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Just a thought on your Northside map (I searched but couldn't find a thread for it). I'm fascinated by good/bad neighborhoods and how they change over time, and Pittsburgh is by far my favorite city. You have the populated areas immediately bordering Northview Heights labeled as "in serious decline." Are you aware of a trend of these neighborhoods specifically to be in serious decline due to their proximity to the projects (spillover crime or something of the like)? When I drove through them, I thought they looked pretty average, surprisingly good for being right next to the projects. Is this changing? I'd guess that these neighborhoods have been right next to the projects for as long as the projects have existed, and the projects don't look new, so I'd be surprised if they're declining more recently than they have been for years. Is crime spiking or something of the like?
Pittsburgh has a surprising number of projects located in and near otherwise safe neighborhoods. Spring Hill is my favorite neighborhood in Pittsburgh, and even it has a little project in the middle of it. I have never felt unsafe driving or walking near it though. Maybe they're selective with who gets to live there, and they put the real criminals in Northview Heights? Who knows.
That whole area around Northview Heights is, in my opinion, the most dangerous area in Pittsburgh (with the exception of Homewood). I accidently got lost up there a few years back, and it is truly a dangerous place to be, even during the day.
This was the hardest one yet. In retrospect, I should have split the region into two somehow, but there were no logical splits (except that Hays/New Homestead/Lincoln Place didn't need to go here, but I didn't know where to put them in any case).
One note here is I decided to not include, for the most part, the actual main thoroughfares through South Pittsburgh (Banksville Road, West Liberty Avenue, Library Road, and Saw Mill Run Boulevard) in the neighborhoods. This was for a few reasons.
1. The roads tend to divide neighborhoods, not run through them.
2. The topography means these commercial districts aren't well linked to the hilly neighborhoods above.
3. In most places, only a handful of people actually live on or near these streets, since most of the housing was cleared out to make way for commercial ventures.
Anyway, next to the West End (which will be my last map, unless I do the burbs), I probably know the least about South Pittsburgh. I'd be most interested if you guys think I should divide up a few neighborhoods, as some (like Brookline) are huge!
First, I'd throw Knoxville into the "red" color. I think Knoxville is just as, or more dangerous as Beltzhoover. Beltz has few residents left, and therefore doesn't have nearly the amount of problems it had over the past 10 years.
Next, I don't really think Brookline is gentrifying. Its a very stable neighborhood, and hasn't had that much of a decline besides the slight population loss over the past 30 years. I'd put it in as green.
Finally, I think Beechview should be split into two separate areas. The northern part of Beechview should be a mix of orange and yellow. Its not a huge decline, but its definitely on a decline and having more crime issues than it used to. By contrast, south Beechview is still fine, and should be green.
That whole area around Northview Heights is, in my opinion, the most dangerous area in Pittsburgh (with the exception of Homewood). I accidently got lost up there a few years back, and it is truly a dangerous place to be, even during the day.
Whoa! I got lost near Northview Heights this afternoon! I didn't venture into it, though, as I figured it would be a dead end, and went left Down Beech...I was trying to find a shortcut from the North Side to Millvale without using 28 or Butler St. (It worked, eventually, after winding through a bunch of U shaped streets in Troy Hill).
Back on topic - First broad impression of the map is positive...these maps are pretty cool!
Quote:
Originally Posted by speagles84
Another great map!
First, I'd throw Knoxville into the "red" color. I think Knoxville is just as, or more dangerous as Beltzhoover. Beltz has few residents left, and therefore doesn't have nearly the amount of problems it had over the past 10 years.
Next, I don't really think Brookline is gentrifying. Its a very stable neighborhood, and hasn't had that much of a decline besides the slight population loss over the past 30 years. I'd put it in as green.
Finally, I think Beechview should be split into two separate areas. The northern part of Beechview should be a mix of orange and yellow. Its not a huge decline, but its definitely on a decline and having more crime issues than it used to. By contrast, south Beechview is still fine, and should be green.
I tend to agree with the above comments. Regarding gentrification in Brookline, although it never "declined" like what neighborhoods usually do prior to what is normally called gentrifying occurs, it seems to be undergoing some revitalization within - as Eschaton pointed out - the somewhat empty Brookline Blvd. business district.
A theme I've seen in these maps is: a housing project is closed down, former residents then creep in to adjacent stable neighborhoods with their Section 8 vouchers, and general decline ensues as the stable residents leave. It would be nice to see that cycle end one day.
Whoa! I got lost near Northview Heights this afternoon! I didn't venture into it, though, as I figured it would be a dead end, and went left Down Beech...I was trying to find a shortcut from the North Side to Millvale without using 28 or Butler St. (It worked, eventually, after winding through a bunch of U shaped streets in Troy Hill).
Back on topic - First broad impression of the map is positive...these maps are pretty cool!
I tend to agree with the above comments. Regarding gentrification in Brookline, although it never "declined" like what neighborhoods usually do prior to what is normally called gentrifying occurs, it seems to be undergoing some revitalization within - as Eschaton pointed out - the somewhat empty Brookline Blvd. business district.
A theme I've seen in these maps is: a housing project is closed down, former residents then creep in to adjacent stable neighborhoods with their Section 8 vouchers, and general decline ensues as the stable residents leave. It would be nice to see that cycle end one day.
