Who's afraid of a Beltway? (Pittsburgh, Penn Hills: apartment, rent, living in)

[Der Schwabe]

Can you imagine what would happen if we took a fraction of the money such an expansion would require and invested it in serious public transportation improvement? We don't have the PennDot funds as it is for the maintenance required on the roads we have. Frankly, though the backups can be atrocious for certain corridors at certain times, if you're living in Robinson and commuting downtown, do you expect that to be no hassle?

Live closer or deal with the commute. Increased capacity leads to increased traffic. Full stop.

[PghYinzer]

The term inner city cracks me up. I know what was meant by it, but I can't help but think of Chevy Chase in National Lampoons Vacation. People think this is what they will find....

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by Gnutella

So what if if a married couple bought a house in Penn Hills when they both had jobs in Monroeville, but then one of their jobs was transferred out to Moon Township?

Divorce. It's got a 50% chance of happening anyway, plus he's really let himself go and she could do so much better.

More seriously, if you build a beltway, that type of situation is more likely to happen because it will be easier for employers to put jobs in those kinds of places if there are better roads to them. That's how roads get built but traffic jams never seem to decrease for long.

[pman]

Originally Posted by Moby Hick

And that's great for them, I just don't see how that is a problem that the state and feds should spend billions of dollars to fix, especially when the current gas taxes aren't even sufficient to maintain the highways we've already built.

nailed it. they can not go to the "inner city" just fine as it is. of course if no one was going to the city then the tunnels wouldn't have traffic.

[_Buster]

It doesn't matter that the housing trend is toward infill in cities - it's the businesses relocating to the suburbs that are the issue with a beltway - they don't follow trends for the most part, they just follow cost/benefit. They would defintely move towards a Pittsburgh beltway if it was built - look at all the cities that have them, they have suburban sprawl everywhere and fairly dead cores (DC is the exception, but that is due to the fed govt and massive traffic issues, as well as the Metro and solid quality old housing stock in the city). But the beltway completion was one of the main reasons that the core of DC was such a ****hole from the 80s into the 90s - all the business went to Maryalnd and Virginia near the beltway. After the businesses go there then it easy for people in the suburbs to get there, and they soon follow with lots of cul-de-sac developments like soulless Cranberry.

Pittsburgh is just not well suited for a beltway, either geographically or culturally.

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

The under-river tunnel, and other transportation projects in the core area rely on tax dollars raised from suburban people.

That's why they run to sports facilities and casinos instead of where they might be of most use for commuters who use transit.

[Der Schwabe]

Originally Posted by Gnutella

So what if if a married couple bought a house in Penn Hills when they both had jobs in Monroeville, but then one of their jobs was transferred out to Moon Township?

Tough luck. Plenty of people make the drive. Billions of dollars of infrastructure won't be completed before their jobs are transferred again.

Originally Posted by I_Like_Spam

The tax money goes both ways, of course. The under-river tunnel, and other transportation projects in the core area rely on tax dollars raised from suburban people.

Those federal tax dollars come from all kinds of people, and who do you think disproportionately benefits from a T and tunnel that takes you from the outer South Hills suburbs to the Pirates/Penguins/Steelers games?

[PghYinzer]

Originally Posted by GeneW

Why is it my job to support their irrational fears with my tax money?

Originally Posted by Gnutella

So what if if a married couple bought a house in Penn Hills when they both had jobs in Monroeville, but then one of their jobs was transferred out to Moon Township?

I guess the one has a miserable commute, finds a new job closer to home, or they move to the middle. Those are three possible decisions that they can make. Their situation will change (or not change) depending on what they do. However, I dont think we should be building massive highways to accomodate those who have options, but do not use them wisely.

[ferraris]

Originally Posted by Hopes

I don't see the point. I get around the metro just fine.

It took me almost an hour (5:45pm to 6:40pm) to drive not even four miles from the North Shore to Oakland yesterday. I wonder how many people on the parkways were just passing through downtown.

Originally Posted by Der Schwabe

Can you imagine what would happen if we took a fraction of the money such an expansion would require and invested it in serious public transportation improvement?

Exactly! I don't see the point of building huge infrastructure and development near people who inherently don't want lots of infrastructure and development (that's why they live in the suburbs). I won't even mention the other advantages of transit.

[Lobick]

This strikes me as the most important point made in the article:

The Pennsylvania Turnpike and I-79 are highways that serve the main purpose of a beltway — giving through traffic a way to bypass the center city, Mr. Zapinski said.
It could even be argued that those highways and I-70 form a sort of beltway, albeit one that is much farther out from the city than a typical beltway.

If we already have highways that serve the "main purpose" of a beltway, why in the world would we spend some of the precious little resources dedicated to transportation on this?