Comunity Project Idea - Pittsburgh's "real" Neighborhoods (Allentown: apartments, rentals)

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

The City Acres area off Middletown Road, Justine St., Straka St. are all traditionally part of Sheraden- as well as Municipal, Frontenac, Dubois and Langley Field off of Chartiers Ave. The city map has it wrong.

Makes sense. I know nothing about that area, but I noticed it had much better road connections to Sheraden than Crafton Heights. I'll take Langley Field out of any neighborhood however, since it's a large recreation center.

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

On the other side of Crafton Heights, the south side of Crafton Blvd. around Clearview, Barr and Preston are part of Crafton Heights, not Westwood. Rep. Tom Petrone lived on Barr and always was listed as being from Crafton Heights and a politician would know what neighborhood he lived in- even though he voted at Westwood School (in Westwood). I'd say that Rydal at the top of the hill is the first street in Westwood on that side.

Does this segment just go as far east as Minor Street, or over to Noblestown?

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

Also, I think there is a problem with the Crafton Heights/ Elliott border. Elliott should stretch all the way to the Greenway projects along Crucible and Dickens Street. Before they built the Greenway homes and school, it was a lot easier to see, but that was more obviously connected with Elliott if you can imagine it not being there.

So you're saying the entire area north of Steuben Street, and west of the projects, should be included? Or just those two streets?

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Does this segment just go as far east as Minor Street, or over to Noblestown?

All the way over to Noblestown, not to just to Milnor.

Bartow, Keever and Dale are all in Westwood, Preston and Barr are Crafton Heights their entire length.

So you're saying the entire area north of Steuben Street, and west of the projects, should be included? Or just those two streets?

Just those two streets, I see Elliott ending around the donut shop on Steuben, which would leave Logue and Lessing St. in Crafton Heights.

But down below on Crucible you're really close to Chartiers Ave. which is the heart of Elliott.


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[eschaton]

Two big changes to the WIP, and some minor ones.

First, I realized that Google Maps does not have a limit on shapes per page, but a limit on vectors. Thus the highly crinkly borders, following park borders, industrial corridors, and the like had to be taken out. The results have been good. While previously I was down to the North Side and just a few neighborhoods near downtown on page 1, a large subsection of the East End has jumped back onto the first page. A negative result has been the open space like Allegheny Cemetery within the city has begun to fill in again. However, I decided on the whole this isn't the worst thing, as tight delineation of neighborhood boundaries can be left in areas where populated districts directly abut.

The second thing I have begun doing is using lines to represent geographic areas not clear from a Google Map, but actually existing. Right now the code is:

Blue - City Historic Districts - In the Case of Manchester, I had to use the simplified borders that the local community group uses, as the city designated historical district looks like spaghetti.

Red - Public Housing Projects - Everything still managed by the Housing Authority. I'm not including senior housing, because they're standalone apartments which don't need to be labeled.

Orange - Mixed-Income Communities - The privately-managed communities, with some low income housing and some market rate, which have been replacing the projects. In some cases, again, I have to simplify, as there's a lot of missing teeth in a few (Bedford Hill Phase I for example). Again, senior housing is excluded.

Green - Other Residential Developments - Basically, anything large, newish, and geographically compact which is a market-rate development. Crawford Square, Federal Hill, and Somerset @ Frick are the only ones marked for now.

As a result, some neighborhood changes have been made. Glen Hazel Project is almost identical to the neighborhood (minus some vacant privately-held parcels, and a row of housing which was sold to tenants some time back). Thus Glen Hazel gets added to Hazelwood. I also took out Bedford Dwellings and Terrace Village for the same reason - both neighborhoods are largely defined by the projects/mixed housing, and can be lumped back into the Middle Hill now. The only "Project Neighborhood" left now is Northview Heights, where both the projects and the greater neighborhood are marked. I can't see a way to fix this, as the scattered housing near the projects don't logically fit in any other neighborhood.

A few more minor changes: Most of West Oakland is now in the Middle Hill, given Terrace Village is gone. Also, I took Negley Place out of Highland Park and put it into East Liberty.

[trotter_rej]

A couple of comments:

Phase 3 of Summerset at Frick Park is planned to cross Nine Mile Run and abut but not connect with the existing streets in Swisshelm Park. I assume this will extend your Squirrel Hill and Summerset borders to include it once it's complete. I would also extend the Hazelwood border to Browns Hill Road.

I don't agree that Bakery Square belongs in Shadyside, but I do understand using the busway/railroad tracks as a border. That being the case, perhaps Shadyside should extend all the way to 5th, so that when Bakery Square's 2nd phase is completed at the current Reizenstein/Schenley/Obama site, it will not be in two neighborhoods.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by trotter_rej

Phase 3 of Summerset at Frick Park is planned to cross Nine Mile Run and abut but not connect with the existing streets in Swisshelm Park. I assume this will extend your Squirrel Hill and Summerset borders to include it once it's complete.

Yes, I would have to. That said, the satellite pictures aren't the most up-to-date from what I've noticed (but better than Street View, which is four years old).

