small town or somewhere more remote?

Jobs? I know this might seem a curious notion in this day and age of the millennial urbanite, but the massive urbanization push from rural areas into cities in the late 19th and early 20th century didn't occur because those folks wanted 'city living' and access to bars, cafes and concert venues. It happened because of rural poverty and the clustering of massive employers in big cities. Similarly the immigrants from rural Ireland, Italy and Poland didn't stick around in the cities because they loved the quirky boutiques and interesting art galleries but because those factories and docks offered jobs that put food on the table for their kids. You just have to listen to the songs they sang to know they missed the forests, meadows and rivers of their rural homelands while they were 'enjoying' the density of the crammed urban quarters they found themselves in.



Similarly today...life in a big metro area is simply the rational thing to do for a big % of people. In many ways, our colleges with their countless degrees that don't lead to a defined practical career path for most graduates push people into vague white collar careers that make a physical presence in a big metro area almost a must in order to achieve a lifestyle with middle-class amenities.

[Dangerous Dave]

It's not very difficult to see why downtown Phoenix doesn't quite measure up to the core of a large city in the eastern US that were well developed before the mass migration to the suburbs. Chicago was established in a different era where the city was built around people living and working in the city.

Phoenix, and most of Arizona in general, are just too.... new. A lot of the western US is that way, when you start working your way through the Rockies on west, very few cities offer that vibe.

I've been all over the west both living and working, and the only two cities I've been to where I could picture myself getting a condo and being able to walk and bike to everything are Denver and Portland. You could add Los Angeles and San Diego to that list if your last name is Rockefeller.

[KurtAZ]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

I'll definitely agree on these points. The only question I have is: if somebody doesn't prefer to be around other people very much, why live in a large, sprawling metro area? Even in the suburbs/exurbs, there is still going to be some issues with traffic, crime, and dealing with people regularly. Why not live in a small town or somewhere more remote?

I guess I should have clarified that point...I don't mind Chandler or pretty much any of the suburbs. Obviously from the other thread, I like DT Scottsdale. I REALLY don't like DT Phoenix and the population density...even with it not being that dense (yet). I like people as a whole...I just don't want to be living in a 5+ story building full of apartments. I don't like officing in a high-rise.

[asufan]

Originally Posted by KurtAZ

I guess I should have clarified that point...I don't mind Chandler or pretty much any of the suburbs. Obviously from the other thread, I like DT Scottsdale. I REALLY don't like DT Phoenix and the population density...even with it not being that dense (yet). I like people as a whole...I just don't want to be living in a 5+ story building full of apartments. I don't like officing in a high-rise.

You don't like to hear your neighbors flushing the toilet at 3am?

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by KurtAZ

I guess I should have clarified that point...I don't mind Chandler or pretty much any of the suburbs. Obviously from the other thread, I like DT Scottsdale. I REALLY don't like DT Phoenix and the population density...even with it not being that dense (yet). I like people as a whole...I just don't want to be living in a 5+ story building full of apartments. I don't like officing in a high-rise.

I know what you mean. Living in an apartment building probably wouldn't be anything I'd care to do either ... although I have thought about residing in a multi story condo building. I still prefer my own house with my own car, even though there are downsides to owning property.

Everybody has his/her own preferences, but in my experience, working in a centralized area has more benefits than drawbacks. Where I work in downtown Tempe can be described as a midrise, and we have secure garage parking, as well as everything pretty much within walking distance. I really don't understand what the benefit is to working in a suburban office park with open or semi covered parking, and having to drive everywhere. It certainly doesn't benefit the employees who live a considerable distance & prefer to drive less.

[Prickly Pear]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

I know what you mean. Living in an apartment building probably wouldn't be anything I'd care to do either ... although I have thought about residing in a multi story condo building. I still prefer my own house with my own car, even though there are downsides to owning property.

Everybody has his/her own preferences, but in my experience, working in a centralized area has more benefits than drawbacks. Where I work in downtown Tempe can be described as a midrise, and we have secure garage parking, as well as everything pretty much within walking distance. I really don't understand what the benefit is to working in a suburban office park with open or semi covered parking, and having to drive everywhere. It certainly doesn't benefit the employees who live a considerable distance & prefer to drive less.

It only benefits the employer. It benefits no one else, except the people who work at the employer and made this decision and now can say they cut company costs.

[KurtAZ]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

I know what you mean. Living in an apartment building probably wouldn't be anything I'd care to do either ... although I have thought about residing in a multi story condo building. I still prefer my own house with my own car, even though there are downsides to owning property.

Everybody has his/her own preferences, but in my experience, working in a centralized area has more benefits than drawbacks. Where I work in downtown Tempe can be described as a midrise, and we have secure garage parking, as well as everything pretty much within walking distance. I really don't understand what the benefit is to working in a suburban office park with open or semi covered parking, and having to drive everywhere. It certainly doesn't benefit the employees who live a considerable distance & prefer to drive less.

Fair enough...I like working from home.

[DougStark]

Whatever they do downtown, I hope they don't skimp on putting in many many shade trees. Most people can tolerate the heat as long as they're in the shade.

[AZSunDevil83]

Originally Posted by DougStark

Whatever they do downtown, I hope they don't skimp on putting in many many shade trees. Most people can tolerate the heat as long as they're in the shade.

This. The city has been doing a good job in this regard as Downtown Phoenix Inc has been replacing many of the Palo Verdes with actual shade trees (Ash, Chinese Pistache, etc). However, I still see some developers ignoring the Tree and Shade Master Plan or just choosing to go w/ crappy Palo Verdes instead.