An Alarming Number Of Businesses Are Leaving East Liberty (Oakmont: credit, hotel)

[PittsburghLlama]

Wow, that news about the Shadow Lounge is incredibly upsetting. Why someone would go to such lengths to uproot an establishment that has left only positive marks on the city is beyond me. Argh, infuriating. I much preferred EL in its grittier state.

I'm with the Captain on this one, the Shadow Lounge in the Northside would be A.Mazing.

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by CFP

You have no idea what you're talking about. Shadyside is the main retail area for the East End. That cannot be disputed.

And the URA issues did not begin to crush EL until the late 70's, early 80's. I know that first hand because I grew up in the area; my father worked in EL and we were always going to movies, out to dinner, and buying stuff in the neighborhood back then. That is until Sears left and Mansmann's closed.

East Liberty Then: Initial makeover had dismal results

Shadyside has high end retail, but you couldn't buy what you need to live regular life. Target, Home Depot, and Trade Joe's, Whole Foods, those are all essentials that nobody can live decently without <citation needed>.

The article you link to shows the URA's process started in 1960. It may have reached the bottom in the 70's but "the beginning" happened well before.

[CFP]

Originally Posted by AaronPGH

You are really fighting a losing argument here, CFP. I'm not really sure why you're constantly hitching yourself to this particular train when the evidence is overwhelmingly against you and will be even more so in the next year or two.

It's simple - I detest spin and propaganda. I know the area like the back of my hand, and manufactured optimism for the area's prospects does not match observable reality.

[globalburgh]

The OP for this thread is spin and propaganda.

[AaronPGH]

Originally Posted by CFP

It's simple - I detest spin and propaganda.

So to put down all this "spin and propaganda", you create a thread that only posts every business that is moving or has closed (with no mention of why a certain business like Babyland may not even be feasible in the city these days). And you also don't talk about a single other business that has arrived or is on its way to replace these things.

Cool. Makes sense.

[groar]

Originally Posted by PittsburghLlama

Wow, that news about the Shadow Lounge is incredibly upsetting. Why someone would go to such lengths to uproot an establishment that has left only positive marks on the city is beyond me. Argh, infuriating. I much preferred EL in its grittier state.

I'm with the Captain on this one, the Shadow Lounge in the Northside would be A.Mazing.

yeah it sucks, but as you obviously can see, it's actually a symptom of gentrification, not a sign of decline as the OP is trying to imply. whether that gentrification is a good thing is a different issue!

[XRiteMA98]

I am not so sure why all this is alarming. Stores come and go in Sq hill as well - Murray Ave and Forbes.

I'm with Hopes that Walnut st. should have never ever seen chain stores; only boutiques. Who would buy there after all?

[ML North]

I'm not alarmed.

Borders was a national chain that filed for bankruptcy, likely due to the growing popularity of e-readers and internet shopping.

Babyland, a 60 year old family business, also likely closed because of the increasing competition from big box retailers and internet shopping.

Shadow Lounge was, apparently, the target of a nefarious smear campaign, purportedly aimed at acquiring the space it occupied.

Waffle Shop was "supposed to be a one-semester project for a Carnegie Mellon University art class taught by associate professor Jon Rubin" that carried on for more than three years longer than expected. I would consider that to be a success.

So those four cases, at least, have too many externalities to effectively isolate the neighborhood dynamic.

More importantly, I would point to rising rental costs as an indicator that demand for commercial real estate in East Liberty remains strong. Naturally there will be some "churn" of the occupants, but it's hard to make a case that demand is decreasing -- or that the neighborhood isn't on the upswing -- when rents are increasing.

[CFP]

Originally Posted by globalburgh

The OP for this thread is spin and propaganda.

I'm not sure why I have to explain these things to adults, but spin and propaganda are tools used by an entity attempting to sell a product or an idea. I am not attempting to sell anything so your reply does not make any sense whatsoever. Making an observation based on fact is not the same as selling an idea.

I am deconstructing the manufactured fable that the revitalization of East Liberty is a success. If business owners were truly positive and optimistic about the neighborhood's prospects then they wouldn't be leaving the area. It's you guys who are trying to spin the facts, not I.

[AaronPGH]

I feel really bad about Shadow Lounge. They *have* been there for years and were one of the first to plunk down. With that said, the sound issues are real. When they have a loud show there, you can hear the bands and DJs across all of East Liberty.

Back when they opened there was no need for any form of sound proofing – as there were no other businesses or residential around. They could just bang it out as loud as they wanted with no problems or complaints.

Obviously the best case scenario would be for all of these new developers to chip in and help them fix this, but that's not going to happen. It's an extremely difficult storefront to do soundproofing with because of the huge windows and older construction. They'd basically have to build a room inside of an already small room, with air and soundproofing in between. It's not exactly a graceful way to handle things. Add to the fact that they don't actually own the building, risk their rent going up after dropping a huge chunk of change to properly soundproof and you can understand why they are looking for a new spot to purchase outright.

AVA lounge is staying put and that's great. They get to keep their feet planted down there, and they also get to custom build/own somewhere else. It's probably the best case scenario for them, honestly. I've heard rumors of Larimer as where they are headed next.