Yeah I'm not sure why, but Northview Heights terrifies me. I've gotten lost in North Philly at 11 at night and that place is scarier to me.
But yeah, I love Brookline. Its my favorite city neighborhood. I hope one day the BLVD is thriving like it was during the 60's and 70's when my dad grew up there.
A lot of South Side houses don't come on the market because they are (rather profitable) student rentals. I think that if you check Duquesne's website, craigslist, etc., you'll see this. Blogs talk about it, and even the wikipedia article on the Flats notes that it is home to a large student population. The student-age population was 16.5% in 2000 and has only increased since then.
The thing is, 20somethings are often one of the top gentrifying groups. If I include Southside under this rubric, is Bloomfield a student-dominated area now? Lawrenceville? Polish Hill?
Quote:
Originally Posted by speagles84
First, I'd throw Knoxville into the "red" color. I think Knoxville is just as, or more dangerous as Beltzhoover. Beltz has few residents left, and therefore doesn't have nearly the amount of problems it had over the past 10 years.
I said I was on the fence about it. I think the area north of Bausman is undoubtedly a ghetto, but I don't know about the area to the south, which seems in decline, but not quite there yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by speagles84
Next, I don't really think Brookline is gentrifying. Its a very stable neighborhood, and hasn't had that much of a decline besides the slight population loss over the past 30 years. I'd put it in as green.
The light blue means "beginning to gentrify," so part of it is identifying new trends. Brookline does seem like the sort of place that's been getting more buzz in the city as of late.
Quote:
Originally Posted by speagles84
Finally, I think Beechview should be split into two separate areas. The northern part of Beechview should be a mix of orange and yellow. Its not a huge decline, but its definitely on a decline and having more crime issues than it used to. By contrast, south Beechview is still fine, and should be green.
Where would you put the line? Crane or further south? FWIW, most of the Mexicans have been moving into North Beechview.
An aside here is I wonder if I should have two different colors of orange, one to signify slow decline. and one for steep decline. There are a lot of places (like South Carrick, or the part of Mount Washington I highlighted) where property values are still falling, and you'd be crazy to buy, but they don't have a gang problem or high crime...yet.
I said I was on the fence about it. I think the area north of Bausman is undoubtedly a ghetto, but I don't know about the area to the south, which seems in decline, but not quite there yet.
Why not just divide it up like that then? Did you hit the limit for the number of shapes on a single map?
For what it's worth, I agree with your assessment. I was interested in a few houses in Knoxville a while back (under $30K, really nice) and did a few drive-bys before bothering my agent to set up a viewing. It's the only part of the city where I've had people act a little menacingly towards me. I wasn't even on foot! I didn't feel truly in danger, but I definitely felt unwelcome. Needless to say, I never did set up a viewing for those homes. It's a shame because Knoxville is a pretty neat area as far as the built environment goes.
Even driving in Homewood and the Hill I haven't had people stare at me like that before.
Quote:
An aside here is I wonder if I should have two different colors of orange, one to signify slow decline. and one for steep decline. There are a lot of places (like South Carrick, or the part of Mount Washington I highlighted) where property values are still falling, and you'd be crazy to buy, but they don't have a gang problem or high crime...yet.
This brings up an interesting question. Do you worry at all that publishing these maps could have unintended side effects? (especially if they end up being stickied)
I know there's only a few dozen regular posters on this forum, but go take a look at how many views your posts have and you'll be shocked. City-data is a widely read site and often shows up in google search results. So when you take an area like Bon Air, Carrick, Brightwood, etc. and basically say "They aren't bad now, but I don't see how they can avoid becoming bad", do you think there's any actual effect from having that notion spread around?
1. I decided to use two different colors to represent different levels of decline. A lighter orange merely signifies areas facing declining property values, but no real safety issues. Sort of "buyers beware, but renters don't need to be terrified." Dark orange I'm saving for only those areas which are declining in both housing values and safety rapidly.
2. Knoxville is split, with the north as a ghetto, and the south in rapid decline.
3. Declining Mount Washington now in slight decline.
4. Allentown split, with the portion east of Arlington Avenue in slight decline, and the rest in rapid decline.
5. Carrick also split, with the dividing line based upon where Uptown Kid noted gangs were active in Carrick.
6. Mount Oliver and Saint Clair shown separately, with both in slight decline.
7. Brookline changed to stable.
8. A few more microneighborhoods added.
9. I was leaking onto a second page, so I had to take Hays/New Homestead/Lincoln Place out. I'll either add them to the Lower East End map (sounds weird, but they do go to Allderdice) or put them on their own map.
Good work as usual. I only have one problem and I don't think it's my eyes/monitor since everything else shows up fine. I assume the color you used for Arlington Heights is supposed to be brown, but on my screen, in the legend on the left frame it shows up as some kind of greyish purple, i.e. it's almost the same color as Grandview, only a little more bland. It turns out OK on the map, I guess because of transparency.
Also, are you going to do a thread where you post the links to all of your maps before you consider making them "sticky"? -Just saying IMO it would be a good idea...
I vote that when you are finished you make one single thread which Yac can then pin... Nice work
Edit: I didn't see the Uptown Kid's post directly above this one... I vote Sticky!
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