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View Poll Results: Which do you prefer?
East Valley 124 69.27%
West Valley 55 30.73%
Voters: 179. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-29-2010, 07:08 PM
 
4,422 posts, read 8,370,398 times
Reputation: 4541

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa View Post
It's tough on east-siders seeing the stadium, entertainment venues, the freeways, the latest in home designs, the growth of ASU, solar energy, and all the plans that have been delayed but not abandoned in the recession going to the west side. I may be a little harsh in characterizing the east side as decaying, but anyone who is anyone in valley development knows which way the wind is blowing and where the future is - hint WEST.
ASU canceled their plans, maybe you didn't get the memo. And there's not much else that has happened other than a few Spring Training venues that the East Valley didn't attempt for (which I disagree with). And as someone that is immersed in the valley real estate development industry for a living, I am aware that the West Valley is the last area to see development, thus having lots of vacant land, but you also have competition from a 275 square mile planning area in the far East Valley coming on strong (google Superstition Vistas), and they have the benefit and edge for having an airport. There's still a good 5-7 solid years of development in Chandler and SE Gilbert, though, it's not like it's built out and decaying. Most of the homes have been built within the last 10 years like most places.
Superstition Vistas Area Planning Project

I know that Chandler lost on the 70 employee solar warehouse to Goodyear, but soon thereafter added a better tenant to that same site, that will eventually employ up to 9,000.

Plan in works to develop former Motorola site: Chandler project called Continuum could employ 9,000 | TradingMarkets.com (http://www.tradingmarkets.com/news/stock-alert/mot_plan-in-works-to-develop-former-motorola-site-chandler-project-called-continuum-could-employ-9-000-721652.html - broken link)

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Old 03-29-2010, 10:02 PM
 
9,092 posts, read 17,925,133 times
Reputation: 6947
if your friends had to go to scottsdale or chandler that's their own fault

I do most of my christmas shopping without going east of the 101

which of course means nothing

you have a pretty slanted bent - and that's cool

but let's not try and pass hyperbole as fact

also, the walmart super center isn't in the new canyon trails development anyone is talking about

people who think goodyear is "way out there" often live in chandler, gilbert, mesa or someplace that I would consider to be equally "way out there"

who gives a rip

i can get to downtown in 20 minutes, the airport in 30 - that's close enough for me

i used to live up by the arrowhead mall and really liked the area - however, i don't miss the traffic and really don't miss the mall ........ most of the stuff I need I can find around here and I maybe go to the mall 2x-3x a year

and you make it sound like there are walls of tags and murals of graffiti - that is far from the case .... you may find the work of bored kids as you will anywhere in the metro, but your characterization is way off base

and you really show a complete lack of knowledge about the area
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Old 03-29-2010, 10:58 PM
 
4,422 posts, read 8,370,398 times
Reputation: 4541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finger Laker View Post
if your friends had to go to scottsdale or chandler that's their own fault

I do most of my christmas shopping without going east of the 101

which of course means nothing

you have a pretty slanted bent - and that's cool

but let's not try and pass hyperbole as fact

also, the walmart super center isn't in the new canyon trails development anyone is talking about

people who think goodyear is "way out there" often live in chandler, gilbert, mesa or someplace that I would consider to be equally "way out there"

who gives a rip

i can get to downtown in 20 minutes, the airport in 30 - that's close enough for me

i used to live up by the arrowhead mall and really liked the area - however, i don't miss the traffic and really don't miss the mall ........ most of the stuff I need I can find around here and I maybe go to the mall 2x-3x a year

and you make it sound like there are walls of tags and murals of graffiti - that is far from the case .... you may find the work of bored kids as you will anywhere in the metro, but your characterization is way off base

and you really show a complete lack of knowledge about the area
The Canyon Trails shopping center I was speaking of is located at Cotton and Yuma Roads. It may not have been a Wal Mart, maybe it was a Target on the NE Corner. The SW Corner has another commercial development that is basically vacant and was covered with graffiti. The monument signs (where store names go), were also tagged with graffiti and had no store signs in them, as I assume there were no stores there, just a vacant building.

