Developers build in East Liberty while Pittsburgh employment stagnates (Moscow: groceries, shoppers)

[theta_sigma]

I was just walking around down there this afternoon (Penn west of Highland) and ye gods those wide sidewaks with no shade or streetscaping to speak of make it feel like a blasted wasteland on a hot summer afternoon. I nearly started humming "Horse With No Name." They need to get some plants or something happening and also that Novum building is a hideous eyesore.

[bradjl2009]

Originally Posted by theta_sigma

I was just walking around down there this afternoon (Penn west of Highland) and ye gods those wide sidewaks with no shade or streetscaping to speak of make it feel like a blasted wasteland on a hot summer afternoon. I nearly started humming "Horse With No Name." They need to get some plants or something happening and also that Novum building is a hideous eyesore.

Yeah some blocks in East Liberty's business district really need some streetscape improvements.

[selltheburgh]

Originally Posted by bradjl2009

Yeah some blocks in East Liberty's business district really need some streetscape improvements.

The church did a great job with their rain garden, but the rest of Penn is empty. The sad thing is that trees take many many years to grow tall.

I heard a rumor that Novum is leaving. Not sure if that's true or not.

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by selltheburgh

I heard a rumor that Novum is leaving. Not sure if that's true or not.

Would make sense if they could find a better or cheaper location.


A place which pays people to be subjects for medical experiments doesn't need to be in the new, snooty East Liberty. Novum was originally called "Biodecision" and has been in East Liberty since the 80's at least. When I signed up for unemployment in 1982, the unemployment office wanted to send me there for a "job" as a test subject. I didn't go, BTW.


The plasma donation place on Baum near the library left a few years ago, and attracted the same kind of hard-luck clientele.

[eschaton]

I presume that the next major link in the chain to be redeveloped will be the Shakespeare Giant Eagle. Once the East Liberty TOD is finished that land will be too valuable to continue to waste on a giant parking lot and a strip mall focused on a low-income clientele.

The Village of Eastside could easily be redone in stages. The way I would do it would be to build a street-fronting midrise where the McDonalds is first, and then move on to redevelop the rest of the complex.

One thing people always should keep in mind about East Liberty is it was originally built as a true downtown, not as a commercial strip within a residential area like business districts elsewhere. I think people understand this to some degree with the businesses on Highland, Baum, and Centre, but they tend to forget about Broad Street existing. Theoretically speaking a lot of sleepy streets in East Liberty, like Beatty and Whitfield, could develop a street presence as time goes on as well. There's still a few old storefronts there, and Ace and Indigo will breathe some new life onto these streets.

One final aside - what is the revamped East Liberty Transit Center actually going to mean in terms of PAT's network. For example, are the 71's going to stop there now to unload all their passengers, who will take the Busway into downtown or Oakland?

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I presume that the next major link in the chain to be redeveloped will be the Shakespeare Giant Eagle. Once the East Liberty TOD is finished that land will be too valuable to continue to waste on a giant parking lot and a strip mall focused on a low-income clientele.

The Village of Eastside could easily be redone in stages. The way I would do it would be to build a street-fronting midrise where the McDonalds is first, and then move on to redevelop the rest of the complex.

The East Liberty Giant Eagle seems strategically located for its clientele on the bus routes, there always seems to be patrons with their groceries waiting on the bus on Penn Ave. The other stores in the complex are doing ok as well, Family Dollar is opening more locations, there is a State Store in the center as well.

I guess if the goal is to get the lower income people out of East Liberty, razing the shopping center has to be done. But does Giant Eagle even want to move, and where would they move to?

[UKyank]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

But does Giant Eagle even want to move, and where would they move to?

I'd be shocked if they went anywhere

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

The East Liberty Giant Eagle seems strategically located for its clientele on the bus routes, there always seems to be patrons with their groceries waiting on the bus on Penn Ave. The other stores in the complex are doing ok as well, Family Dollar is opening more locations, there is a State Store in the center as well.

I guess if the goal is to get the lower income people out of East Liberty, razing the shopping center has to be done. But does Giant Eagle even want to move, and where would they move to?

I understand your point, but at the same time there are a wide array of places to buy food within a mile radius of there now. I don't see too many black faces in Trader Joe's or Whole Foods, but there are plenty in both Market District and Target, and I don't think they're all "buppies" by any means. I haven't been in the Aldi on Baum yet, but given the prices there tend to be affordable, I think plenty of people in the area of more modest means would be willing to shop there. And of course, there's a Bottom Dollar now in Garfield, which probably evaporated any traffic the Shakespere Giant Eagle was getting from Garfield, and is only a ten-minute walk from Penn Plaza or New Pennley Place. So that's six different groceries nearby - pretty incredible when you think about how the entire North Side, for example, has only one full-service grocery store.

Famil Dollar will always be able to find other locations - plenty of vacant buildings on Frankstown and Hamilton to go around. And given there's a Wine & Spirits right in Eastside, the Shakespeare one seems too close for long-term stability anyway.

As to why they would want to move, it all depends. I'm pretty sure that Giant Eagle is a franchise, not directly owned. I don't know if they actually own the property though. If they just lease it, I would expect at some point their landlords will want to cash out. But if they directly own it, presumably they'll attempt to stay as long as staying is more profitable than selling the business.

[I_Like_Spam]

Originally Posted by eschaton

As to why they would want to move, it all depends. I'm pretty sure that Giant Eagle is a franchise, not directly owned. I don't know if they actually own the property though. If they just lease it, I would expect at some point their landlords will want to cash out. But if they directly own it, presumably they'll attempt to stay as long as staying is more profitable than selling the business.

Some Giant Eagles are franchises, but the East Liberty location is a corporate one. And it looks like they own the location, the property owner for the shopping center is "Kappa Properties" with the same address as Giant Eagle headquarters up in RIDC Blawnox.


The Shakespeare St. store replaced like 3 previous Giant Eagles that used to be on Penn Ave in Garfield, North Highland and North Murtland near Westinghouse.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

Some Giant Eagles are franchises, but the East Liberty location is a corporate one. And it looks like they own the location, the property owner for the shopping center is "Kappa Properties" with the same address as Giant Eagle headquarters up in RIDC Blawnox.


The Shakespeare St. store replaced like 3 previous Giant Eagles that used to be on Penn Ave in Garfield, North Highland and North Murtland near Westinghouse.

Given Market District is directly owned by Giant Eagle as well, the question needs to be asked if it's actually profitable for them to have two different stores less than a mile apart, especially because there is some overlap between the clientele of the two stores as it is.

In the best of times, running a grocery is a high-volume, low margin business. And given the wide range of competition, and decline in lower-income customers in East Liberty, I can't see the store being more profitable today than it was ten years ago.