thoughts on education cuts? (Pittsburgh, Penn: voucher, stats, moving)

[Sideblinded]

Corporations, millionaires & Wall Street are excluded.

Please wake up.

Check this out. Who's zoomin' who?

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11071/1131507-53.stm

[lifepgh2op]

A middle school student in Lawrenceville lit another student's pants on fire during Science class with a lighter. These are the kids teachers are responsible for and people say they're paid too much. LOL.

[hempfield mania]

Originally Posted by Sideblinded

Seriously? 1/2 year? My dad taught high school social studies his entire life. He graded term papers into late hours over many days. He had 6 classes that were required to write a minimum of an 8 page paper. Please note this was only a 6 week course. My (Madison WI) public school district required 3 classes of 6 week of world history courses to graduate. (along with US history & civics which were either semester or 1/2 semester classes) He also spent hours at home formulating lesson plans and running a Model UN club for students in our fancy 1,400 sq foot "teacher mansion". He had 3 kids and we lived a normal middle class life, but honestly most of my friend's dad's made more money and they had more than we did. This is far from a part time job. He was offered better private sector jobs and was offered positions to be a Principal many times. He followed his passion and passed on more money because he loved what he did.

In this climate I would imagine he would have left due to the uncertainty. Just like you he had a family to raise, but he felt respected and did not live in fear of losing his job due to political pressure.

Do not type anything about " your Dad was an exception" crap. Most teachers live this way, he was not an exception. He
was a teacher and most of them do care.

He picked up odd jobs, like trash collection offered by the district during the summer in the 60's and taught summer school
every single year for his last 15 yrs.


He was in a union, and he was not a "thug".

I forgot to mention our phone ringing while we were trying to eat dinner or just watch TV, usually by concerned parents or angry parents upset their child got a less than desirable grade on a quiz, test or report.

Back then, teacher's pay was less, on the avg., compared to the private sector but teachers got really good benefits to make up for the smaller salary.

Over the last 10-15 yrs, teachers in PA made great strides in salary gains, esp. in better off municipalities to the point they were on par with the private sector and in the last couple of years, it can be argued they have surpassed the private sector in many districts in this area. All the while, they have kept a great benefit pkg. while benefit pkgs. in the private sector have been slowly eroded....

h_ only gives teachers credit for 6 months of work but I give them credit for 9 months, even though they get more "off time" during the regular school year than the typical white collar worker gets in vacation (on top of having summers off if they so choose).

Bringing work home is a non-issue because 75% (maybe higher) of white collar workers work more than 40 hrs per week whether it is in the office or bringing work home and it is something that is expected if you are on a salary.

I would just like to see teacher's unions living in todays reality when it comes to pay and benefits and I would also like to see PA teachers ability to strike go away. The only ones that get hurt by strikes are the kids...

[Copanut]

Just pay them 20K a year, that will show them. Hell, anyone can do that job, even those without a degree that drive a bus.

[lifepgh2op]

Originally Posted by hempfield mania

Back then, teacher's pay was less, on the avg., compared to the private sector

"Back then" people paid $30,000 for homes. A decent car costs that much these days. Salary changes reflect the rise in cost of everything in the economy. Just like the private sector.

[robrobrob]

Teachers make a nice buck now. It probably wasn't always the case though. Growing up my friend's father was a teacher and he painted houses in the summer. His mother worked too. My guess is that was because she had to. Basically, they had a middle class lifestyle because they had two incomes. I do think teachers get compensated better today. 80,000 is really upper middle class. All you have to do is take a look at the cars in the teachers parking lot and you can see how well the teachers are being compensated today.

The thing that I don't get is the huge salary bump that teachers get. Suddenly, the teacher is worth that much more. I guess because an experienced teacher is a better teacher than one fresh out of school. So, if the experienced teacher is the better teacher, shouldn't we fell sorry for the kids that are stuck with the new teacher right out of school. Then at some point they get to be too expensive so the district offers early retirement incentives. That is smart get rid of the "better" teachers so we can have our kids learn from brand new teacher.

[Sideblinded]

Benefits? He paid for his own pension, it was deducted out of his paycheck..His money. He does not collect social security. He paid for his retirement. I can't imagine anyone wanting to enter the field of education anymore. Who would want to enter a profession that is viewed with such disrespect.

http://teacherportal.com/district/pe...public-schools

Starting Salary: $34,976
Average Salary:**$54,027.

That is not outrageous for people that have bachelor & masters degrees.

Get mad at wall street if you want to point fingers.

[Aqua Teen Carl]

Originally Posted by Sideblinded

Get mad at wall street if you want to point fingers.

Agreed wholeheartedly. However, people have this grand idea that they too will be on the same financial level as wall street tycoons so instead they focus their frustration other members of the middle class. The classic divide and conquer strategy works without fail.

[robrobrob]

You are wrong that a teacher pays for his or her pension. They pay for part of their pension. The district pays for part as well.

Agreed, that 55,000 isn't outrageous. What is outrageous? At some point their compensation becomes excessive. When does that happen?

The real problem with teachers compensation is the fact that they get paid regardless of whether they are any good. A lousy teacher should be fired. I have no problem with the top teachers getting top dollar. I do have a problem with lousy teachers getting top dollar. How do you suggest that we get rid of the bad teachers? In the private sector where you get promoted based on ability or you get a bonus based on results? So, if you aren't producing you stay and get paid less or you move on.

[Aqua Teen Carl]

Originally Posted by robrobrob

The real problem with teachers compensation is the fact that they get paid regardless of whether they are any good. A lousy teacher should be fired. I have no problem with the top teachers getting top dollar. I do have a problem with lousy teachers getting top dollar. How do you suggest that we get rid of the bad teachers? In the private sector where you get promoted based on ability or you get a bonus based on results? So, if you aren't producing you stay and get paid less or you move on.

People all seem to forget about this: Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Or how about: Effects of the 2008

Nearly a trillion of our tax dollars gone to failed companies and CEO's without a single protest. Yet people get angry about their tax dollars going to people who are shaping our country's future with middle class salary at best. We truly are fucked if we continue going down the path of destroying our own interests.