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Mass transit is a specious argument for a downtown location. Mass transit is not an option for most people who attend sports whether it is downtown, Tempe, Glendale or where ever. The light rail (the only mass transit most would consider) is very, very limited and access is distant from most people. I would say 95% or better of people attending a Suns game drove there in their cars.
This all depends on an individual's tastes and conveniences. Sure, a person could grab a cheap, greasy "meal" at McDonalds or some other fast food place to save time ... however, if we're talking about Westgate, the time saved for many people would be erased by the long commute, as well as having to hunt around for a decent parking place. With that comes the aggravation of having the car bake out in the sun, as well as the added risk of damage & theft. Don't even count on the so called "security" to prevent those things from happening in parking lots.
Parking at Westgate is easy. I have been to 80-100 Coyotes games and have never had to hunt for parking. My car is not exposed to more sun there than anywhere else. My car has never been broken into. It is no more dangerous than parking anywhere else. Only annoyance at Westgate was starting to charge for parking of game days.
No, McDonald's is better when you have somewhere else to be because it's faster. Before a game, I'd much rather sit down to a mediocre meal at Westgate than wait an hour to get into some 200sq.ft. 20-seat gastro pub for a $22 burger in Boston. I'm trying to get something to eat in the time between leaving the office and puck drop. I'll do my fine dining experience another night. Also, there are more family-friendly places at Westgate, not to mention the kids' activities around the arena.
Have you been to Boston? Immediately outside the arena are several bars and restaurants, as well as a brand new grocery store, a new food court, and a large movie theater. It is also situated on top of a major rail and transportation hub and is within easy walking distance of both the north end and Faneuil hall.
Have you been to Boston? Immediately outside the arena are several bars and restaurants, as well as a brand new grocery store, a new food court, and a large movie theater. It is also situated on top of a major rail and transportation hub and is within easy walking distance of both the north end and Faneuil hall.
The discussion isn't about which area is nicer for a leisurely stroll on a weekend afternoon, but about which has better amenities for going to a game. Grocery stores and movie theaters are not relevant (although Westgate would win on the theater).
Have you been around North Station on a weekday game night at 6:00 when the 18,000 fans are added to the usual commuter and after-work crowd in those places? I had B's season tickets from the early '80s until a few years ago. Still went to 8 - 10 games a season after I gave them up. At the old Garden I usually drove in and parked in a little lot under the highway. Once the new building went up and nearby parking went to $40+ for games I parked at Alewife and took the T, which actually took longer and cut into the available time before puck drop. Plenty of stuff in "walking distance" if you're out for a leisurely day's adventure. But on a game night, to find something quick, decent, and reasonably priced I find Westgate preferable.
Is Mama Gina's as good as anything in the North End? Not even close. But on a game night I can go there, get a table, get some decent food at a reasonable price, and walk a few yards to the arena.
Parking at Westgate is easy. I have been to 80-100 Coyotes games and have never had to hunt for parking. My car is not exposed to more sun there than anywhere else. My car has never been broken into. It is no more dangerous than parking anywhere else. Only annoyance at Westgate was starting to charge for parking of game days.
Never had an issue with finding a spot or with security. The $15 is still better than most in-town parking, though. And many of the Westgate restaurants and stores will take it off your bill if you eat or shop there immediately before or after the game.
I only worry about the car heating up when they go deep into the playoffs in mid-June. Hahahahahahahahahaha!
The discussion isn't about which area is nicer for a leisurely stroll on a weekend afternoon, but about which has better amenities for going to a game. Grocery stores and movie theaters are not relevant (although Westgate would win on the theater).
Have you been around North Station on a weekday game night at 6:00 when the 18,000 fans are added to the usual commuter and after-work crowd in those places? I had B's season tickets from the early '80s until a few years ago. Still went to 8 - 10 games a season after I gave them up. At the old Garden I usually drove in and parked in a little lot under the highway. Once the new building went up and nearby parking went to $40+ for games I parked at Alewife and took the T, which actually took longer and cut into the available time before puck drop. Plenty of stuff in "walking distance" if you're out for a leisurely day's adventure. But on a game night, to find something quick, decent, and reasonably priced I find Westgate preferable.
Is Mama Gina's as good as anything in the North End? Not even close. But on a game night I can go there, get a table, get some decent food at a reasonable price, and walk a few yards to the arena.
Having an arena in Glendale is the equivalent of putting td garden out in foxboro next to the mall and football stadium. It’s in the middle of absolute nowhere, with no public transportation connections and poor road infrastructure, and no one in Boston or areas north is going to travel all the way down there and fight traffic to attend mid week nhl games. It makes no sense, and wouldn’t even be seriously considered.
Which is why the Coyotes need to move to Tempe. Not saying Glendale is a good location. Just saying that a Westgate-type complex near the arena is a good thing when going to a game rather than overloading already busy places nearby.
