same-sex parents in Pittsburgh suburbs (Philadelphia, Scranton: lower-class, renting, chapel)

[enr_pgh]

Hi, everyone! My partner and I (both females) and our six-month-old son (and our future second child) are looking to buy a house soon in the Pittsburgh area. We are currently renting in Lawrenceville and want to buy in a suburb for a better school district. We have both been teachers, so we understand the ins and outs of education, but we're not quite sure which areas would be the most accepting of us and our children. Here is how we have broken down our top choices (in order of preference), and we would appreciate any input:

1. Fox Chapel -- We love the district and the area, but for as much house as we could get for the money, it might not be worth it.
2. Shaler -- We are relatively familiar with the district, but we're not sure about its gay/gay-friendly population. Any thoughts?
3. Hampton -- We know people who live there and love the school district, but it seems to us that it is very conservative. Is this true?

We would love Mount Lebanon, but it would be too far from our families (who both live in the direction of Kittanning on 28). We both grew up in Pittsburgh suburbs, so we're fairly familiar with most of them, by the way.

We want to be close enough to the city to be able to get to it easily, though neither one of us works there, so commuting to downtown is not an issue. Ideally, we'd like a 3 bedroom, 2 bathroom house for a maximum of $150,000.

What it comes down to is that we don't want our kids to be the "only ones." You know -- we don't want our kids to be "those kids with the two moms" because there are no other same-sex parents around. Any input will be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

[SteelCityRising]

Good morning!

First off, as an openly-gay male myself I can confirm that Greater Pittsburgh has been the most LGBT-friendly area I have ever resided within. I've never lived anywhere else where I've actually seen same-sex couples walking hand-in-hand without fear of retribution; we are a liberal oasis contained within a state that has a notorious reputation for otherwise being "behind the curve" on social issues (but that's for a separate rant). I can't imagine how difficult it must have been to have grown up "different" years ago in Armstrong County as I even faced discrimination myself while growing up in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre, which is a rather heavily-populated metropolitan area, even as recent as the mid-2000s. Thankfully, though, the tide seems to be turning in our favor as more and more Americans are realizing we are not a threat to their way of life and just want to be treated as their societal equivalents.

With that vignette out of the way I will say that your best bet of those three options selected would obviously be the Fox Chapel Area School District. I feel as if that is the most diverse district of those chosen, and with a plethora of educated, well-traveled, and wordly parents there I find that even if you are going to be the only same-sex parents that the vast majority of your peers would welcome you and your child (soon-to-be children) with open arms. I'm sure h_curtis, our resident Fox Chapel Area expert, would also recommend the area to you. I don't get much of a "progressive" vibe from Shaler Township, but given its proximity to the city, safety, and relatively affordable housing stock it's a no-brainer that this community will eventually turn a corner, too, and will only improve in the coming years. I will defer to Hopes, our resident Hampton Township expert, to provide insight into the ideological philosophies of most parents in that particular part of the North Hills.

Generally speaking the suburbs are almost always going to be more conservative than cities in just about every major American metropolitan area. People in cities tend to be exposed to many more different people on a constant basis and grow to accept people for those differences (or at least tolerate them) over time. Most (not all) people who live in many American suburbs nowadays live homogeneously, grow comfortable with that sort of lifestyle, and will become startled by rapid change more than a typical city-dweller might. For example my parents' home is an an established 1970s-era subdivision in a rather affluent suburb of Scranton. When a same-sex female couple from Philadelphia was considering purchasing a home in the neighborhood back in what was probably 2003 or 2004 I was miffed, to say the least, at all of the negative "there goes the neighborhood" sort of gossip I overheard. Given that most in that neighborhood fell into that "homogeneous and comfortable" demographic and were unfamiliar with LGBT individuals outside of what FOX News told them, though, I can't say I was surprised. I just worry that you'd face similar "silent prejudice" if you moved to some of our suburban areas---places where your neighbors would smile to your face and wave as you drove by while then trash-talking your "lifestyle" as soon as you pulled into your garage. I'm a very perceptive person who relished in outwitting people in my native area who were this two-faced, and it created a lot of hostility and unpleasantness in the process.

All in all I think you're best off staying put in the East End of the City of Pittsburgh. For $150,000 you'll be very limited with your housing options in Fox Chapel. If Hopes chimes in and says Hampton Township is very welcoming of same-sex parents, then I'd give that my second nod of approval. Shaler Township seems rather conservative in nature (I mean, the community DID give rise to our incumbent conservative governor, amongst others), but I could be mistaken. I think you'll be happiest staying in the city and sending your children to charter schools and/or private schools. Buy a cheap home in the East End that is far under your $150,000 budget, live modestly, and invest the rest into financing a private education for your children. Another option would be to find a bargain-priced home within the Taylor Allderdice High School feeding pattern.

