Suburbanites: What Would it Take to Entice You to Consider Urban Living? (Pittsburgh: violent crime, houses)

[Caladium]

Thinking outside the box (waaaaay outside the box) you could offer criminals and anyone else deemed undesirable $$$ to move to the burbs. Boy would that backfire, though.

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

I just want us to capture as many people "on the fence" about suburb/exurb vs. city as we can

Have you considered lassos?

[Katarina Witt]

^^

3.) Different strokes for different folks. Living with a small yard but living in Regent Square and being able to walk my children to Frick Park would be preferable in my mind to having a gigantic yard, which would require heavy maintenance and would mostly just be unused grass. Some people want more land to have a "buffer zone" between their neighbors. Others are insecure about themselves and want as much land as possible to feel better about their own social standing. I personally just want a backyard large enough for a hot tub and a front yard large enough for some sunflowers, and I'd be happy.

While this starts out as "different strokes for different folks", it degenerates into a pyscholanaysis of "why people don't do it my way" with the bold. People want big (or bigger) yards for many reasons. Just yesterday DH and I went to the garden store to buy seeds for our garden. We happen to enjoy that activity. One summer, I decided all the canned tomatoes in the grocery stores were crap, and we were going to grow enough to last all winter, canned. We didn't get *that* many, but we did have a huge crop and the canning was fun, in a perverse sort of way. We love the piles of autumn leaves, even though there are no kids to jump in them any more. (Maybe some day?)

[youngabe]

I just moved into the city myself. I was the crazy suburbanite psycho that drove the Parkways with my big SUV like a nutty because I sat in traffic for so many hours out of the month I felt like a part of me died! So, now, I travel 1.4 miles to work, sometimes via the Mon Incline and actually don't hate life! Thanks city living! ... We can turn this into a cheesy commercial.

But in all seriousness, the above is 100% true. I really am loving my new location and neighborhood. A lot of people have certain EXTREMELY untrue thoughts and stereotypes regarding the city as a whole, even the best neighborhoods. Suburbanites like my parents, (love them dearly) see a few shootings in and around "Picksburg" and it's instantly all bad. They came to visit yesterday, my Dad was almost amazed. The drive didn't bother him and he really liked Mt. Washington as a neighborhood. I find that most people actually need to take a dive and see for themselves and even then, most people aren't willing to do that.

[stburr91]

I just don't think you'll ever entice many suburbanites into the city, at least not the current generation.

If Pittsburgh can attract new jobs in large numbers, and can then justify the tax expenditure to carry out the plan to redevelop the Strip District and Lawrenceville, then maybe you could entice the next generation to stay in Pittsburgh, and live in the city.

[gg]

Originally Posted by youngabe

I just moved into the city myself. I was the crazy suburbanite psycho that drove the Parkways with my big SUV like a nutty because I sat in traffic for so many hours out of the month I felt like a part of me died! So, now, I travel 1.4 miles to work, sometimes via the Mon Incline and actually don't hate life! Thanks city living! ... We can turn this into a cheesy commercial.

There is no doubt people commuting in their huge SUVs with no other passengers in them are living one odd life. How stressful to try and impress others and deal with all that aggressive driving every weekday. If you can walk to work or ride a bike your life would instantly improve. Who wants to deal with all the texting, cell phone using, aggressive SUV drivers? Yuck!

[FreightTrainRunning]

I made an off-hand comment above about gas prices but I really think that's the only think that will bring people back to the American cities. People have pointed out how walkable European cities are and that's largely because gas/petrol costs at least twice there what it does here; people just can't afford to live that far away from work/retail. But one way or another, the current era of cheap gas is going to go away and it will be interesting to see how American suburban culture deals with that.

[gg]

Originally Posted by GeneW

I made an off-hand comment above about gas prices but I really think that's the only think that will bring people back to the American cities. People have pointed out how walkable European cities are and that's largely because gas/petrol costs at least twice there what it does here; people just can't afford to live that far away from work/retail. But one way or another, the current era of cheap gas is going to go away and it will be interesting to see how American suburban culture deals with that.

There is no doubt money is a factor. If you are fresh out of college and land a job in a city, you most likely will try and find someplace close to work to live these days, compared to the days of old when gas was a buck three eighty. Fuel prices are not going to go down much with the demands in China and India ramping up. Then the young set get used to city life and will most likely find it hard to give up the easy commute until they have kids. Then they will factor that into the equation on where to live. At the moment you have to pay for private schools to compete with the high ranking suburban schools.

I know many that want to see over $5 a gallon just to force the US to change its addiction to huge SUV's that don't brake well, can't avoid accidents well and get stupid economy because they are shaped like a box on wheels. Part of me wants to see that as well, but not quite yet. The economy is still recovering from the 8 years of horror.

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

The whole point of this thread wasn't for we urban dwellers to guilt-trip our suburban/exurban counterparts about how large their carbon footprints may or may not be.

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

Others are insecure about themselves and want as much land as possible to feel better about their own social standing. I personally just want a backyard large enough for a hot tub and a front yard large enough for some sunflowers, and I'd be happy.

Originally Posted by Katiana

While this starts out as "different strokes for different folks", it degenerates into a pyscholanaysis of "why people don't do it my way" with the bold.

I agree, and there are several examples of this in the post, not just the one Katiana posted about. If you're going to start a post by saying you don't want others to guilt-trip people, then refrain from doing so yourself. Plus, where are the solutions? I'm sure you have some good ideas, and am interested in hearing them. So far all I see is one sneer after another--let's skip that stuff and focus on ideas.

Just an observation, but if you are serious about wanting to run for office AND about using your political office to entice people to move back into the city, the worst thing you can do is to insult the people you want to entice. That sort of thing backfires big time. If I was on the fence about wanting to stay in my suburb or move to the city, a comment like that would make me defensive and, as a result, determined to stay in the suburb.

[BrianTH]

Even per capita violent crime rates do tend to be a bit higher in urban areas. It is less of a difference if you focus specifically on crime involving strangers, but you can still find a small difference.

But again, one has to consider priorities. As I noted above, the biggest threat to the physical safety of children in the U.S. is car accidents. The risk of car accidents is proportional to the amount of miles you spend in cars, the speed of the roads in question, the age of the drivers in question, and so forth.

Given all this, it doesn't make sense to minimize the local crime rate if that means your children will be living an autocentric lifestyle. Of course you don't need to entirely ignore the local crime rate either. But statistically, it makes sense to tolerate a slightly higher crime rate if that means you can get a significantly less autocentric lifestyle.

[DomerJen]

We're currently city dwellers (live in-town Atlanta, in an apt w/ our son, with one car) but we don't plan to live in the city when we move to Pgh. Schools are our #1 priority. Being the average student in the great school is going to give you a lot more opportunities, from my experience. If a teacher has a class full of low-performing students, they can't possibly teach to the higher performing ones. I hate to be so hard-lined about it, but it's the truth, and it'll take a lot of funding (that's currently being cut) to get those low-performing students in a place where they can perform (fed, safe, and secure at home).

Commute time is our #2 priority, which means we'll probably choose a house near the T in Mt. Lebo. 23 minutes to downtown is something we can stomach. Public transport is nice anyway, b/c at least you can read a book or take a nap on the way to work! In a perfect world we'd still have just one car, but not sure that's plausible.

So, what could entice us to the city? A lower cost of living. Either (much) lower property taxes, lower housing prices (in desirable 'hoods), and/or much better schools. Obviously there are people willing to pay the price already, so given the laws of supply and demand I don't see much of that changing.