Having an arena in Glendale is the equivalent of putting td garden out in foxboro next to the mall and football stadium. It’s in the middle of absolute nowhere, with no public transportation connections and poor road infrastructure, and no one in Boston or areas north is going to travel all the way down there and fight traffic to attend mid week nhl games. It makes no sense, and wouldn’t even be seriously considered.
Middle of absolute nowhere? LOL. Anyway why is everyone saying what a bad place Glendale is for the hockey club? It is not relevant. Glendale is kicking THEM out. Glendale does not want or need them anymore. They bilked the residents of that city for millions more than they ever brought in.
I am just curious whether they can scam the citizens of Tempe to pay for a new venue or not. I figure they will end up in the real middle of absolute nowhere on one of the reservations.
Middle of absolute nowhere? LOL. Anyway why is everyone saying what a bad place Glendale is for the hockey club? It is not relevant. Glendale is kicking THEM out. Glendale does not want or need them anymore. They bilked the residents of that city for millions more than they ever brought in.
I am just curious whether they can scam the citizens of Tempe to pay for a new venue or not. I figure they will end up in the real middle of absolute nowhere on one of the reservations.
Maroons glass has evaporated from the heat. It's no longer 1/2 full.
As a reminder, the Coyotes don't play in the summer months. So no car baking will be going on.
Actually, the Coyotes' season extends into the warmer months. Besides, there are other events at Westgate during "car baking season", which is most of the year if you consider how fast a vehicle heats up when parked in the direct sunlight (even in the cooler months). Read the link below, and pay special attention to the temperature chart.
Re: searching for a parking spot. You will find one. I have never had an issue. I just park farther out and cut to the chase (I like parking on endcaps in order to dodge door dings). Now if you had a disability and couldn't walk, I'd get your point. But how would you know? Since you last visited Westgate 11 years ago, I'm not putting much stock in your opinion about the area. Yea, things have changed.
What has changed? Is there garage parking available? I don't mean just for patrons of Gila River Arena, but at the Cards stadium as well. Are there other widely available transportation sources to Westgate other than by car? The location of Westgate is a huge factor for me and many others. Add to the fact that the only real commuting option is driving, and the only parking available is in open lots. This is the way it was 11 years ago when I was last there. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I highly doubt anything has changed in this regard.
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Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised
Well, other than your drive time which is legitimate. Of course, Westgate is closer for the 1,600,000 people who live in the West Valley. The population in the West Valley has exploded and will continue to do so. That's why they did what they did.
But it's not closer for the remaining 3,400,000 people who live in the rest of the Valley. It has been a losing deal from the very start. As a side note, it has nothing to do with disdain toward the west Valley because I'd have the same arguments if a large sports & entertainment venue was located somewhere like Queen Creek, east Mesa, or on tribal land.
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Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised
let's see what happens in 15 years from now if they relocate to say, Tempe. The jury is out. I mean, the Winnipeg Jets (now called the PHX Coyotes) couldn't make it work in Canada after salaries skyrocketed in the 90's. And the Minnesota North Stars (the State of USA hockey) left for Dallas. Don't assume for a minute you can point to a franchise is Las Vegas and assume they are will be there for the long haul. Businesses ebb and flow.
Good points. My statements about the Vegas teams are primarily about where they're located as of now. That's an important factor because these types of venues belong in centralized locations ... not in exurban or rural areas. Venues which host monster truck rallies, rodeos, or tractor pulls are a different story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa
Mass transit is a specious argument for a downtown location. Mass transit is not an option for most people who attend sports whether it is downtown, Tempe, Glendale or where ever. The light rail (the only mass transit most would consider) is very, very limited and access is distant from most people. I would say 95% or better of people attending a Suns game drove there in their cars.
Point being that mass transit is much more readily available to a downtown event for those who don't have a car, or for those who choose not to drive to an event. This option is virtually non existent when commuting to Westgate. But then, I recall that you've been a proponent of pushing things out to the 'burbs, so I'm not surprised at your response.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bondurant
Parking at Westgate is easy. I have been to 80-100 Coyotes games and have never had to hunt for parking. My car is not exposed to more sun there than anywhere else. My car has never been broken into. It is no more dangerous than parking anywhere else. Only annoyance at Westgate was starting to charge for parking of game days.
No arguments that parking is easy at Coyotes' games, likely because hockey attendance is usually on the low side. Also, I'm not saying that a person's car is certain to be vandalized or damaged, but the risk is always higher in a parking lot than in your own garage, especially for an extended period of time. It's not only about the parking, but the commute. For me, Westgate is accessible by crosstown streets, and I don't care to drive in heavy traffic to a distant location for something that doesn't interest me all that much.
I'm much more of a basketball & baseball fan than I am a hockey fan. I enjoy watching a good football game, but not enough to drive way out to the Cards Stadium. Also, take a look at some of the upcoming major concerts: Eagles, Trans Siberian Orchestra, the Weeknd, Elton John just to name a few. Guess where they're all performing? Not at Westgate!
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