I wish you both nothing but the best of luck. I was very depressed for a long time as a result of having difficulty shirking the bullying I endured for being "different" in a socially conservative suburban area, and I just hope you don't make that same mistake in raising your own children in a similar environment because you perceive the prevailing school quality and/or overall safety of the neighborhood to be better. I would have rather lived in a less conservative and simultaneously less suburban area growing up. I would have turned out to be a better person without feeling as ostracized as I did being the only openly-gay student in my graduating high school class.

[MeinGlanzendMotorrad]

I didn't read every word he just spewed (:P) but knowing who posted it I imagine I agree with the things I didn't read. If there's one thing SCR knows it's this topic.

[ex-burgher]

I would seriously consider staying in the city and moving to the Allderdice feeder zone - for example Greenfield or South Squirrel Hill. Visit the schools before you commit to anywhere.

I went to Fox Chapel HS, it was years ago so I'm sure things could be very different today. I would say it was fairly tolerant of LGBT kids for the time period (though don't know if bullying occurred behind the scenes), so it's probably even better now. However, there were almost no minorities which bothered me. Again, things may be different today. I believe there is a larger Indian community now for one thing.
In spite of greater acceptance in today's world, anti-gay slurs are unfortunately still used to criticize people (straight ones particularly) in our schools and I suspect this climate would be worse in suburbs like Shaler and Hampton. I do think Fox Chapel would be ok though since the families would be on average more educated.

[MeinGlanzendMotorrad]

I can almost guarantee you won't find a gradeschool where kids don't call each other that three letter f word constantly.

[SteelCityRising]

Originally Posted by MeinGlanzendMotorrad

I can almost guarantee you won't find a gradeschool where kids don't call each other that three letter f word constantly.

Over time we can only hope that slur is muted out of our vocabulary. I still remember how shaken up I was one day when I was going running along a primary artery near my hometown for exercise and had several cretins scream that slur at me (with a -got suffix) from a passing school bus. I could have handled the situation better than screaming a profanity back at them at the top of my lungs, but experiences like that were the norm where I grew up. That was primarily the reason why I moved away, and areas like that will never see rebirth or recovery until their residents become more socially progressive.

[SteelCityRising]

Originally Posted by MeinGlanzendMotorrad

I didn't read every word he just spewed (:P) but knowing who posted it I imagine I agree with the things I didn't read. If there's one thing SCR knows it's this topic.

Thanks.

Succinctly:

1.) Stay in the East End, which is inarguably the most liberal oasis in Western PA. Buy a cheap home and send your children to a private/charter school OR buy a home around $150,000 in South Squirrel Hill/Greenfield (as ex-burgher said) that will be in the acclaimed Taylor Allderdice High School feeder pattern.

2.) Fox Chapel, with its generally well-educated populace, will probably also be welcoming to you, your partner, and your children; however, with a maximum housing budget of $150,000 your children will probably grow up feeling like "have-nots", which can also be psychologically damaging, especially in middle school when most kids bully one another to try to find their niche. Fox Chapel is an extremely expensive place to live. Your affordable option of Sharpsburg isn't exactly as "progressive" of an area. I can't imagine you'd avoid stares and raised eyebrows if you walked hand-in-hand with your partner down Main Street in Sharpsburg while pushing a stroller.

3.) Hampton Township (pending Hopes's nod of approval). I don't know much about this area. Sorry.

4.) Shaler Township. I really never got a liberal vibe from this area.

[gg]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

..your children will probably grow up feeling like "have-nots"..

This feeling has much more to do with parenting than other kids making yours feel that way. Even if a kid feels they are so-called rich, there is always someone that has more and I don't think kids care nearly as much as outsiders think. That kind of thing doesn't come into play like on TV shows. Kids just don't care and joke about stuff like that, it is the parents that hold those jealousies the then will bleed into the child's mind.

All this being said, you can live in the FC district fine for $150K. O'Hara and Indiana Twp and I think there is one home in FC itself that is about $170K, that might come down to around that number. You can even live in Aspinwall for that, so it isn't all that expensive around FC, but people just think of North and South Drive as well as streets like Squaw Run East and Fairview, or places in the Forest. Sure there are tons of million dollar homes, but lots of much less expensive ones as well. It is actually a very eclectic school district.

If I was the OP, I would look at FC and the city. Hampton would be my next choice and Shaler last.

[enr_pgh]

You all have been SO helpful already (especially you, SteelCityRising). Thank you! Keep it coming!

[Hopes]

I know all three areas very well. I grew up in Fox Chapel. I live in Hampton. I have lived in Shaler in the past.

You will be equally accepted/tollerated in each school district as gay parents. As a result, I recommend picking your district according to other factors too.

Keeping up with the Jones puts kids at a social disadvantage in Fox Chapel. I know Curtis will argue with me about this but it's true.

Since I already know of two households in Shaler with gay female parents, I'd say chose Shaler since others have already blazed a trail there.

But if you'd like to avoid school districts with lower-class river towns (Sharpsburg, Etna, Millvale), chose Hampton.