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Thread summary:

Moving to Arizona: retirement plans, discrimination, fighting racism, Hispanic immigrants, Phoenix.

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Old 02-15-2009, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
16,289 posts, read 32,239,939 times
Reputation: 21890

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I don't get it DC? Has the word Illegal accomplished anything here for you? You mentioned a third world nation that you believe has better health care than us. I think your watching too many propoganda movies. If you think that Cuba has such a great system then you may want to visit Key West and watch all those Cubans that enter the state of Florida by water. Maybe they are on vacation and will be taking the same rickety boat back to Cuba for that quality health care that you speak of.

Hear in the South west many states are impacted by illegal immigration. I get it. Many people get it. This land we call home is so blessed that people will do anything that they can to get here. Even in these hard economic times people are willing to do what they have to do to move to this country. Even with the small pittence that they make it is more than they will make back home. As long as we the people are willing to pay individuals to do those jobs that we don't want to do we will continue to have a flow of people from less fortunate nations trying to get here to take those jobs. In Arizona the state has tried to do something about that. Business owners need to hire individuals that can legally work here. If you can't get a job chances are you will move to a state that you can find work in. Can you imagine what would happen if all the states did that? Create a fine that is so harsh that business doesn't hire illegals and you will end a majority of the flow of illegal workers.
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Old 02-15-2009, 03:41 AM
 
10,719 posts, read 20,237,701 times
Reputation: 10021
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
I don't get it DC? Has the word Illegal accomplished anything here for you? You mentioned a third world nation that you believe has better health care than us. I think your watching too many propoganda movies. If you think that Cuba has such a great system then you may want to visit Key West and watch all those Cubans that enter the state of Florida by water. Maybe they are on vacation and will be taking the same rickety boat back to Cuba for that quality health care that you speak of.

Hear in the South west many states are impacted by illegal immigration. I get it. Many people get it. This land we call home is so blessed that people will do anything that they can to get here. Even in these hard economic times people are willing to do what they have to do to move to this country. Even with the small pittence that they make it is more than they will make back home. As long as we the people are willing to pay individuals to do those jobs that we don't want to do we will continue to have a flow of people from less fortunate nations trying to get here to take those jobs. In Arizona the state has tried to do something about that. Business owners need to hire individuals that can legally work here. If you can't get a job chances are you will move to a state that you can find work in. Can you imagine what would happen if all the states did that? Create a fine that is so harsh that business doesn't hire illegals and you will end a majority of the flow of illegal workers.
Well said, illegals hurt our market system because normally if companies have difficulty recruiting for jobs, they raise wages to entice people to work there. People claim that our society doesn't desire working certain jobs. That's not necessarily true. People would leap at the opportunity to be a cashier at Burger King if it paid 10-12 per hour and offerred benefits which is what it would likely have to do if Burger King and other fast food chains lacked access to illegal workers.

In regards to your latter post, I'm glad you stated that because therein lies the hypocrisy with our legal system. We don't want to punish the businesses who hire illegals but we will just punish the illegals themselves. In other words, don't punish the businesses who fund the campaigns of many politicians and contribute to our communities but let's punish the illegals. That's like saying, don't punish the people who use drugs, just punish the drug dealers. In Arizona, construction was our biggest industry and the construction industy is essentially run by illegals. Without cheap labor supplied by illegal immigrants, many of those companies wouldn't exist. Notice how Sherriff Joe never raided construction sites or many developments but instead focused on small fast food restaurants..hmm...I wonder why that was. The point I'm making is that if we really wanted to curb illegal immigration, we could have done so long time ago but these big businesses still want the cheap labor and the politicans who receive campaign contributions from these companies are not going to create the necessary legislation to get it done. It's always going to be a problem. This is why I liked Bush's guest worker plan because the reality is we are going to use illegal labor but under Bush's plan, it would at least be monitored and kept it check.
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Old 02-15-2009, 05:30 AM
 
Location: Tempe, AZ
45 posts, read 123,299 times
Reputation: 33
Why don't we just peacefully convince Mexico to become a territory of the U.S.? That way, all Mexicans would have full U.S. citizenship benefits, such as minimum wages, etc... The only southern border we'd have to protect would be the tiny sliver of land next to Panama. We could maybe get a handle on the illegal drug trade (doubtful, but possible). As the trade-off financial benefit, the U.S. would control Mexico's oil reserves and lucrative resort destinations. Could be a win-win situation???
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Old 02-15-2009, 06:05 AM
 
Location: Prescott Valley,az summer/east valley Az winter
2,061 posts, read 4,124,133 times
Reputation: 8190
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
DCTalk:

If our illegal aliens were mostly Nordic White people: I would be just as enraged-----------and, the 'race card' would not apply in my case due my being Nordic White as well.
there are a lot of russian and slovokian and czeck illegal immegrants in the Phoenix area~ just no one that bothers to check!
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Old 02-15-2009, 07:12 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,144 posts, read 42,036,722 times
Reputation: 3861
Quote:
Originally Posted by deckdoc View Post
there are a lot of russian and slovokian and czeck illegal immegrants in the Phoenix area~ just no one that bothers to check!
If caught: pitch 'em out as well.

Better a family of Nahautl (Aztec) speaking Mexican Indians from SOB here legally than a blue eyed blonde from Sweden here illegally. The former I would have much more respect for and would be willing to help 'em out.
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Old 02-15-2009, 07:16 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,144 posts, read 42,036,722 times
Reputation: 3861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fra Diavolo View Post
Why don't we just peacefully convince Mexico to become a territory of the U.S.? That way, all Mexicans would have full U.S. citizenship benefits, such as minimum wages, etc... The only southern border we'd have to protect would be the tiny sliver of land next to Panama. We could maybe get a handle on the illegal drug trade (doubtful, but possible). As the trade-off financial benefit, the U.S. would control Mexico's oil reserves and lucrative resort destinations. Could be a win-win situation???
All kidding aside: if Mexico were to collapse; which is a growing possibility to the point that Texas has contingency plans to deal with perhaps tens of thousands of frightened/injured refugees*, we may wind up with the northern tier of Mx states by default--------at their request. Apparently; things SOB are becoming that bad.

*Note I am referring to the variety of Mexican national who would never dream of hopping the border illegally for economic reasons-----------read that the middle class and up folks.
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Old 02-15-2009, 08:40 PM
 
Location: Louisville, KY
1,590 posts, read 4,609,562 times
Reputation: 1380
ah, irony.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DCTalk View Post
As is my wont, I peruse various forums (fora?) and blogs on the Phoenix area and other locations I am interested in possibly retiring to. I have run across what I consider some disturbing elements in some of the AZ blogs. I realize border security issues are important in the Southwest, but there are some of the most virulent, hate-filled anti-immigrant rants I have ever seen on various Arizona blogs, including a few individuals on this site. It’s not that these individuals consider the influx of illegals a problem. They are literally seething with unreasoning hatred.

Now we all know there are ignorant, bigoted racists in every state, but one gets the impression from the blog sites that Arizona has a disproportionate number of them. Some of the ravings and droolings of these slack-jawed mouth-breathers make the Klan look like flaming liberals. Yes, I know that Arizona is a conservative state and that there still is some of that Old West 19th century mentality out there, but to what degree? How prevalent is this type of thinking among the general population? What proportion of the population is intolerant of anyone different than they are? Is it just the natives or is it the influx of new residents from out-of-state that also possess this type of thinking?

Let the fun begin.

Bigot: a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.

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