Originally Posted by trotter_rej

I would also extend the Hazelwood border to Browns Hill Road.

Done. Although that weird group of houses off Imogene arguably should be a micro-neighborhood.

Any thoughts on Greenfield? It's a difficult neighborhood for me to define. I think a lot of the Hazelwood sections up the slope are actually Greenfield (which I included here). I could see a ton of arguments about the border with Squirrel Hill though, because the two grade into each other pretty samlessly

Originally Posted by trotter_rej

I don't agree that Bakery Square belongs in Shadyside, but I do understand using the busway/railroad tracks as a border. That being the case, perhaps Shadyside should extend all the way to 5th, so that when Bakery Square's 2nd phase is completed at the current Reizenstein/Schenley/Obama site, it will not be in two neighborhoods.

That was my original configuration, which I just returned to.

[Uptown kid]

Hazelwood gets rough south of Hazelwood Ave... But that area is all proudly Hazelwood's!
Glenwoood is an entirely different area than Hazelwood... It's west of 2nd Ave, technically Gloster Street to the river... Some say it's what Hazelwood used to be

You might as well add Alington Park (in the Slopes) to the ACF too... Same for Westinghouse Park in North Pointe Brezze.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

Hazelwood gets rough south of Hazelwood Ave... But that area is all proudly Hazelwood's!

So you're saying Hazelwood Avenue is roughly the border of Hazelwood?

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

Glenwoood is an entirely different area than Hazelwood... It's west of 2nd Ave, technically Gloster Street to the river... Some say it's what Hazelwood used to be

Ahh...that little residential area tucked in between industrial sites? Always wondered about that. By "used to be" do you mean in the sense that not many black people have moved in down there? It looks pretty beat, just like the rest of Hazelwood.

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

You might as well add Alington Park (in the Slopes) to the ACF too...

I can't find any record of an Arlington Park anywhere online, except a cul-de-sac in Mount Lebanon.

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

Same for Westinghouse Park in North Pointe Brezze.

You mean Westinghouse Park is really "Homewood?"

[Uptown kid]

1. No, no the streets north of Hazelwood Ave are safe & quiet for the most part... If you were lost you probably wouldn't guess that your in Hazelwood... Though once you crosss Hazelwood Ave, you would definitely know that you're in Hazelwood, the area meet's it's reputation there (if you catch my drift).

2. I mean "used to be" by representing a poor but safe, largely white, blue collar neighborhood. Glenwood hasn't gone through any decline in terms of safety (besides drug related incidents), it's just gotten old, blighted, and by now is largely forgotten. Similar to say: Upper Spring Garden Valley, Elspen, McKees Rocks Bottoms, Etna PA, Pitcairn PA, Dravsburg PA, 10th Ward/Kirsty Park McKeesport PA, and or Duquesne PA north of Parkview Estates and the train tracks.

3. Arlington Park is on the Southside Slopes off the Arlington Avenue border... Specifically it's in-between Salisbury Street & Fort Hill Street and Fernleaf Street & Stirling Street. Unfortunately someone was killed off "Arlington Park".
http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/...slopes-629588/
4. Naw, actually it runs from MLK Epress Busway-Thomas Bvld which is North Pointe Breeze. Maybe you were thinking 'bout Homewood Playground across the Langley Mini-Bridge...

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

1. No, no the streets north of Hazelwood Ave are safe & quiet for the most part... If you were lost you probably wouldn't guess that your in Hazelwood... Though once you crosss Hazelwood Ave, you would definitely know that you're in Hazelwood, the area meet's it's reputation there (if you catch my drift).

What would you say the dividing line is then? I know the City puts the blocks on the west side of Bigelow Street in Hazelwood, but most of those have next to no connection to the rest of Hazelwood - especially the blocks around Bud Hammer Playground. Although the housing stock is pretty ratty, this area doesn't have many missing teeth either.

Originally Posted by Uptown kid

3. Arlington Park is on the Southside Slopes off the Arlington Avenue border... Specifically it's in-between Salisbury Street & Fort Hill Street and Fernleaf Street & Stirling Street. Unfortunately someone was killed off "Arlington Park".

You mean that park that essentially splits the slopes in two?

As an aside, I don't know what to do with the line of houses further down Arlington. It's technically in the Slopes, but is one row of houses between Mount Oliver borough and Saint Michael's Cemetery. I'm not going to start redefining boroughs for obvious reasons, but due to the isolation, including it in the Slopes seems wrong. Arlington? Allentown? Knoxville?

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by eschaton

You mean that park that essentially splits the slopes in two?

As an aside, I don't know what to do with the line of houses further down Arlington. It's technically in the Slopes, but is one row of houses between Mount Oliver borough and Saint Michael's Cemetery. I'm not going to start redefining boroughs for obvious reasons, but due to the isolation, including it in the Slopes seems wrong. Arlington? Allentown? Knoxville?

Wrong field, Uptown isn't talking about the Quarry St. field and the old ice rink accessible from Josephine St.

He's referring to the field on Salisbury is called "the fort", that actually was a fort built to defend Pittsburgh during the Civil War and was the upper station to the old St. Clair Incline.