Phoenix Homeless Problem not as bad as other big cities (Mesa: buying, camp)

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by MN-Born-n-Raised

I wonder what they make per hour? Life to date, I've given a total of $0.00. All the while there is help wanted signs littered all over town for $15-$20 an hour asking for zero experience. I'm talking about people that look very employable, not someone with missing limbs or strung out on drugs.

They're the ones who are perfectly able bodied, but simply don't want to work a regular job which involves more than standing/sitting & begging. You're correct for not giving them anything because they don't deserve it. The vast majority are scam artists who aren't truly homeless. Worst of all are the fakes who use children as pawns just to get extra money.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CynYgP8PcWc

[My2cents55]

Looks like the city is clearing out the zone by court order.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/08/us/ph...one/index.html

[norman_w]

I saw my friend panhandling in the middle of the intersection. Embarrassing. He had a sign Support our Vets. He's not even American.

[john3232]

Originally Posted by Goofball86

Looks like the city is clearing out the zone by court order.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/08/us/ph...one/index.html

Great news

As far as what to do with those living on the streets. Not much can be done unless the individual wants the help. Society can't force someone to get clean/sober or to get a job or obey laws.

But Phx can remove the welcome mat. If someone needs assistance, the resources should be available. (Shelters need proper security, portable showers, an address people can use, an area to safely store belongings etc.)

However, if help is refused it should be made clear anti-social behavior won't be tolerated. If cited the individual should be required to work off their fine. I agree we can’t toss everyone in jail, but enforcement needs to be in place. Do this and I suspect many will leave. Where will they go?

I don't know but if they won't seek help...that's on them.

[My2cents55]

Originally Posted by john3232

Great news

As far as what to do with those living on the streets. Not much can be done unless the individual wants the help. Society can't force someone to get clean/sober or to get a job or obey laws.

But Phx can remove the welcome mat. If someone needs assistance, the resources should be available. (Shelters need proper security, portable showers, an address people can use, an area to safely store belongings etc.)

However, if help is refused it should be made clear anti-social behavior won't be tolerated. If cited the individual should be required to work off their fine. I agree we can’t toss everyone in jail, but enforcement needs to be in place. Do this and I suspect many will leave. Where will they go?

I don't know but if they won't seek help...that's on them.

I have a friend who is a case worker who deals with the mentally ill and homeless all day long. He told me a lot of them want to stay homeless and refuse help when offered. Because they wanna stay on drugs.

He told me awhile back he was able to get this one homeless woman an apartment but she would only take it if she could stay on her drugs and traffic out of the apartment obviously that was a no go for the apartments.

In the article, another woman refuses to get off the streets because she wants to stay on drugs and doesn't wanna follow the rules of the shelter.

Like the saying goes you can't help someone if they wont help themselves.

[hardwired_x]

Addiction is a real problem and should be thought of as the illness that it is and not a moral shortcoming of the individual.

[beez74]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

They're the ones who are perfectly able bodied, but simply don't want to work a regular job which involves more than standing/sitting & begging. You're correct for not giving them anything because they don't deserve it. The vast majority are scam artists who aren't truly homeless. Worst of all are the fakes who use children as pawns just to get extra money.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CynYgP8PcWc

I grew up in Pittsburgh......We had a very interesting case of a man that lived in Cleveland and commuted to a well to do area north of Pittsburgh and posted up near a bank, fast food and a Target and was quoted after being followed to his hotel stating that he makes over 2k on a weekend panhandling and he came to the Pittsburgh area only on the weekends and would bring his wife and 2 kids with him for better results ! He owned his own home and nice car...he had lost his job over a year ago but had stopped looking and said why should I get a job when can sit out here and get free food and wages and only have to do it on the weekends. He was posted up in the spot weekly for about 5 month but eventually someone saw his family walk to his vehicle and leave which prompted the investigation and being followed to his hotel. They were all usually dressed normal and the kids usually where just sitting there playing with toys with the wife while he collected from drivers.

[YAZ]

Originally Posted by hardwired_x

Addiction is a real problem and should be thought of as the illness that it is and not a moral shortcoming of the individual.

Yeah. The moral shortcomings come when the addicted steal to support their habits.

[Valley Native]

https://news.yahoo.com/aclu-asks-jud...ONVzjsM_HR_Jmq

The ACLU, which sued the city in November over its treatment of unhoused people, contends the cleanup disobeyed a court order in that lawsuit that prohibited the city from violating the constitutional rights of unhoused people during cleanup “sweeps.

Wow, I had no idea that living on the streets, blocking sidewalk access, defecating in front of buildings, stealing, and using illegal drugs were constitutional rights. The ACLU (once an organization with good intentions) has it wrong again.

[john3232]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

https://news.yahoo.com/aclu-asks-jud...ONVzjsM_HR_Jmq



Wow, I had no idea that living on the streets, blocking sidewalk access, defecating in front of buildings, stealing, and using illegal drugs were constitutional rights. The ACLU (once an organization with good intentions) has it wrong again.

From the article

“We can’t just stand by when we feel that the rights of the unsheltered community are being violated,” ACLU attorney Benjamin Rundall said. The city fiercely refuted all of the above, calling the ACLU’s recounting of the cleanup “not accurate.” It countered that 47 of the 60 people the city engaged with were voluntarily moved into shelter, that no one’s property was destroyed without their permission and that the city is storing five people’s belongings at their request, a statement from city spokesperson Kristin Couturier said.

The city of Phx knows it must tread lightly. If they can't find the owner of a shopping cart, make sure it’s documented before tossing it. Have the beds available. If city officials are careful, they should have no trouble continuing the cleanup.