How to deal with a title co. and realtor in cahoots to rob me? (short sales, real estate)

[Rick Lee]

Got my pre-audit HUD-1 yesterday and there was a random $2k fee on there coming from us. We were supposed to sign docs tomorrow, but I raised a fuss over this. This is a short sale and it appraised low. Seller's bank immediately agreed to lower price to appraised value, sent over addendum to sign, we signed, they signed and it went to title. Title co. and listing agent cannot produce any documentation or closing instructions from anyone about this $2k. Listing agent claims my agent said we would "consider" adding $2k to the deal if the low appraisal was too low for the seller's bank. This was on email from my agent to the listing agent. Listing agent claims this is a binding contract now, despite the fact that the seller's bank agreed to the appraised value sans the extra $2k and we all signed the addendum agreeing to such. Listing agent won't budge and escrow officer is in cahoots with her. Escrow agent had the gall to tell my agent the appraisal was "BS." Now, why would a disinterested third party title company have an opinion on an appraisal? My agent is insisting we have an executed, enforceable contract and need to close this deal. Escrow officer and listing agent dance around my agent's and my multiple requests for documentation of this $2k. They cannot produce it because it simply does not exist. Listing agent told me it will have to go back to the bank now for revision. I told her they'd have no problem reapproving what they have already approved and she should just save everyone's time and adhere to the contract. No dice. Ever talk to someone who's 110% wrong and refuses to admit it? Totally ignores the fact that she cannot produce anything agreeing to this $2k.

As of the end of April we have no place to live, having given our landlord notice to vacate. I've spent plenty of money on inspection, appraisal, EMD and am even paying for the gas to be on in the house because it was cheaper to turn it on for the inspection and keep it on than to do it just for one day and then reconnect later. What recourse do we have to make these crooks perform? I don't care about reprisals (at the moment). I just want to get this deal closed according to the contract.

[AZM]

Time to get the brokers involved. the agents are not much more than aluminum siding salesmen, they cant even hold their own license, the broker holds it.

Look into these areas for state laws that help protect you.

Arizona Department of Real Estate

Arizona Revised Statutes

[Greatday]

The residential purchase contract used for this transaction? Can you give me the name of who produced the form - its on the bottom? And the form number and copyright date

Thanks

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by AZM

Time to get the brokers involved. the agents are not much more than aluminum siding salesmen, they cant even hold their own license, the broker holds it.

Look into these areas for state laws that help protect you.

Arizona Department of Real Estate

Arizona Revised Statutes

Not gonna work. Listing agent owns her own shop. My agent is as good as they come. When we first made our offer in late November, we heard nothing for a week. Listing agent never returned any calls. But she listed the seller's contact info in the MLS, so my agent called the seller. Seller had no idea we had made an offer. Listing agent was holding onto it, hoping to find her own buyer so as to double her commission. Then she had the nerve to yell at my agent for contacting her seller. Unreal. So she's refused to deal with my agent since then and only goes through his broker and is still pretty much incommunicado at that. She incompetent and criminal, but we're so close to having this done. How to bring her to her senses?

[altus2006]

A letter to the Arizona Real Estate Commission with carbon copies to both agents should help you.

If this doesn't work out, will you PLEASE stop fooling with short sales????

altus2006

[crystalys]

[quote=Rick Lee;13685839]Got my pre-audit HUD-1 yesterday and there was a random $2k fee on there coming from us.

What exactly is the description of this fee on the HUD-1?

Listing agent claims my agent said we would "consider" adding $2k to the deal if the low appraisal was too low for the seller's bank. This was on email from my agent to the listing agent. Listing agent claims this is a binding contract now, despite the fact that the seller's bank agreed to the appraised value sans the extra $2k and we all signed the addendum agreeing to such.

If it is not in the purchase contract or any of the addendums and all the paperwork is signed and acknowledged by the seller, the buyer and the bank, then that should be a done deal and ready for closing. An email is not a binding contract and is as good as a "verbal" agreement when it comes to a real estate transaction. Any of the parties can say or email their intent but until it is part of the purchase contract in writing and signed by all parties, it is not valid.

