Cultural Trust Poised to develop "Ocean Front Property" (Pittsburgh: real estate, 2015)

[Rocket88]

It is great to finally hear something on this after all these years. It makes no sense for that prime land to be parking lots given how hot Downtown is now. We should hear more and get the ball rolling in 2016. Pittsburgh Cultural Trust maintains diverse real estate portfolio to support arts | Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

[Geeo]

The plans they unveiled before the recession were pretty impressive. Wonder if they are going to follow the same plan or try a different approach? I believe residential will still be a big component, and it will be nice to see if they include another theater or park. That really is prime property in the center of so much activity downtown.

[Rocket88]

It had been too long since we heard anything on this. That was baffling given the value of the property. I guess the legal matters with the original developer Concord Eastridge had to be cleared. It was 2006 when the plans were first unveiled. Hopefully the Trust will get a developer soon. For those who were not around in 2006 or not familiar here are some renderings that are mostly conceptual, but give an idea of the scale.http://www.google.com/url?q=http://b...OI-psVg-k5dmMA

[PIT2MAD]

It's crazy how much prime land is essentially a blank slate for development. North shore, Almono, vast swaths of the Allegheny riverfront, Civic Arena, the area mentioned in this article, much of the South Shore.

Harkening back to the thread on the next 'hoods to do a 180, this abundance of prime land wil certainly slow a lot of neighborhood redevelopment. Will we really see the current building boom continue past the point of filling out all of these blank slates while still carrying enough momentum to fill in the missing teeth in places like the Hill, Garfield, and Hazelwood, and still allow neighborhoods like Carnegie, Southern Hilltop (pick one), and/or sketchy North Side locales see stabilization as well? The yinzer in me says yes while the realist in me thinks it can't possibly continue at this clip for much longer.

Thoughts?

[Paul2421]

Originally Posted by PIT2MAD

It's crazy how much prime land is essentially a blank slate for development. North shore, Almono, vast swaths of the Allegheny riverfront, Civic Arena, the area mentioned in this article, much of the South Shore.

Harkening back to the thread on the next 'hoods to do a 180, this abundance of prime land wil certainly slow a lot of neighborhood redevelopment. Will we really see the current building boom continue past the point of filling out all of these blank slates while still carrying enough momentum to fill in the missing teeth in places like the Hill, Garfield, and Hazelwood, and still allow neighborhoods like Carnegie, Southern Hilltop (pick one), and/or sketchy North Side locales see stabilization as well? The yinzer in me says yes while the realist in me thinks it can't possibly continue at this clip for much longer.

Thoughts?

I agree with you and it is pretty disappointing. I predict a surplus of luxury housing without the high paying jobs to fill them, and a migration to the high end housing from the places such as Lawrenceville, Shadyside, etc. People will then move from the blighted areas and fill these areas, leading to further degradation of the bad areas.

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by lettert

I agree with you and it is pretty disappointing. I predict a surplus of luxury housing without the high paying jobs to fill them, and a migration to the high end housing from the places such as Lawrenceville, Shadyside, etc. People will then move from the blighted areas and fill these areas, leading to further degradation of the bad areas.

I think most of what is called "luxury housing" in this context is just normal, middle class housing for single people. No developer in his or her right minds says, "I'm making bog standard apartments like you see in every other place in America where the housing stock on average 80 years old." But it sure looks like that's what they are doing.

I don't see this as creating a surplus even if the population of the city doesn't increase. Because buildings get old, you have to built a certain number of new units just to stay in place and Pittsburgh has not done that for decades.

[BigPizzaHutFan]

Why is it luxury? Because it's expensive.

Why is it expensive? Because it's luxury.

[PghYinzer]

Originally Posted by lettert

I agree with you and it is pretty disappointing. I predict a surplus of luxury housing without the high paying jobs to fill them, and a migration to the high end housing from the places such as Lawrenceville, Shadyside, etc. People will then move from the blighted areas and fill these areas, leading to further degradation of the bad areas.

I dont see many people leaving either Lawrenceville or Shadyside to go live in a new apt building somewhere. The lifestyles are completely different. People move to Lawrenceville to live in historic houses or new condo conversions and enjoy the offerings of the neighborhood. A new apartment will not provide them with that lifestyle.

Also, the forethought and financial underwriting that goes into even beginning to build one of these new housing developments proves that there must enough "high paying" jobs to fill the units, or the project would never even get off the ground. It's strange, I know no one that really is struggling to get a good paying job in Pgh. I know that I work/live in different circles than many, but almost everyone I know would be able to afford these places. Keep in mind I do understand that there is much poverty in this city, but there are good jobs in this city, and not everyone is barely getting by.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by PghYinzer

I dont see many people leaving either Lawrenceville or Shadyside to go live in a new apt building somewhere. The lifestyles are completely different. People move to Lawrenceville to live in historic houses or new condo conversions and enjoy the offerings of the neighborhood. A new apartment will not provide them with that lifestyle.

Also, the forethought and financial underwriting that goes into even beginning to build one of these new housing developments proves that there must enough "high paying" jobs to fill the units, or the project would never even get off the ground. It's strange, I know no one that really is struggling to get a good paying job in Pgh. I know that I work/live in different circles than many, but almost everyone I know would be able to afford these places. Keep in mind I do understand that there is much poverty in this city, but there are good jobs in this city, and not everyone is barely getting by.

In addition to this, it should be noted we have an example of an upscale neighborhood where the rental options have depreciated in desirability over the last 10 years substantially due to newer units coming online elsewhere. That neighborhood is Squirrel Hill. It's still plenty desirable, it's just not somewhere young professionals choose to live unless they are buying a home - the renters are mostly students who don't care if they are living in dated, and sometimes grungy, apartments.

Thus I think even if by some chance new development in places closer to Downtown does chill the market in say Lawrenceville, the result would merely be more students in the neighborhood, and less yuppies. It certainly wouldn't be a turn to the ghetto - there's nowhere in the country where gentrification has "failed" once it reached a certain organic threshold, because the neighborhood amenities which have built up over time can't evaporate overnight, and are most likely to simply morph as time goes on.

[Moby Hick]

Originally Posted by eschaton

In addition to this, it should be noted we have an example of an upscale neighborhood where the rental options have depreciated in desirability over the last 10 years substantially due to newer units coming online elsewhere. That neighborhood is Squirrel Hill.

I don't know that they apartments are less desirable. Rents in my area have also gone up over that period, by a very large amount in the case of a couple of neighbors (who were moving out) that I talked to. That's what happens when you get the banks collapsing just as your region need to invest in more housing.

I'm hoping more apartments coming on line will cut that rents people are getting in Squirrel Hill. I don't want the prices a landlord is willing to pay for house in the area to start to equal what an owner-occupier might pay.