I don't claim to know a lot about Goodyear, but I know that Palm Valley is a 9,000 acre development on former cotton farms that were used for Goodyear tires. SunCor is the master developer, and they owned Golden Heritage homes which was the primary builder in there early on. There is a cemetary on the Western edge, beyond that a large prison, and to the North an Air Force base, to the East is Estrella Mountain Community College. The shopping center that is NW of I-10 and Litchfield Road used to be exclusively an outlet center that was converted to retail in the year 2000. The shopping center across the street where the Fridays is was completed about the same time. The generic movie theater there has a no compete clause with the developer which is why you haven't seen a Harkins or AMC in the master plan. The mall planned for I-10 and Bullard has been planned for years and years, and required an off-ramp at Bullard for access. The developer asked the city to pay for this. It's not gonna be built for 8-10 years. Yeah, I know a little about your neck of the woods.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:58 PM
 
10,720 posts, read 19,067,481 times
Reputation: 9996
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
Can we safely say we go to live in the West Valley and go to play in the East Valley? In time the west side will get more of what people want in the way of fun.
Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying. I think most of us do the same in the East Valley. I live in Chandler but I play in Tempe, Phoenix and Scottsdale. I'm sure people in Gilbert do the same.

Personally, I think the whole East vs West is an outdated argument. This type of argument was big 10 years ago. Now, the lines have blurred as to what is west side. In the past, the West Side was ghetto because it was really the west side of Phoenix and parts of Glendale. And back then those areas were bad. Since that time, communities like Sun City, Surprise, Peoria, Avondale and Goodyear have developed and are nothing like those west Phoenix communities. I still say those communities are new, however and will take some time to further develop.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:07 AM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
16,290 posts, read 29,919,971 times
Reputation: 21814
Quote:
Originally Posted by asufan View Post
ASU canceled their plans, maybe you didn't get the memo. And there's not much else that has happened other than a few Spring Training venues that the East Valley didn't attempt for (which I disagree with). And as someone that is immersed in the valley real estate development industry for a living, I am aware that the West Valley is the last area to see development, thus having lots of vacant land, but you also have competition from a 275 square mile planning area in the far East Valley coming on strong (google Superstition Vistas), and they have the benefit and edge for having an airport. There's still a good 5-7 solid years of development in Chandler and SE Gilbert, though, it's not like it's built out and decaying. Most of the homes have been built within the last 10 years like most places.
Superstition Vistas Area Planning Project

I know that Chandler lost on the 70 employee solar warehouse to Goodyear, but soon thereafter added a better tenant to that same site, that will eventually employ up to 9,000.

Plan in works to develop former Motorola site: Chandler project called Continuum could employ 9,000 | TradingMarkets.com (http://www.tradingmarkets.com/news/stock-alert/mot_plan-in-works-to-develop-former-motorola-site-chandler-project-called-continuum-could-employ-9-000-721652.html - broken link)

I read with interest the story about the proposed project in Chandler. I was hoping that some large employer would be moving to the old Motorola site and hiring all those people to work out there. Turns out that the developer would like to replace the old Mortorola site with an office park that may or may not offer 9,000 jobs in the area, also those jobs if and when they materialize may take a decade to materialize in full.

Lets say that 9,000 jobs are provided in the new project. How many of them will be new jobs? How many will be from companies that move from within Chandler to the new site? How many will be from companies that move from some other community in the valley into the project in Chandler? I guess if a company moves to the project it could be considered a new job within the confines of the project but can it be a new job within the valley?

How are the developers determining the creation of 9,000 new jobs? Just moving a company from one part of the valley to another part does not create a new job. I would venture to guess that the former employees would move with the company. Maybe we count those jobs where a former employee decides that they don't want to follow the employer across the valley. Their again that is not a real job creation to the valley.

