Cyclist killed on Penn Ave (Swissvale, Braddock: how much, buy, school)

[szug-bot]

Originally Posted by Herodotus

The city is clueless when it comes to regulating traffic. They like to set their speed traps on roads like Rt 51, where the limit is set 5-10 mph below where it should be. This creates all types of crazy driving, as cars whip around the few people who try to obey the too low speed limit. This creates lots of opportunities for tickets to be written. I never see speed traps on roads like Penn Ave.

the police department cant be everywhere. there are 30 places i think theyd have a field day w/ tickets (boulevard of the allies, between bates and parkview avenue, for one). a resident from that area should call the councilman and complain - they will respond, i guarantee it.

they (council) are aware of the increasing dangers of the speeding and red light/stop sign running in this city.

[Herodotus]

Originally Posted by szug-bot

the police department cant be everywhere. there are 30 places i think theyd have a field day w/ tickets (boulevard of the allies, between bates and parkview avenue, for one). a resident from that area should call the councilman and complain - they will respond, i guarantee it.

they (council) are aware of the increasing dangers of the speeding and red light/stop sign running in this city.

They do a poor job of setting the speed limit in many areas. Rt 51 is a perfect example. 35 mph between Woodruff and Warrington is too slow. It's a divided highway. By putting the limit too slow, they encourge disrespect of the law. The few drivers who attempt to follow the limit have cars whipping around them like crazy. Since everyone is going above the limit, the fools feel like they have the green light to travel at any speed they want. Highway engineers will tell you that if everyone is speeding, the limit is probably set too low. People on this board were rejoicing about the decision to remove parking from a section of Carson St., but watch speeds increase. Traffic moves noticeably slower on streets with parked cars. That's why Liberty is like a highway, compared to Penn going through the Strip.

[Q-tip motha]

Originally Posted by PittsburghLlama

I feel like a lot of people don't realize that in most cases, the worst punishment you'll get for hitting a cyclist with your car is a ticket for disobeying the 4-foot rule and an increase in your insurance payment. If more people were privy to this information, they might be more keen to hang around for a bit, and maybe see if the person they hit needed assistance...

Even so, it is absolutely terrifying to me that there are people out there who will leave the scene after they hit a person with their vehicle. I can't even imagine running over someone and never knowing whether or not they were all right. I feel like that sort of thing should weigh on the mind of many, but, I suppose it's not something that weighs on the mind of all.

Just to play devil's advocate:

-Most people don't know what the legal ramifications are for hitting a cyclist
-Who knows how any one person's decision making ability will be altered in a traumatic stressful circumstance like this
-The civil liability and long term consequences even if you were in the right and it was contributory negligence on their part (potentially going to jail, damaged personal relationships, loss of employment) make it definately worth it to make a run for it if you have the chance.


As far as living with it goes, people can rationalize their way through a lot.

[Q-tip motha]

Originally Posted by zip95

My heart goes out to the victim and his family and I hope the driver is caught, but ultimately we are all responsible for our own safety. You would never, in a million years, see me biking on Penn Ave and definitely not during rush hour. All adults should understand that irregardless of the law there are always scofflaws and aholes... Its just a fact of life. And to place your life in the hands of these idiots is something intelligent rational people should not do.

I dont mean to be insensitive.

Insensitive perhaps, but also true.

When you are riding a motorcycle or a bike on a road with thousand pound (or bigger) vehicles it doesn't matter if you're the safest person in the world. Someone merely not paying attention for one second or two can inadvertantly kill you, and no amount of defensive riding will change that. Its a risk that all need to understand before they embrace these two means of transportation. I get annoyed when I see "Watch for motorcycle" stickers on cars because it diminishes this extremely important truth and implies that other motorists can be alert and attentive 100% of the time so that they can enjoy their extremely unprotected means of transportation. Humans are imperfect beings and its simply not possible. My 3 yr old niece lost her 27yr old dad this past March in Orlando because he didn't heed that lesson.