What recourse do we have to make these crooks perform? I don't care about reprisals (at the moment). I just want to get this deal closed according to the contract.[/quote

As others have suggested, it is time for your agent's broker to step up and fight for you. And definetely report the listing agent and the title company representative immediately. Of course I am giving this advice based on the facts you have provided, and not being part of the actual transaction, am taking at face value. Just the fact that you have a "random" fee on the HUD-1 is a great cause for concern and as much as you want this transaction to go through, $2K is a lot of additonal money to put up out of your pocket. I can't stress enough that your agent and broker really need to take extreme action right now to get this deal done.

[Rick Lee]

Thanks Crystalys. The charge is on line 109 of the buyer's column and reads "Buyers contribution to first------------$2000."

Yes, I concur that an email is not a binding contract. In fact, before my agent's email could even be forwarded to the bank by the listing agent, the bank came back and immediately agreed to the lower appraised price. They want this deal done with, as do we. So the email became moot, as far as I'm concerned. However, this email is the closest thing to a shred of documentation the listing agent can come up with explaining this charge.

I used to be in the biz and I know how closing instructions work. Title companies don't just add random charges into a HUD on an agent's verbal command. Yet, neither the escrow officer nor listing agent will even respond to my multiple requests for documentation as to whom ordered this, let alone our agreeing to pay it. I can't believe this stuff happens between adults.

I honestly believe the listing agent wants this deal to die and that she probably has a backup buyer of her own lined up so she can double her commission. I can't understand why the seller hasn't fired this agent unless she's also in on the scam. I mean, the seller didn't even learn of our offer on the place for over a week and then only when my agent got tired of not getting his calls returned by the listing agent and called the seller directly.

As the low appraisal got the sales price down by $14k more than we had originally agreed to pay, it's not going to kill us to cough up $2k more to get the deal done. But we're being robbed here and I want to make sure the title company and listing agent end up paying far more for their behavior when it's all said and done. Surely, they can't think I'm gonna pay and then just forget about it. Even if they're sure I'll pay, they have to know I'm gonna pusue some kind of legal action against them, which makes me wonder if they're truly mentally incompetent or just like playing adult versions of chicken.

[Rick Lee]

Well, the plot thickens. Escrow officer just emailed me a copy of the bank approval letter to the seller, agreeing to our appraisal price and stating their minimum required payoff to release the lien. There's a $2k deficit when all the closing costs are worked out, so it looks like escrow officer and listing agent decided to add that to our column.

Of course, a payoff/short sale approval letter from the bank to the seller in no way constitutes any kind of agreement on my part to pay whatever shortfall there is after closing costs. But at least I finally have some documentation of how this BS got started. Now the problem will be getting the seller to cough up that money.

Also, got a question on title insurance. Is it customary or required for the seller to pay for the owner's policy in AZ? I've heard it is, but that $1700 is also listed on my column. So, if I could get that reversed, we'd only be off by $300, which isn't worth holding this deal up over. Though I fully plan to pursue action against these crooks when we have the keys to the new place and it's all done.

[Greatday]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

Also, got a question on title insurance. Is it customary or required for the seller to pay for the owner's policy in AZ? I've heard it is, but that $1700 is also listed on my column. So, if I could get that reversed, we'd only be off by $300, which isn't worth holding this deal up over. Though I fully plan to pursue action against these crooks when we have the keys to the new place and it's all done.

It is customary for the seller to provide / purchase owners title insurance for the benefit of the buyer.

It is customary for the buyer to provide / purchase the ALTA - Lenders title insurance, for the benefit of the lender.

[smokemaster]

always write seller to provide owner's policy on the contract. Some of the banks are stating they will not pay unless it is specified in the contract. My realtor put on contract buyer and seller to pay own closing costs. This actually almost got her fired--vague wording. Never assume...........and yes it is customary, but these are extraordinary times.