I would count real job creation as something where new positions are created. Maybe that will happen within the project. Maybe companies move there because they are in fact out growing their old locations and need to add people. The question though is will the business entities add 9,000 new jobs to the area or will they move a majority of current positions from other parts of the area to this new project.
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Old 03-30-2010, 12:10 AM
 
10,720 posts, read 19,067,481 times
Reputation: 9996
Quote:
Originally Posted by asufan View Post
ASU canceled their plans, maybe you didn't get the memo. And there's not much else that has happened other than a few Spring Training venues that the East Valley didn't attempt for (which I disagree with). And as someone that is immersed in the valley real estate development industry for a living, I am aware that the West Valley is the last area to see development, thus having lots of vacant land, but you also have competition from a 275 square mile planning area in the far East Valley coming on strong (google Superstition Vistas), and they have the benefit and edge for having an airport. There's still a good 5-7 solid years of development in Chandler and SE Gilbert, though, it's not like it's built out and decaying. Most of the homes have been built within the last 10 years like most places.
Superstition Vistas Area Planning Project

I know that Chandler lost on the 70 employee solar warehouse to Goodyear, but soon thereafter added a better tenant to that same site, that will eventually employ up to 9,000.

Plan in works to develop former Motorola site: Chandler project called Continuum could employ 9,000 | TradingMarkets.com (http://www.tradingmarkets.com/news/stock-alert/mot_plan-in-works-to-develop-former-motorola-site-chandler-project-called-continuum-could-employ-9-000-721652.html - broken link)

Agreed, Chandler definitely will get a better tenant because the University of Arizona is also considering building at that site which would be big for the Valley and Chandler. Yeah, I wouldn't exactly say the wave of new development is limited to the West Side.

Mayor touts future UA campus for Chandler | Chandler Arizona News - Chandler News - Chandler, AZ news | (http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/150548 - broken link)eastvalleytribune.com (http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/150548 - broken link)

The article also highlighted several other features

1. Dunn said talks with Arizona State University President Michael Crow to put a 3,000-student ASU satellite campus in downtown Chandler are ongoing. Crow has said he considers the area a "premium" site to put a "Colleges@ASU" campus by fall 2011.

2. UA also is participating in the city's Innovations Technology Incubator/Accelerator, in a former Intel research and development facility at 145 S. 79th St., in a building also owned by Capital Commercial Investments.

3. Dunn said downtown Chandler is expected to reach a turning point this year with the completion of new city facilities like the five-story, $76 million City Hall now under construction and the newly completed fire department headquarters, as well as private investment.

4. Dunn also revealed that a technology company called Gangplank, comprising about 45 entrepreneurs, is set to relocate to downtown Chandler, and that prospective tenants plan to lease 250,000 square feet of commercial space in the Chandler Airpark industrial area by June

Last edited by azriverfan.; 03-30-2010 at 12:23 AM..
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Old 03-30-2010, 03:37 AM
zox
 
344 posts, read 440,685 times
Reputation: 175
With all due respect, I don't understand what would prompt one to live in the west valley aside from cheaper housing. With the exception of Jobbing arena and the University of Phoenix stadium, what is in the west valley that isn't in the east valley? The east valley seems to have the advantage in every category. There are more jobs particularly higher paying ones in the east valley. The shopping in the east valley is better as there are no upscale shopping in the entire west valley. The east valley has larger and more diverse array of restaurants particularly fine dining than the west valley. I've personally never heard of anyone from the east valley driving to the west valley for the exclusive purpose of shopping or dining but it seems to be a regular occurrence for west valley residents to shop and dine in the east valley. There are better educational opportunities in the east valley. ASU main is the best university campus in the valley. Chandler-Gilbert community college has a beautiful new campus with it's own performing arts center and a beautiful state-of-the art 2 story glass library. Mesa Community college built a brand new 3 story glass library and media center and has the second largest student population in the valley outside of ASU main. Glendale Community college has many trailers serving as classrooms and resembled a run down high school. Regarding education, there were more 10 rating public and private schools in the east valley than the west valley on greatschools.com. The east valley seems to be more conveniently located to the airport, downtown and central Phoenix than the west valley. Tempe and Scottsdale are directly adjacent to the airport and central Phoenix. The areas of the west valley that are closest to central Phoenix are the most undesirable and dangerous parts of the west valley.