I'm not attempting to victim blame here. Its pretty clear in this instance that the other driver was in the wrong. Small consolation though to the family of the guy who was killed.

[SteelCityRising]

Originally Posted by ForYourLungsOnly

penn is just awful all around. cannot stand that road.

One thing I really hate about that stretch of Penn Avenue is that people idiotically insist on parking in the right-hand lane of the eastbound direction in front of the Evergreen Cafe. I can't tell you how many times I've been cut off in the left-hand lane by motorists who just veer into my lane without signaling at 45 miles per hour. Parking should NOT be allowed on that portion of Penn Avenue.

Originally Posted by scottrpriester

I'm very sorry to know it was an acquaintance of yours. Even now, with that big wide crosswalk, big overhanging sign and lights, people still don't stop.

With all due respect, scott, as someone who has had his vehicles struck numerous times by horrible local drivers during my brief tenure here I also don't stop at this crosswalk for fear that the vehicle tailgating me on South Braddock Avenue will rear-end me if I DO stop. As a point of reference the other evening while working my second job I noticed a Prius in the oncoming lane (southbound) had stopped to permit a mother pushing a stroller to cross at the crosswalk so I instinctively also stopped to wave her into the crosswalk. The driver behind me almost rear-ended me and had the audacity to blare his horn.

Let's face it. The East End is exploding in additional surface street congestion, and that will only get worse with a growing population coupled with decreasing mass transit options. Sadly, I expect to see more---not fewer---hit-and-run incidents as the years progress.

[Scott2187]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

With all due respect, scott, as someone who has had his vehicles struck numerous times by horrible local drivers during my brief tenure here I also don't stop at this crosswalk for fear that the vehicle tailgating me on South Braddock Avenue will rear-end me if I DO stop. As a point of reference the other evening while working my second job I noticed a Prius in the oncoming lane (southbound) had stopped to permit a mother pushing a stroller to cross at the crosswalk so I instinctively also stopped to wave her into the crosswalk. The driver behind me almost rear-ended me and had the audacity to blare his horn.

An officer should stake out crosswalks like this once in a while... After all, it is state law to yield for pedestrians in a crosswalk.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by SteelCityRising

With all due respect, scott, as someone who has had his vehicles struck numerous times by horrible local drivers during my brief tenure here I also don't stop at this crosswalk for fear that the vehicle tailgating me on South Braddock Avenue will rear-end me if I DO stop.

As I taught my children when teaching them to drive, stop worrying about what's behind you and focus on what's in front of you! If you're going the speed limit on that stretch of road, being rear-ended will be minimal damage to you and your car compared to the damage done to pedestrians if you hit them. And the driver rear-ending you will be at fault, but if you hit a pedestrian, it's your fault.

[Q-tip motha]

Originally Posted by Scott2187

An officer should stake out crosswalks like this once in a while... After all, it is state law to yield for pedestrians in a crosswalk.

This does not mean that you can simply step out into a crosswalk at any that you wish. That and being 'right' is small consolation when you're in the hospital with a dozen or so broken bones.

[Hopes]

I've always wondered if a crosswalk is supposed to be 100% clear before proceeding.

http://www.dvrpc.org/transportation/...di_PennDOT.pdf

I try to wait until the entire crosswalk is clear, but that's difficult to do sometimes.

It seems we simply need to not hit them and can proceed once there is ample room.

But nobody can definitively answer that question for me.

[jimmyev]

Originally Posted by Scott2187

An officer should stake out crosswalks like this once in a while... After all, it is state law to yield for pedestrians in a crosswalk.

The speed limit on South Braddock is 25mph. This is perfect for installing speed humps, which should be installed before the pedestrian crossings and at other random places along S Braddock. If the speed limit on Penn is 25mph it also need speed humps but I think it's 35mph. If proper engineering were done to accommodate drivers, pedestrians and bicyclists, accidents like these wouldn't be such a pervasive problem. Theoretically the only roads designed strictly for automobiles should be limited access highways.