Last edited by zox; 03-30-2010 at 04:30 AM..
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Old 03-30-2010, 04:04 AM
zox
 
344 posts, read 440,685 times
Reputation: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
I read with interest the story about the proposed project in Chandler. I was hoping that some large employer would be moving to the old Motorola site and hiring all those people to work out there. Turns out that the developer would like to replace the old Mortorola site with an office park that may or may not offer 9,000 jobs in the area, also those jobs if and when they materialize may take a decade to materialize in full. Lets say that 9,000 jobs are provided in the new project. How many of them will be new jobs? How many will be from companies that move from within Chandler to the new site? How many will be from companies that move from some other community in the valley into the project in Chandler? I guess if a company moves to the project it could be considered a new job within the confines of the project but can it be a new job within the valley? How are the developers determining the creation of 9,000 new jobs? Just moving a company from one part of the valley to another part does not create a new job. I would venture to guess that the former employees would move with the company. Maybe we count those jobs where a former employee decides that they don't want to follow the employer across the valley. Their again that is not a real job creation to the valley. I would count real job creation as something where new positions are created. Maybe that will happen within the project. Maybe companies move there because they are in fact out growing their old locations and need to add people. The question though is will the business entities add 9,000 new jobs to the area or will they move a majority of current positions from other parts of the area to this new project.
If you continue to read, you will note that ASU and U of A are involved in these discussions. Job creation isn't limited to companies. Universities employ people too. They also lead to further development surrounding the campus which leads to more job growth.
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Old 03-30-2010, 04:48 AM
zox
 
344 posts, read 440,685 times
Reputation: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa View Post
It is where the growth is, where the future is. Past=East Future=West.
The growth is occurring in the west valley because many of it's areas are undeveloped. So you are arguing the west valley is better than the east valley because it's acquiring development to hopefully one day become like the east valley? That line of reasoning is supposed convince people the west valley is better?
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Old 03-30-2010, 08:44 AM
 
Location: Sonoran Desert
35,905 posts, read 45,971,815 times
Reputation: 24584
Quote:
Originally Posted by zox View Post
The growth is occurring in the west valley because many of it's areas are undeveloped. So you are arguing the west valley is better than the east valley because it's acquiring development to hopefully one day become like the east valley? That line of reasoning is supposed convince people the west valley is better?
You got it. The east is in decay - the west will rule the day. It's like China and the US.

Personally, I moved to Estrella (west Valley) to get away from the development. I lived for many, many years in Ahwatukee subdivisions. It got to be a mess there with 6 lane roads, a traffic light every 500 feet, constant traffic, overcrowded schools - all the advantages of development. When Estrella gets the same way - and the hour is close at hand - I am out of here too in search of some peace and quiet further away from this dismal mass of humanity we call Phoenix.

Overall, though, I think this is a silly argument - east vs west. It's a vestige of Phoenix past when there really was more of a distinction. These days, there are nice hoods in every direction (including north and south) and lifestyles that can suit various desires. Home choices vary from ghetto to million dollar customs in all directions as well. Estrella, Vistancia, Verrado, Marley Park, Stetson, Arrowhead, Palm Valley and others are on par with Ocotillo, Ahwatukee, etc. For me, the relative solitude, cotton fields and the mountain views matter most, for others it is being near a mall, restaurants, and bars. My choice fits what I value and not some anachronistic notion of which direction is a better address.

Last edited by Ponderosa; 03-30-2010 at 09:20 AM..
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